Tang issue

[psionicdragon]

Greetings

my gold rim and purple tang stopped eating and it looks like slime coming off their body. The fins look semi nipple like. The eyes are has some white film

the tank recently went through coppersafe, general cure, prazipro, kanaplex, and chloroquine phosphate due to velvet or ich.

only reason for copper and cp is because copper at 2.5ppm was not killing off the velvet/ich

I did a 80% water change. Any thoughts on what it could be?

 

[vetteguy53081]

Greetings

my gold rim and purple tang stopped eating and it looks like slime coming off their body. The fins look semi nipple like. The eyes are has some white film

the tank recently went through coppersafe, general cure, prazipro, kanaplex, and chloroquine phosphate due to velvet or ich.

only reason for copper and cp is because copper at 2.5ppm was not killing off the velvet/ich

I did a 80% water change. Any thoughts on what it could be?

Need better and clearer pics of fish as glass appears dirty and hard to decipher between the fish dots and tank dots. Im surprised after all these meds the fish is still thriving. One cannot chase an unknown issue with a bunch of meds and not expect poor results and even death.
Off the top, it appears fish has velvet which its susceptible to. I would start with Coppersafe or copper Power ONLY and treat as below. Please provide clearer pics for confirmation.

Treat with Coppersafe or Copper Power at therapeutic level 2.25-2.5 For a FULL 30 days (do not interrupt this 30 day period) monitored by a reliable Copper Test kit such as Hanna Brand- No API brand. Also monitor Ammonia levels while in quarantine with a reliable test kit and add aeration during treatment using an air stone. The display tank will have to be kept fishless (FALLOW) for 6-8 weeks to assure the existing parasites go through their life cycle without a host fish and die off
Symptoms associated with velvet are:
- Scratching body against hard objects
- Fish is lethargic
- Loss of appetite and weight loss
- Rapid, labored breathing
- Fins clamped against the body
- rapid breathing and mucus around the gills

Fish with velvet will typically stay at the surface of the water, or remain in a position where a steady flow of water is present in the aquarium. As the disease progresses outwards from the gills, the cysts then become visible on the fins and body. Although these cysts may appear as tiny white dots the size of a grain of salt, like the first sign of Saltwater Ich or White Spot Disease, what sets Oodinium apart from other types of ich is that at this point the fish have the appearance of being coated with what looks like a whitish or tan to golden colored, velvet-like film, thus the name Velvet Disease.

 

[psionicdragon]

Will do on the pic.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

In some cases, long term parasitic infections develop into secondary bacterial infections after the primary parasites have been eliminated.
Can you post a video?
Jay

 

[psionicdragon]

They did develop an infection. I forgot to add that I used furan2 also to deal with the infection

 

[psionicdragon]

The scribble has these dots also. Hopefully that can aid in diagnosis

 

[psionicdragon]

I used a Hanna hr copper tester and kept copper safe around 2.40s to 2.5

they finished the copper treatment a week ago and it’s this week that they are in observation mode. Both tangs are very skinny and won’t eat.

 

[psionicdragon]

used a Hanna hr copper tester and kept copper safe around 2.40s to 2.5

they finished the copper treatment a week ago and it’s this week that they are in observation mode. Both tangs are very skinny and won’t eat. Would starting copper so soon be detrimental? Iirc copper suppresses appetite but could be misremembering

 

[psionicdragon]

Unfortunately, the gold rim passed. However, there are other fishes that were QT with em.

Would appreciate any help on treating the rest.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Unfortunately, the gold rim passed. However, there are other fishes that were QT with em.

Would appreciate any help on treating the rest.

Sorry to hear. How long were you treating copper?
I agree on secondary bacterial and you can add seachem Kanaplex safely with coppersafe. With angel treat at 2.25 in lieu of 2.5 and treat as described below, BUT Maintain good water quality especially ammonia level with a Reliable test kit and add oxygen with use of air stone.
Treat with Coppersafe at therapeutic level 2.25- For a FULL 30 days (do not interrupt this 30 day period) monitored by a reliable Copper Test kit such as Hanna Brand- No API brand. Also monitor Ammonia levels while in quarantine with a reliable test kit and add aeration during treatment using an air stone.
The display tank will have to be kept fishless (FALLOW) for 6-8 weeks to assure the existing parasites go through their life cycle without a host fish and die off

 

[psionicdragon]

Did the copper treatment for 30 days at 2.5ppm coppersafe

 

[Jay Hemdal]

This is a weird case. I just saw the video. I'm not sure what is going on. If you showed me those with no backstory, I would say external parasites. However, they've been treated for all usual parasites. I can't rule out secondary bacterial infection from the parasites, but I'm less sure now, the thinness doesn't line up with that.

What are the other fish in with the remaining tang?
Did you use any water additives during the copper treatment?
Do you know the dose you used for the CP, was it done in conjunction with the copper?

Jay

 

[psionicdragon]

This is a weird case. I just saw the video. I'm not sure what is going on. If you showed me those with no backstory, I would say external parasites. However, they've been treated for all usual parasites. I can't rule out secondary bacterial infection from the parasites, but I'm less sure now, the thinness doesn't line up with that.

What are the other fish in with the remaining tang?
Did you use any water additives during the copper treatment?
Do you know the dose you used for the CP, was it done in conjunction with the copper?

Jay

Ya I am trying to figure out what’s on the scribble.
There are 2 scribbles, dussemari tang, 2 Niger and 1 blue line

I did 80mg/gal because of the rapid spread of velvet. Does lympho affect the eyes of the fishes? Everything stopped eating now when I restarted the copper treatment.
Should I stop the treatment and get them back to ratting before resuming?

no addictive we’re added

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Ya I am trying to figure out what’s on the scribble.
There are 2 scribbles, dussemari tang, 2 Niger and 1 blue line

I did 80mg/gal because of the rapid spread of velvet. Does lympho affect the eyes of the fishes? Everything stopped eating now when I restarted the copper treatment.
Should I stop the treatment and get them back to ratting before resuming?

no addictive we’re added

I guess I'm still not clear - was there copper in the water when you dosed the Chloroquine? Both copper and chloroquine last a long time in water, so unless you changed effectively 100% of the water, there is a chance they are both in the water to some degree, and I've never done that - since each medication along can cause stress, the result of mixing them could be very bad.

I don't see any symptoms related to Lymphocystis here, and I've never seen that develop on fish eyes anyway.

Jay

 

[psionicdragon]

I guess I'm still not clear - was there copper in the water when you dosed the Chloroquine? Both copper and chloroquine last a long time in water, so unless you changed effectively 100% of the water, there is a chance they are both in the water to some degree, and I've never done that - since each medication along can cause stress, the result of mixing them could be very bad.

I don't see any symptoms related to Lymphocystis here, and I've never seen that develop on fish eyes anyway.

Jay

Ah gotcha. I did a 80% water change and ran poly filter before I dose the CP. You are more likely than not right that copper would still be there.

I am have no idea what is growing on the scribble though..it seems to be spreading and growing more

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Ah gotcha. I did a 80% water change and ran poly filter before I dose the CP. You are more likely than not right that copper would still be there.

I am have no idea what is growing on the scribble though..it seems to be spreading and growing more

That amount of copper shouldn’t be an issue then with a subsequent CP treatment.

I’m really not sure what’s going on here - common wisdom would say that something that is getting worse after those treatments would NOT be protozoal then. That leaves a bacterial issue as the next most likely pathogen. Whole tank antibiotics could be something to try, as @vetteguy53081 suggested….Kanaplex or maybe Neoplex, dosed in a treatment tank as per label directions…..but I’m not super confident that will resolve things.
Jay

 

[vetteguy53081]

They did develop an infection. I forgot to add that I used furan2 also to deal with the infection

Tang is looking thin and lethargic and scribbled agree has even more dots.
How are you testing water and what is current ammonia-ph-salinity and temperature?
If you have an airstone, stick one in there if you haven't already to increase oxygen while this gets sorted.
Since youve done a water change and reduced copper, I would recommend giving a shot with Ruby Rally pro which is reef safe and will address velvet, gill flukes, fin rot, secondary bacterial infections, many external protozoans and brooklynella.
What size is your tank?