Yes. They will drain to the lowest level.
Return line check valve?
- Thread starter winland
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No place to drill holes in the return line...
Looking at these pix it is hard to understand what you mean by outside drains. If there is an overflow box, the water will drain until it no longer goes over the overflow edge, in to the overflow. The 3" below water will drain until water is just below the bottom of the inlet.
I do not believe I said "outside drains".
I referred to the "outside returns"
#1 & #2 are the outside returns. #3 is the center return
There is no overflow box.
Ahhhhh outside to the center :nerd:. It will drain to the bottom of the lowest drain.
OP
OP
winland
New Member
OK, so now I know that I will have 6" x 72" x 30" / 231 = 56 gallons of water flowing into my 45g sump during a power outage. Without installing a 100g sump/refugium, which I can not do, what are the suggestions/recommendations to prevent this potential flood?
The return line is 1" pvc and I will be using a mag 18 or mag 24 as my return pump.
This is what I have available to use.
Do I put in a high/large plumbing trap on the return line that goes above the water line?
Will this cut down on my return flow significantly?
The return line is 1" pvc and I will be using a mag 18 or mag 24 as my return pump.
This is what I have available to use.
Do I put in a high/large plumbing trap on the return line that goes above the water line?
Will this cut down on my return flow significantly?
Viva'sReef
Valuable Member
Its not the drains that are the issue, its the Return lines. Marked #1, 2, and 3. It will drain to the numbers 1, and 2. Like another person mentioned use some plumbing and and a 90 elbow facing up kind of like your outer drain lines. Then add some lockline to aim them back out or where ever, as long as you dont put them low again. Leave the lockline outlet around the top of the water line.
Good catch I thought 1,2 and 3 were drains. Those are in the upper corners.
Viva'sReef
Valuable Member
Or hold on....why not make numbers 1, and 2 the Drains, and elbow them up higher?? And make the current drains, and center return, all returns???
I think that is what I would do too, make the upper drains (using reducers) returns as well as #3 and 1 & 2 drains to the sump/fuge.
Regardless if they are overflows or returns, its still going to siphon to the lowest bulkhead in the tank. One would siphon back through the return pump turning the impeller backwards the other would siphon back down the overflows.
I would either do as I suggested earlier, plumb them with elbows to extend them up to the surface, or plug them entirely and use an up and over the back return system. Another option would be to use one of them as a closed loop suction and the other two as the returns or plug two and do another up and over for the closed loop return. Closed loops can be below the surface since they are closed and not exposed to atmosphere, ie dumping into a sump.
I would either do as I suggested earlier, plumb them with elbows to extend them up to the surface, or plug them entirely and use an up and over the back return system. Another option would be to use one of them as a closed loop suction and the other two as the returns or plug two and do another up and over for the closed loop return. Closed loops can be below the surface since they are closed and not exposed to atmosphere, ie dumping into a sump.
OP
OP
winland
New Member
First, thanks to all for your help and insight in dealing with my return plumbing problems.
As most have suggested, I have decided against the check valve idea. I will probably add a few extra feet to my return line. Bring the return up from the sump to about the height of the display tank water level and then add a few elbows to bring it back down to the existing 3 return bulkheads. This seems to be the most effective and safe way to do it.
Thanks again.
As most have suggested, I have decided against the check valve idea. I will probably add a few extra feet to my return line. Bring the return up from the sump to about the height of the display tank water level and then add a few elbows to bring it back down to the existing 3 return bulkheads. This seems to be the most effective and safe way to do it.
Thanks again.
I hope I can explain this easy enough.
The return plumbing MUST rise above the water level before it drops down to the bulkheads on order to work.
You can do the syphon break one of two ways, you can cap the end of the line and glue a length of acrylic tubing into it, or you can put a theaded adapter onto the end of it, then fit it with a small barbed fitting and mount some tubing onto the barb. Either way, you want the end of the syphon break to be just under the water level of the tank and I would suggest making some kid of snail guard. If you put it just above the water level you won't have any problems with a snail or anything blocking it, but the splashing might be a little loud and there might be a problem with salt creep. If you go the barbed route, you could put a TEE in the line and have two entrance points for the air should a snail or something cover one. I have it marked as rigid airline in the diagram, it might have to be a bit larger for your setup.
When the pump shuts off and the water level drops below the level of the end of the syphon break tube, it will suck air. Seeing as your returns are above this level the air should fill the return lines and break the water flow.
If you need more help understanding this, let me know and I'll try to explain it better.
Sorry for the quick sketch, I don't feel like playing with any of my design programs, it takes quite a while to draw this using them.
Not a problem. Just remember if you go this route, you need the line that will be your syphon break to be large enough for air to enter fast enough to break the syphon of the water. I think for this reason, the threaded adapter and barb fitting is the way to go. This way if air is'nt entering fast enough you can just go with larger Barbed fitting.
Would one more return outlet at the suface of the water be out of the question on your setup? I have an even better idea if it's not a problem.
Would one more return outlet at the suface of the water be out of the question on your setup? I have an even better idea if it's not a problem.
Make darn sure you keep the air inlet clean too, thats a point of failure if you do not maintain it. I think internal elbows are much safer since you expose the entire return to atmosphere for a more posiive air gap. Fewer fittings and nothing to maintain, you can even plumb it in black PVC and LocLine so it won't be very noticable.
My other design will pretty much cure the line being blocked, I just need to know if he minds one more outlet.
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