Sick Coral Help and Nitrate Management

[Screwgunner]

+ 1 on keeping your filter clean. Not your lights

 

[ariellemermaid]

+ 1 on keeping your filter clean. Not your lights

Yeah looking at it again today I think I was imagining it was looking better after turning the lights down.

I watched a video last night suggesting canisters should be cleaned as often as every other day and at least every week. One issue is I have a bunch of large copepods living in there and so it’s a challenge to clean without massacring them.

That said, if the consensus is that my problem isn’t nitrates and all other parameters are reasonable, then I’m still at a loss to explain my problems. I get the folks saying it’s probably the big water changes/stability, but remember the coral has thrived and grown in QT with weekly 25-50% changes (mostly 50%). It’s just this darn tank that kills corals.

It looks like I could add a siphon overflow and small sump for about $500 so I’m considering that in terms of the nitrate issues. I only have cabinet space for about a 12 gallon sump though (37 gallon tank). Unless I did some kind of split 2 sump situation (the cabinet is divided in the middle).

 

[Screwgunner]

You do not need a sump for a reactor . If your problem is nitrates bio pellet would work or you could read up on carbon dosing . Vodka sugger

 

[ariellemermaid]

You do not need a sump for a reactor . If your problem is nitrates bio pellet would work or you could read up on carbon dosing . Vodka sugger

Yeah I’m kind of at that in-between place. Do I add bio pellets, a $200 Comline skimmer, add a $500 sump, upgrade to a used much larger reef aquarium now, etc. All I can say is what I have now doesn’t seem to be working despite best efforts.

 

[Screwgunner]

How much rock do you have in your tank

 

[ariellemermaid]

How much rock do you have in your tank

A fair amount? The lens distortion makes it look a little less than it is. Once cycled this tank has been rock-solid, I’ve never had to worry about ammonia. The tank is shallow in depth but really tall.

 

[RobertTheNurse]

It is possible but maintaining low nutrients in a tank with a canister filter can be tricky .

they need to be cleaned throughly as often as possible .
take apart , clean , rinse , scrub etc .
running them with as little media and filter
Cloth

I run a cannister. Used to have high nitrates 25. Now I'm busting my butt to get them up. Currently at 1.7. Undetectable phos. I have a 65G as well.

Anything is possible in this hobby.

Trade ya nitrates lol

 

[Screwgunner]

With the right flow and one pound of rock per gallon of your tank it should be able to process nitrates.

 

[Rmckoy]

With the right flow and one pound of rock per gallon of your tank it should be able to process nitrates.

Reading this .
the old Berlin method comes to mind .
1.5-2 lbs rock per gallon and flow was all that’s needed to filter and process nutrients

can’t remember if a skimmer was included in that theory

 

[Deep]

Yeah looking at it again today I think I was imagining it was looking better after turning the lights down.

I watched a video last night suggesting canisters should be cleaned as often as every other day and at least every week. One issue is I have a bunch of large copepods living in there and so it’s a challenge to clean without massacring them.

That said, if the consensus is that my problem isn’t nitrates and all other parameters are reasonable, then I’m still at a loss to explain my problems. I get the folks saying it’s probably the big water changes/stability, but remember the coral has thrived and grown in QT with weekly 25-50% changes (mostly 50%). It’s just this darn tank that kills corals.

It looks like I could add a siphon overflow and small sump for about $500 so I’m considering that in terms of the nitrate issues. I only have cabinet space for about a 12 gallon sump though (37 gallon tank). Unless I did some kind of split 2 sump situation (the cabinet is divided in the middle).

Well your problem is that you need better test kits, especially for Phosphates. In my book - the order of importance is first Salinity, then Alk then Phosphates.

 

[Deep]

Reading this .
the old Berlin method comes to mind .
1.5-2 lbs rock per gallon and flow was all that’s needed to filter and process nutrients

can’t remember if a skimmer was included in that theory

I think the skimmer is central to the berlin method.

 

[ariellemermaid]

Well your problem is that you need better test kits, especially for Phosphates. In my book - the order of importance is first Salinity, then Alk then Phosphates.

So you think it’s the phosphates <0.25 that are killing the coral? I will say the QT tank appears to have phosphates a little closer to 0 even with my poor test.

 

[RobertTheNurse]

So you think it’s the phosphates <0.25 that are killing the coral? I will say the QT tank appears to have phosphates a little closer to 0 even with my poor test.

I think we've all made that API mistake. It showed me when I first got into the hobby 0 nitrates...and guess what it was 25+. Need to invest in a decent testing kit. I'd start there.

 

[ariellemermaid]

I think we've all made that API mistake. It showed me when I first got into the hobby 0 nitrates...and guess what it was 25+. Need to invest in a decent testing kit. I'd start there.

Well in terms of nitrates I switched to the Salifert test and I feel pretty confident in those readings. The API is just too difficult to read.

 

[Deep]

So you think it’s the phosphates <0.25 that are killing the coral? I will say the QT tank appears to have phosphates a little closer to 0 even with my poor test.

Yes zero phosphates could be killing corals. The problem is that you dont know whether your phosphates are zero ( starving corals ) or whether it is 0.25 ( better than zero, but could encourage algae which then compete with corals).

Also how much substrate does your QT tank have ? Phosphate availability might be higher in the QT tank because there is no substrate to bind it. Not the case in your display with your sand and rocks,.

 

[ariellemermaid]

Yes zero phosphates could be killing corals. The problem is that you dont know whether your phosphates are zero ( starving corals ) or whether it is 0.25 ( better than zero, but could encourage algae which then compete with corals).

Also how much substrate does your QT tank have ? Phosphate availability might be higher in the QT tank because there is no substrate to bind it. Not the case in your display with your sand and rocks,.

When I say invert/coral QT what I really mean is a fully fledged 20g nano reef tank that just doesn’t have fish. Some Xenia has made it’s way onto the rocks along with ricordia and eventually I’ll plant some leftover fragged polyps from other corals.

The first grade on the API phosphate test is yellow and the second and beyond are shades of green. What I can say for certain is that it’s not pure yellow but it’s not as green as the 0.25 mark. So I do think phosphates are present greater than zero but less than 0.25. Still quite the range I know, but similar between the tanks where the coral did well in one and is dying in the other (perhaps a little more yellow in the QT).

Updated photo 3/7.

 

[mdb_talon]

Yeah I’m kind of at that in-between place. Do I add bio pellets, a $200 Comline skimmer, add a $500 sump, upgrade to a used much larger reef aquarium now, etc. All I can say is what I have now doesn’t seem to be working despite best efforts.

I would say if you are looking at biopellets or liquid carbon dosing you also need a skimmer. Otherwise you are just recycling nitrates and not removing them.

 

[ariellemermaid]

Just to close this thread out.... There doesn’t seem to be consensus on what exactly the problem is (probably not nitrates in the end based upon feedback here and the fact that the QT is running similar levels). The coral back in the coral QT with essentially the same parameters and water change intervals seems to be doing much better now and other SPS in there seems to be doing great also. So we’re scrapping the tank and ordered a Red Sea XXL 750 with Neptune Trident. Here’s to hoping a better reef system with close monitoring will be the cure for our nutrient management and coral health issues! Thanks for all the input! I guess that upgrade wasn’t so far off, in the end.