Phosphate over 0.58 in a well established tank

[Cory]

If it ain't broke don't try to fix it. That tank looks awesome. If mine looked that good I wouldn't even be testing lol.

The problem is it was never that high. And the system worked before it was this high. There is reason to lower it imo.

 

[Cory]

My main thought is the tank looks great and I would keep doing what you are doing. That's definetely higher than most of us shoot for and by a lot. On the other hand it is much lower than many successful tanks. If it working for u I don't see why I would change.

If something is rusting slowly it may still provide support until its too late, in which it fails. Phosphate is fine for a while until its too late.

 

[exnisstech]

If something is rusting slowly it may still provide support until its too late, in which it fails. Phosphate is fine for a while until its too late.

I have to say it's hard to argue with that logic

 

[las]

The problem is it was never that high. And the system worked before it was this high. There is reason to lower it imo.

Ok- you know your system better than anyone. The only thing I can add from experience is that if it were me, I would lower it only as fast as it took to get to that level. So, you’ll be giving your animals a chance to adapt to it, instead of being shocked. Trust me, it happened to me.

 

[mdb_talon]

If something is rusting slowly it may still provide support until its too late, in which it fails. Phosphate is fine for a while until its too late.

So curious what bad things you expect to happen? There are many examples of long running amazing tasks with high phosphate levels

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Hey everyone
I have a mixed reef tank over 1.3 years old and everything looks happy and healthy.

for the couple last months I’m getting really high phosphate levels

Just wondering what can be the cause?

• 85 gallon tank with low live stock and plenty of corals

• Indonesian rocks 1.3 years old

• nyos 120 skimmer
• 2 mp10, 1 mp40
•Vectra M2
•2 4” inch filter sock filtration
• 55W troptronic UVC

I feed the tank daily with 2 cubes of mysis and artemia and once a week with Reef energy and reef roids.

I water change 12% each week.


Id love to hear your thoughts.

Why, oh why, do people still chase numbers when they have gorgeous healthy tanks??

 

[Miami Reef]

Why, oh why, do people still chase numbers when they have gorgeous healthy tanks??

We all chase numbers to a certain extent. If not, why not put corals in 1.018 sg (salinity)? Or why not let alkalinity drop to 4dkh, or rise higher than 12dkh?

We all have different goal parameters. Responsibly targeting parameters in optimal ranges is fine IMO.

 

[vetteguy53081]

We all chase numbers to a certain extent. If not, why not put corals in 1.018 sg (salinity)? Or why not let alkalinity drop to 4dkh, or rise higher than 12dkh?

We all have different goal parameters. Responsibly targeting parameters in optimal ranges is fine IMO.

Fish in 1.018 is fine short term but NOT coral. You cant place coral in hyposalinity

 

[Miami Reef]

Fish in 1.018 is fine short term but NOT coral. You cant place coral in hyposalinity

Exactly. The dose makes the poison.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

We all chase numbers to a certain extent. If not, why not put corals in 1.018 sg (salinity)? Or why not let alkalinity drop to 4dkh, or rise higher than 12dkh?

We all have different goal parameters. Responsibly targeting parameters in optimal ranges is fine IMO.

You're stretching quite a bit comparing salinity to phosphates... I don't consider it "chasing" salinity when I ensure that it's near 1.026 by using an ATO. (I also think you're being disingenuous with the low alk level you mentioned, but some keep things at 12 and do fine).

My point is (and has been), MANY healthy, thriving tanks are kept with nitrate and phosphate at levels much higher that what you believe are "optimal" ranges.

Who's to say that phosphate of 0.6 isn't the optimal level for the OP's tank? If it's doing well, then changing something *just because* the level isn't what others use is not always the responsible thing to do, IMO...

 

[Miami Reef]

Sounds good.

 

[Cory]

So curious what bad things you expect to happen? There are many examples of long running amazing tasks with high phosphate levels

I expect coral to die. Many scientific literature explain what happens to stony corals when exposed to high po4 for too long. Its called eutrophication. There are also many expert reefers like glenn f on here will tell you the same high po4 gets tissue necrosis as well as ultra low. Its food to sps but also a poison to building its skeleton. A sort of double edged sword. But high po4 may be fine for one tank but not for others. Such things like nearby algae growth can be fatal to corals, especially with high po4 and no predators to eat it.

 

[Thales]

I expect coral to die. Many scientific literature explain what happens to stony corals when exposed to high po4 for too long.

What scientific literature? Thanks.

 

[Miami Reef]

What scientific literature? Thanks.

Do you have any evidence that higher phosphates (above 0.5ppm) improves growth and coloration? I’ve always heard the reverse to be more true for calcifying corals.

 

[shootingstar_reef]

High phosphate by itself I don't think will kill stony corals? In one of the attached papers the skeleton becomes less dense. In the other they look at physical characteristics. These are only from a cursory search as I wanted to see for myself if there was anything relevant to the specific question at hand.

 

[killer2001]

I would just carbon dose and bring down the PO4 slowly over time. All while watching NO3 making sure it doesn't bottom out. Do nothing else different.

 

[reeftankdude]

I‘d use a very small amount of GFO and replace every few days until you reached your desired level.

I would not use phosguard.

What is the problem with phosguard? Thanks

 

[Pistondog]

Carbon dose and/or gfo and stop the reef roids, mostly phosphate.

 

[mdb_talon]

I expect coral to die. Many scientific literature explain what happens to stony corals when exposed to high po4 for too long. Its called eutrophication. There are also many expert reefers like glenn f on here will tell you the same high po4 gets tissue necrosis as well as ultra low. Its food to sps but also a poison to building its skeleton. A sort of double edged sword. But high po4 may be fine for one tank but not for others. Such things like nearby algae growth can be fatal to corals, especially with high po4 and no predators to eat it.

Eutrophication is not what happens to the stony coral directly but rather the reef and is the growth of nuisance algae. It's not something that is fine for a long time and the next day your sps all dies. It's not at all some hidden danger you don't see coming. There is some indication that higher phosphate levels can lead to faster sps growth and at too high of growth brittle skeletons. Not suggesting there is no possible negative impact. However I think we can also see countless of examples where trying to fix a problem that may or may not be a problem actually creates a bigger problem.....which is my concern with "fixing" what looks like a fantastic tank just because phosphates are higher than the numbers are hobby decided today were ideal for a reef in a box. 10 years ago those "ideal" numbers for phosphate were undetectable. Then it was .03. More recently there is much greater acceptance(and a lot of success) at numbers significantly higher than this.

 

[Thales]

Do you have any evidence that higher phosphates (above 0.5ppm) improves growth and coloration? I’ve always heard the reverse to be more true for calcifying corals.

I am not sure I follow.