gettaReef
Valuable Member
Wow, thank you for taking the time to come up with and share the calculator/spreadsheet! It is super helpful, and it's great that you included the various types of nitrate that people use to dose
Awesome!
Potassium nitrate (Spectracide stump remover) dosing steps
- Thread starter twilliard
- Start date
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Wow, thank you for taking the time to come up with and share the calculator/spreadsheet! It is super helpful, and it's great that you included the various types of nitrate that people use to dose
Awesome!
Browner20
Active Member
So, I have completely failed this test as I have not had time to get back on program. However, big time however, all of my struggling SPS are on the mend and growing again! I did another 3mls of stump a week ago just to keep things going - I know, I know I am playing with fire without testing but I have three little kids, a home, a wife, a job, etc...
I do maintain my constant observations, here is what I can tell you:
Fish/inverts: could not be better, all fish are fat as cows (except my yellow tang who is anorexic - need to start a separate post about this issue)
Algae/bacteria: I have noticed a bloom of cyano in two specific parts of my sand bed and on many tiny other parts throughout the tank. I never worry about cyano as it always comes and goes in my tank. I have not had it in years though so have to attribute it to the addition of nitrate. Again not worried about it but just wanted to note it. Also, did have some very tiny blooms of diatoms but very small and short lived, again nothing of real substance. What I have noticed is some other types of algae, not sure how to describe but seem to be some sort of turf algae. What is very interesting is that I battled, and I mean battled, dinos to the point that I pulled every piece of live rock out of the tank and dipped it in hydrogen peroxide solution about 6 months ago before the addition of the new frags. Some of the dinos still remained and at the time my nitrates and phosphates were not detectable. The dinos that were still around were limited to a few spots and not thriving but now that this turf algae has started to take hold - sides of tank, on the gyre, on the returns but not on the rock/corals - the dinos have disappeared?
@twilliard I know you are passionate about both of these subjects so maybe you can validate/challenge some of this information?
LPS: Only have a frogspawn and it is about the same as it always is, size of a golf ball and happy but not growing significantly.
Softies: Handful of polyps/zoas and mushrooms scattered throughout the tank. The growth of these have significantly challenged by my low nutrient environment in years past. They seem to be perking up now with the addition of some nitrate. Not by any means spreading out and growing but very happy, which is fine by me as I have the SPS bug.
SPS: As I mentioned, I lost my Sunset mili and was close to losing several other frags. All of my near casualties have made resounding comebacks both in color and growth! PE is amazing and all signs of STN are gone. Interestingly, my near casualties mentioned before did not include my purple bonsai but it has recently showed some STN near the base and a significant thinning of tissue to the point where it is just a mild violet color with no green polyps? I moved it from the upper third of the tank to the bottom and it seems to be readjusting? Weird? Montis are thriving.
I do maintain my constant observations, here is what I can tell you:
Fish/inverts: could not be better, all fish are fat as cows (except my yellow tang who is anorexic - need to start a separate post about this issue)
Algae/bacteria: I have noticed a bloom of cyano in two specific parts of my sand bed and on many tiny other parts throughout the tank. I never worry about cyano as it always comes and goes in my tank. I have not had it in years though so have to attribute it to the addition of nitrate. Again not worried about it but just wanted to note it. Also, did have some very tiny blooms of diatoms but very small and short lived, again nothing of real substance. What I have noticed is some other types of algae, not sure how to describe but seem to be some sort of turf algae. What is very interesting is that I battled, and I mean battled, dinos to the point that I pulled every piece of live rock out of the tank and dipped it in hydrogen peroxide solution about 6 months ago before the addition of the new frags. Some of the dinos still remained and at the time my nitrates and phosphates were not detectable. The dinos that were still around were limited to a few spots and not thriving but now that this turf algae has started to take hold - sides of tank, on the gyre, on the returns but not on the rock/corals - the dinos have disappeared?
@twilliard I know you are passionate about both of these subjects so maybe you can validate/challenge some of this information?
LPS: Only have a frogspawn and it is about the same as it always is, size of a golf ball and happy but not growing significantly.
Softies: Handful of polyps/zoas and mushrooms scattered throughout the tank. The growth of these have significantly challenged by my low nutrient environment in years past. They seem to be perking up now with the addition of some nitrate. Not by any means spreading out and growing but very happy, which is fine by me as I have the SPS bug.
SPS: As I mentioned, I lost my Sunset mili and was close to losing several other frags. All of my near casualties have made resounding comebacks both in color and growth! PE is amazing and all signs of STN are gone. Interestingly, my near casualties mentioned before did not include my purple bonsai but it has recently showed some STN near the base and a significant thinning of tissue to the point where it is just a mild violet color with no green polyps? I moved it from the upper third of the tank to the bottom and it seems to be readjusting? Weird? Montis are thriving.
OP
OP
twilliard
Tank pests..
Yes biodiversity I do believe attributes to the reduction of dinoflagellates I would still maintain proper removal of any areas that can be siphoned.
When it comes to the cyanobacteria if it is spirulina then you are on the right course as it is benificial part of our ecosystem unless it becomes a problem.
I have not witnessed cyanobacteria blooms with my work in no3 however.
When it comes to the cyanobacteria if it is spirulina then you are on the right course as it is benificial part of our ecosystem unless it becomes a problem.
I have not witnessed cyanobacteria blooms with my work in no3 however.
Browner20
Active Member
Yes, I think it is a combination of factors with the cyano. Both areas are "collection" zones where stuff settles when the gyre is cycled off. Combination of nutrients coming up from below and added nutrients to the tank and voila, cyano food.
Browner20
Active Member
I am glad you also used the term I was looking for Biodiversity! The guy who I bought the frags from had a lot of algae in his tank and told me he took his GFO and refugium offline many years ago but his SPS were thriving. I always thought from my previous experience in reefing 15+ years ago was that anything besides coraline and SPS was bad.
mcarroll
10K Club member
I picked up a bottle of stump remover yesterday....waiting on the nitrate test kit (salifert..hopefully ok) and phosphate reagents to ship...should be here at the end of the week!
I really hope this makes my maybe-diatoms/maybe-dinos go away!
I am starting to think about swapping out a few pieces of live rock for something fresh too. Maybe adding some pods as well, but not sure how cost effect one is vs the other. (I have rock I can trade.)
This crud took over when the tank's s.g. got up to 1.030 due to regular two-part additions with no water changes. I worry that may have put a chink in my ecosystem and that nutrients aren't the source of the problem.
For posterity, would you be willing to update your first post with the size of your plastic cup? (I'm shooting for the same concentration as you but I have an assortment of clear plastic cups!
)
Do you guys do similar amounts of water changes? If not, that could be all the difference....with my guess being that Russ changes more water.
I think the calcium component of DIY two-part is also known to carry significant K. Anyone doing DIY vs commercial mixes?
I really hope this makes my maybe-diatoms/maybe-dinos go away!
I am starting to think about swapping out a few pieces of live rock for something fresh too. Maybe adding some pods as well, but not sure how cost effect one is vs the other. (I have rock I can trade.)
This crud took over when the tank's s.g. got up to 1.030 due to regular two-part additions with no water changes. I worry that may have put a chink in my ecosystem and that nutrients aren't the source of the problem.
For posterity, would you be willing to update your first post with the size of your plastic cup? (I'm shooting for the same concentration as you but I have an assortment of clear plastic cups!
)Do you guys do similar amounts of water changes? If not, that could be all the difference....with my guess being that Russ changes more water.
I think the calcium component of DIY two-part is also known to carry significant K. Anyone doing DIY vs commercial mixes?
The Potassium ratio of the KNO3 molecule is approximately 1 to 2 i.e. for every 2 ppm nitrate you raise your potassium by 1. Now, for the levels we're talking and dosing, you realize it would take quite a bit to raise the potassium by a noticable level so I don't think I worry about that especially with regular water changes.
Also, on your amount/cup dilution, I'm not sure if you saw but I put together a spreadsheet that calculates everything you need for dilutions and after that with how much of your concoction how much should you expect your nitrate to raise. In my case it was spot on.
Also, on your amount/cup dilution, I'm not sure if you saw but I put together a spreadsheet that calculates everything you need for dilutions and after that with how much of your concoction how much should you expect your nitrate to raise. In my case it was spot on.
Yah sorry r2r wouldn't allow me to upload xls file. I have been wanting to make a Google docs version just haven't gotten to it yet...Sweet! But dang it's zipped...can't open on mobile. Thanks for the link for later tho!!!
mcarroll
10K Club member
Nice!
Mine is a 100 gallon system with three tiny fish, a mess of corals and a small phosphate problem after a considerable time without a water change regime. Corals are healthy and growing in both tanks of the system. Unfortunately so are these "encrusting diatoms" or whatever they are.
It appears that I'll be dosing the tank with 30 mL of the standard KNO3 solution (20g / L) in the spreadsheet to make the system hit 1 ppm nitrate.
There are still a few days before the test kit and reagents get here. Anyone think dosing this rate (1 ppm) once per day for the three days until the test kits get here would be too crazy? Seems like it should be safe.
Mine is a 100 gallon system with three tiny fish, a mess of corals and a small phosphate problem after a considerable time without a water change regime. Corals are healthy and growing in both tanks of the system. Unfortunately so are these "encrusting diatoms" or whatever they are.
It appears that I'll be dosing the tank with 30 mL of the standard KNO3 solution (20g / L) in the spreadsheet to make the system hit 1 ppm nitrate.
There are still a few days before the test kit and reagents get here. Anyone think dosing this rate (1 ppm) once per day for the three days until the test kits get here would be too crazy? Seems like it should be safe.
I would wait until you have the test. What i did was dose enough for about 0.5ppm and then after an hour i tested and saw that. Once that happened i felt comfortable in my math, my solution and my dosing and the next day i took it to 1. I did it that way so i can gain confidence. I know it's tempting to start (and i think in my mind the predictions of the sheet will come through) but a little more patience would give you more confidence... If there's anything weird or out of whack you'll catch it early [emoji6]
Forgot to mention that the consumption of the system didn't immediately kick in i.e. it took a few days before the numbers dropped a little over the day. So you'll definitely need the tests to gain this insight as well. With this kind of dosing it's all about staying in tune with your reef...
PS: do you know your current nitrate level? Are you sure it's low and needs boosting? I might have missed that...
PS: do you know your current nitrate level? Are you sure it's low and needs boosting? I might have missed that...
mcarroll
10K Club member
@morpheas
- 1-2 mL of R.O.E, fed three to five times per week in well-functioning 100 gallon stony coral system cannot equal a Nitrate problem...or Nitrates at all. But I have confirmed once in a while with a quality dip test...they don't pick any nitrates up.
- I did recently test phosphates on a hanna HI713 and they registered .2 ppm.
- There has never been a green algae outbreak of any kind, but once in a great while a cyano outbreak...and I can never fully get rid of one really thick-growing type of cyano.
- Not to mention the encrusting diatom/dino's that I'd like to knock back presently.
- For the vast bulk of the system's ~8 years, it's been practically self-balancing with respect to the various bubble and hair algaes that would show up....for example, I had one green bubble grow to the size of a quarter, but never had an dominating outbreak of bubble algae, or any of them...I actually like algae....but I always did regular weekly water changes.
- For the last three years or so, that's effectively down to zero water changes....which led to the water's s.g. getting up to 1.030....which is when this encrusting diatom/dino took over.
- I have taken corrective actions on the s.g. and performed a series of water changes, as well as H2O2 treatment, but manual removal has been the only effective tool so far.
- I do still see amphipods, but no mysids and I think fewer copepods than what I remember from "before". I suspect the s.g. spike may have done some permanent ecosystem damage. Have considered trading some of my live rock for fresh, as well as copepod treatments...not sure about cost effectiveness.
- Come to think of it, I do have a Prodibio BioDigest in the closet I was saving/forgot about. I haven't had much luck with this in algae outbreak situations on other tanks, but this isn't very similar to those tanks in any way. And I already have it. I may try it somewhere along the line here.
Understood. You're the only one that has the full history of your tank, understands it and is in full tune with it. And regardless, no matter what the tests say, you're going to have to develop a feel of how your reef does on KNO3 (or anything else for that matter). I would feel safe dosing the 1ppm per day as you suggested above (I don't see it causing a huge problem just like you said above) but probably safer doing so with a test at hand (maybe that's the control freak in me speaking haha).
On the S.G., I don't believe it could be permanent, maybe it needs some time to revive anything that has suffered? How long ago did you correct it?
On the S.G., I don't believe it could be permanent, maybe it needs some time to revive anything that has suffered? How long ago did you correct it?
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