im setting u a new tank soon and i was wondering if there is such a thing as too much biological filtration. like would i benefit from a refugium,liverock,and marinepure biospheres or is it just overkill.
Too Much biological filtration
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raketemensch
Ape That Likes Fish
The rock is essential because you need surface area to build up the bacteria you need. Read up on the nitrogen cycle, it's pretty quick.
A refugium with macroalgae like chaeto may become necessary once you have livestock in the tank producing things for it to filter. Before that, there's no need for it and really nothing for the algae to eat.
Looking around at everyone's tanks and sumps it seems like there's a whole stack of things that you need to set up, but for the most part you just need water and a pump until your fish start producing things that really need to be filtered.
I originally set up a sump with a protein skimmer and a refugium with a grow light and chaeto just like all the tanks I see all over the net, but it was pointless and counterproductive because there were no nutrients for them to filter out and the skimmer just inhibited the necessary bacteria growth.
A refugium with macroalgae like chaeto may become necessary once you have livestock in the tank producing things for it to filter. Before that, there's no need for it and really nothing for the algae to eat.
Looking around at everyone's tanks and sumps it seems like there's a whole stack of things that you need to set up, but for the most part you just need water and a pump until your fish start producing things that really need to be filtered.
I originally set up a sump with a protein skimmer and a refugium with a grow light and chaeto just like all the tanks I see all over the net, but it was pointless and counterproductive because there were no nutrients for them to filter out and the skimmer just inhibited the necessary bacteria growth.
Biological filtration will grow and wane to the input. This also of course includes the corals we are trying to grow.
While you cant have too much surface area, you can take up more space than you need to. Too much rock in a dt, may detract from visual appeal or room for fish to swim. Taking up space in your sump for bio media may remove space for something you want down the road. Also may increase things to clean. So if want to feed very heavily or keeping dirty fish like predators, increasing your nutrient uptake may help. What i can say is, i find it more beneficial to add things like a refugium or carbon dosing only after your tank has matured some. Starting a tank with loads of nutrient export ime leads to odd microalgae outbreaks, unless you are very carefully monitoring your input and how long it is maintained In the aquarium for.
example if want a fuge, buy the light, hook up, but dont plug it in till your tank Has matured and you have added some corals first and go slow with intensity.
While you cant have too much surface area, you can take up more space than you need to. Too much rock in a dt, may detract from visual appeal or room for fish to swim. Taking up space in your sump for bio media may remove space for something you want down the road. Also may increase things to clean. So if want to feed very heavily or keeping dirty fish like predators, increasing your nutrient uptake may help. What i can say is, i find it more beneficial to add things like a refugium or carbon dosing only after your tank has matured some. Starting a tank with loads of nutrient export ime leads to odd microalgae outbreaks, unless you are very carefully monitoring your input and how long it is maintained In the aquarium for.
example if want a fuge, buy the light, hook up, but dont plug it in till your tank Has matured and you have added some corals first and go slow with intensity.
Dr. Dendrostein
Marine fish monthly
With to much biological filtration, will effect ph. Will have ph swings. Bacteria will consume oxygen and convert to carbon dioxide which then effects ph. If you want to be successful, follow those with successful reefs here on R2R. They will be helpful.
OP
OP
20lb rock for a 20 g tank
my fuge is gonna be for pods and algae but of course im gonna add that refugium down the line but i just wanted to know if there are going to be any problems if i cycle with my rock and the bioball things
my fuge is gonna be for pods and algae but of course im gonna add that refugium down the line but i just wanted to know if there are going to be any problems if i cycle with my rock and the bioball things
Dr. Dendrostein
Marine fish monthly
What type of corals, sps, lps....
Dr. Dendrostein
Marine fish monthly
As long as very few nps corals , you can do 10lbs but 20 is fine. I think
ca1ore
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I would have thought that the bacteria would scale to the available food regardless of the real estate available to them. Maybe you take up too much tank space with unnecessary rock, but hard to envision that would end up with too much bio filtration. I tend to err on the side of less rock and if I get any signs of ammonia I add a bit more.
OP
OP
gonna start with just some lps maybe a few zoa frags but after w while and everything is dialed in im gonna get some sps for sure.
start with just liverock. keep it simple.
add more filtration as your tank and livestock evolve/mature over time. and you have the need for more/different filtration solutions.
FWIW... this is how i started my new tank.
i use just liverock in my tank. no skimmer.
added a UV to clear up a bloom/dino problem (temporary). remove it when no longer needed.
run a filter sock once or twice a month to filter out fine particles.
added purigen bag, to keep the water sparkling clear.
i still have low-ish nutrients.
J.
add more filtration as your tank and livestock evolve/mature over time. and you have the need for more/different filtration solutions.
FWIW... this is how i started my new tank.
i use just liverock in my tank. no skimmer.
added a UV to clear up a bloom/dino problem (temporary). remove it when no longer needed.
run a filter sock once or twice a month to filter out fine particles.
added purigen bag, to keep the water sparkling clear.
i still have low-ish nutrients.
J.
OP
OP
The plan is i got a nuvo 20g tank but im gonna use a hob refugium (in the beginning for the extra water volume) will add chateo when needed.) but what about this i only use enough rock for my desired aquascape and some marinepure bio media or very porous rubble.
Da8
Active Member
Have you got any way to know if you are running too much biological filtration with those ph swings?
I'm unable to keep nitrate leveled to phosphate (N 0/1- P04 0,05/0,13) and I guess maybe is because I've got too much syporax reactors in passive...
But I'm afraid of eliminating one and maybe creating an instant domino...
why add extra when you probably won't ever need it?
i honestly think that a lot of folks are overdoing it
have you ever seen a tank that has measurable ammonia or nitrites running only liverock?
i even have a problem keeping my nitrates above zero with just liverock.
J.
OP
OP
then i will add the extra rock if i need it at all but guessing i wont
They grow to equilibrium, so you cannot have too much. Generally speaking, nature will always leave a small amount to keep the equilibrium going forward and never scavenge out "too much..." you never truly get to zero of anything, but you get low.
DesertReefT4r
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Normally just the rock in the tank is enough surface area for biological filteration. Bacteria will scale to the nutrient demands ofmthe tank. I have 60lbs of rock, a bag of Siporax and some rock rubble in a 75g with 20L sump, more than enough biofilteration.
OP
OP
wait does a refugium fall under biological filtration
Yes, at the back end.
Ammonia/Ammonium -> Nitrite -> Nitrate - > Nitrogen Gas (anoxic bacteria) or Plant Food (fuge)
Ammonia/Ammonium -> Nitrite -> Nitrate - > Nitrogen Gas (anoxic bacteria) or Plant Food (fuge)
Dr. Dendrostein
Marine fish monthly
What I forgot to mention is I heavy fed then 1 1/2 yrs ago, so everything was high, and nps corals.
I can mention only what I've gone through
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Bruce Burnett
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You decide your rock scape. Minimal or not. Anywhere from 1-2 pounds per gallon. I just make sure I have lots of hiding and sleeping areas for the fish and leave lots of swimming area from top to bottom whole length of tank. How porous the rock is determines the weight and how you want your rock to look sets how much you use. As long as you have enough surface area you are good the biological activity adjust to the needs of the tank.
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