Phosphate RX (or similar products) vs. GFO

[Alexander1312]

For weeks I have been trying to lower my phosphates, and it is unclear to me why I had not been successful.

I currently have 0.34 ppm phosphate (Hanna ULR) / Nitrate 10.8 (Hanna). I would like to get to 0.05-0.1, but not much lower than that, since I had previously dinos due to 0/0 parameters, and resolving this had been very painful, to say the least (but also lots of learnings ...). These phosphate levels have been at that level since April.

I like my tank and coral growth etc, but green hair algae have become an issue, which I am spot-treating with 2ml of Hydrogen Peroxide almost every day (26-gallon tank).

I am currently doing the following:
- 8 Tablespoon high capacity GFO from BRS exchanged every two weeks. This is in my nano sump in the return pump area (no other space for this).
- 25 ml PNS Pro Bio two days per week (I understand this is more for Nitrate, but was hoping for some impact on phosphate too).
- 6 days frozen food / 1-day dry food weekly.
- 20 ml live phyto 5 days per week (Dinkins).
- change filter floss every three days.
- 20-25% water change every two weeks.

I have a (very) large amount and diverse clean-up crew and have started manually removing the long green hair algae pieces, but I do not believe this is on a good path and the CUC seems overwhelmed.

Therefore, I wanted to try Phosphate RX which appears easy to dose, and I am planning to be very risk-averse to the amount of dosing in the beginning and take my time with reducing it.

I do sense there is a view in this forum that GFO is preferred, given it is considered less aggressive. Any recommendations or alternative considerations before I start using this product?

 

[blaxsun]

I like Nyos Phosi-Ex for my media/reactor and I've used TLF Phosban-L with great success for spot reductions.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

For weeks I have been trying to lower my phosphates, and it is unclear to me why I had not been successful.

I currently have 0.34 ppm phosphate (Hanna ULR) / Nitrate 10.8 (Hanna). I would like to get to 0.05-0.1, but not much lower than that, since I had previously dinos due to 0/0 parameters, and resolving this had been very painful, to say the least (but also lots of learnings ...). These phosphate levels have been at that level since April.

I like my tank and coral growth etc, but green hair algae have become an issue, which I am spot-treating with 2ml of Hydrogen Peroxide almost every day (26-gallon tank).

I am currently doing the following:
- 8 Tablespoon high capacity GFO from BRS exchanged every two weeks. This is in my nano sump in the return pump area (no other space for this).
- 25 ml PNS Pro Bio two days per week (I understand this is more for Nitrate, but was hoping for some impact on phosphate too).
- 6 days frozen food / 1-day dry food weekly.
- 20 ml live phyto 5 days per week (Dinkins).
- change filter floss every three days.
- 20-25% water change every two weeks.

I have a (very) large amount and diverse clean-up crew and have started manually removing the long green hair algae pieces, but I do not believe this is on a good path and the CUC seems overwhelmed.

Therefore, I wanted to try Phosphate RX which appears easy to dose, and I am planning to be very risk-averse to the amount of dosing in the beginning and take my time with reducing it.

I do sense there is a view in this forum that GFO is preferred, given it is considered less aggressive. Any recommendations or alternative considerations before I start using this product?

You can go diy lanthanum, if you like.

DIY Lanthanum Dosing

Someone asked for a DIY lanthanum dosing recipe. Be sure you understand that some folks have issues with fish (especially tangs) before embarking on lanthanum dosing. it is also preferable to catch as many of the solids that precipitate out as you can, so dosing before some sort of...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Alexander1312]

I like Nyos Phosi-Ex for my media/reactor and I've used TLF Phosban-L with great success for spot reductions.

Thank you. I do actually have Phosban L, but their instructions similar to Phpsphate E which I also have, confuse me. It seems as if the amounts are too little for Nano tanks or the error rate could be high if miscalculated.

 

[blaxsun]

Thank you. I do actually have Phosban L, but their instructions similar to Phpsphate E which I also have, confuse me. It seems as if the amounts are too little for Nano tanks or the error rate could be high if miscalculated.

Remember to dilute with PhosBan-L, and start with 1/4 of the calculated/recommended dose...

 

[Salty_Northerner]

I'm not sure if this would be of any help but I was/am dosing bactor7 when I started to see my sand bed start to go ugly. I have zero po4 and been using TM plus NP and it's been working great. The bactor7 did the clean up of the sand for me thankfully.

Have you tried this from Tropic Marin? It'll lower your nitrates and phosphates.

 

[Alexander1312]

Remember to dilute with PhosBan-L, and start with 1/4 of the calculated/recommended dose...

Thank you for the advice. Still, hard to calculate.

1. 100 ml Phosban will go into 200ml RODI
2. 5 ml of this diluted solution will drop phosphate by 1 ppm in 20 gallons - which is the amount I have.
3. So if I want a drop by 0.25 ppm, I would need to add 1.25 ml of the diluted solution.

Does this appear to be correct?

And I can just drop this into the sump?

 

[blaxsun]

Thank you for the advice. Still, hard to calculate.

1. 100 ml Phosban will go into 200ml RODI
2. 5 ml of this diluted solution will drop phosphate by 1 ppm in 20 gallons - which is the amount I have.
3. So if I want a drop by 0.25 ppm, I would need to add 1.25 ml of the diluted solution.

Does this appear to be correct?

And I can just drop this into the sump?

It's been a while since I used PhosBan-L, but just follow the dilution/dose instructions and start with a lot less than you initially calculated.

Double-check where they recommend placing it; I seem to recall directly into filter socks but I may be thinking of another product.

 

[00W]

Absolutely no professional here but I battled over. 54 phosphate in a very mature tank for years. I really hate adding anything to my tank, and, honestly it all confuses me.
Thought gfo was a good option I could figure out.
I tried rowa, brs and a couple other name brands.
Finally bought a brs reactor and loaded it with 4x from me coral and got mine down to. 03 in three months where it has stayed static for 2 months.
I was pretty surprised and stoked.
My tank was pretty bad honestly.
I'm glad I made the investment and my livestock is as well.
Have no idea if this will help you at all, just wanted to let you know my experience.

 

[Alexander1312]

Thank you for the advice. Still, hard to calculate.

1. 100 ml Phosban will go into 200ml RODI
2. 5 ml of this diluted solution will drop phosphate by 1 ppm in 20 gallons - which is the amount I have.
3. So if I want a drop by 0.25 ppm, I would need to add 1.25 ml of the diluted solution.

Does this appear to be correct?

And I can just drop this into the sump?

Update to this:

- I have further diluted this to 100ml Phosban and 500ml RODI (yes, I should have done 10/50…)
- I extracted 1.25 ml solution from this 600 ml diluted solution.
- I have added a few drops of this solution into the filter floss over the past two days, leaving approximately 50% of the 1.25 ml.

As of today, Phosphate dropped from 0.31 to 0.21, which I consider a success since I have been trying to lower Phosphate for months with GFO (in vain).

I will add the remaining amount over the next two days and measure again, hoping to reach 0.1 or slightly lower.

One question: Can I store the larger diluted solution or will this need to be used up quickly?

 

[Treefer32]

I've used Phosphate e to maintain phosphates on my 340 gallon display. I finally got nitrates down to under 10 (7.6 last test). Phosphates hitting as High as .35. I only feed frozen food. But, with 20 large fish, they poop a lot and create a lot of waste. I have to feed around 10-13 cubes a day just to keep them from killing each other (due to perceived lack of food availability.)

I haven't tried GFO because well, it's just too expensive and impractical to maintain in a large tank. Lanthinum is the cheapest solution. I dose around 5-10 ml around 3 times a week and that maintains my phosphates between .15 and .20.

I had the same bottle of phosphate E for a couple years, (didn't use as much as I should have) and it's still just as potent. I don't see why you couldn't keep your solution around indefinitely.

I would continue dosing into your filter socks. The precipitation can be dangerous to fish. I've not had issues over the years, but, some examples out there are enough to not want to take the risk. I run a skimmer, reefmat, and algae turf scrubber and still have issues with phosphates. That said, I have no issues at all with hair algae! One thing I'm thankful for.

I hope you get yours under control!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

.

One question: Can I store the larger diluted solution or will this need to be used up quickly?

Lanthanum solutions do not go bad over time.

 

[Wildreefs]

Lanthanum solutions do not go bad over time.

If you mix up say 80 drops in 1000 ml of water, and dose from that with dosing pump, does it stay in equal suspension, or does the lananthum fall to the bottom and you dose water until you get near the bottom of the container?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

If you mix up say 80 drops in 1000 ml of water, and dose from that with dosing pump, does it stay in equal suspension, or does the lananthum fall to the bottom and you dose water until you get near the bottom of the container?

ANY mixed solution that is clear will not separate into more ions at the bottom and fewer at the top. They stay fully mixed on their own.

 

[Wildreefs]

ANY mixed solution that is clear will not separate into more ions at the bottom and fewer at the top. They stay fully mixed on their own.

Ok so taking 1000 ml of ro water, adding in say 80 drops of phosphate rx, shaking it up a few times on first day, will be just as mixed on day 1 as it is on day 30, with no periodic shaking or mixing action, just sitting still?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Ok so taking 1000 ml of ro water, adding in say 80 drops of phosphate rx, shaking it up a few times on first day, will be just as mixed on day 1 as it is on day 30, with no periodic shaking or mixing action, just sitting still?

Correct.

 

[Wildreefs]

Correct.

Thank you. If possible, see my thread I just started an hour ago in regards to vodka not working .

Thanks

 

[pixelhustler]

Update to this:

- I have further diluted this to 100ml Phosban and 500ml RODI (yes, I should have done 10/50…)
- I extracted 1.25 ml solution from this 600 ml diluted solution.
- I have added a few drops of this solution into the filter floss over the past two days, leaving approximately 50% of the 1.25 ml.

As of today, Phosphate dropped from 0.31 to 0.21, which I consider a success since I have been trying to lower Phosphate for months with GFO (in vain).

I will add the remaining amount over the next two days and measure again, hoping to reach 0.1 or slightly lower.

One question: Can I store the larger diluted solution or will this need to be used up quickly?

If your phosphate has been above .2-.3 for a while and you want to bring it down significantly (.05-.1) I recommend an accurate dosing pump and dose from your solution as many times per day as the pump will allow.

I’m saying this because I had high phosphates for a while and it will take a long time to remove phosphate bound to your sand and live rocks. I used a Kamoer pump and dosed hourly from a solution of lanthanum (Seaklear). It took months and a whole bottle of Seaklear to bring it down and be able to keep it down. Automating it and slowly bring the dose up, and then slowly bring the dose down saved me a lot of time and my corals didn’t get upset by large fluctuations.

 

[ocncheffy]

Is there any worry about residual lanthium remaining in the water column? I dosed it to lower my phosphates successfully into my skimmer, but it seems like a lot remains left behind according to ICP. I've seen no ill effects of this to my corals or fish.

 

[X-37B]

I use phosgaurd when needed in my 20g nano. It works well and does not have the gfo mess.
1 tablespoon will get po4 to zero, in my system, so start with less and monitor po4 level.