Trouble keeping more than a few fish

[alterboy21]

I am having trouble keeping more than a few fish alive. I am baffled at the cause and thought the community could help.

I have a peaceful 75 gallon saltwater FOWLR tank (pict attached). The tank has been stable and up and running for a couple of years. However, I have been unable to maintain more than a few fish alive for more than 3 - 4 months. I feel like I should be able to maintain 4 - 5 fish without issue in a 75 gallon tank.

Recent parameters:
Temp 81 (range of 78 - 82)
pH 7.8
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 10 (sometimes goes up to 40)
Salinity 1.024
Alkalinity 300

It's currently stocked with a clownfish, sailfin tang, pin cushion urchin, chocolate starfish and a dozen snails -- all of which appear to be healthy. The clownfish and tang have done fine for the past couple of years. At various points over the past 2 years I have also added: firefish, coral beauty angel, pajama cardinal, pearlscale butterfly, hawkfish, chalk bass, lawnmower blenny. I have gotten these fish from a few different LFS. All these other fish have lasted a few months, but then died. None of the fish have been aggressive. I am not seeing any pattern of spots, bulging eyes, red gills, loss of appetite, etc.. What am I doing wrong?

I have an automatic fish feeder set to provide flake food 3 times a day, tank lights are on 12 hours a day, there are a few airstones and a power head. I do 5% or 4 gallon water changes once a week using home RO/DI water (TDS currently at 3). I have a AquaC Remora HOB protein skimmer that runs at night, 50 #s of live rock and 70#s of Argonite sand. Some brown & red algae, but it's under control. My primary (canister) filter is a Fluval 407.

I want to get a few more fish, but I am worried I have an undiagnosed issue and will condemn anything new. Any thoughts are appreciated.

 

[P-Dub]

That is baffling. Have any photos of the fish post mortem? @Jay Hemdal

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I am having trouble keeping more than a few fish alive. I am baffled at the cause and thought the community could help.

I have a peaceful 75 gallon saltwater FOWLR tank (pict attached). The tank has been stable and up and running for a couple of years. However, I have been unable to maintain more than a few fish alive for more than 3 - 4 months. I feel like I should be able to maintain 4 - 5 fish without issue in a 75 gallon tank.

Recent parameters:
Temp 81 (range of 78 - 82)
pH 7.8
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 10 (sometimes goes up to 40)
Salinity 1.024
Alkalinity 300

It's currently stocked with a clownfish, sailfin tang, pin cushion urchin, chocolate starfish and a dozen snails -- all of which appear to be healthy. The clownfish and tang have done fine for the past couple of years. At various points over the past 2 years I have also added: firefish, coral beauty angel, pajama cardinal, pearlscale butterfly, hawkfish, chalk bass, lawnmower blenny. I have gotten these fish from a few different LFS. All these other fish have lasted a few months, but then died. None of the fish have been aggressive. I am not seeing any pattern of spots, bulging eyes, red gills, loss of appetite, etc.. What am I doing wrong?

I have an automatic fish feeder set to provide flake food 3 times a day, tank lights are on 12 hours a day, there are a few airstones and a power head. I do 5% or 4 gallon water changes once a week using home RO/DI water (TDS currently at 3). I have a AquaC Remora HOB protein skimmer that runs at night, 50 #s of live rock and 70#s of Argonite sand. Some brown & red algae, but it's under control. My primary (canister) filter is a Fluval 407.

I want to get a few more fish, but I am worried I have an undiagnosed issue and will condemn anything new. Any thoughts are appreciated.

There may well be a variety of reasons the fish are not thriving for you - I doubt that there is a single underlying theme here. Lack of a comprehensive quarantine process can be one problem - but in many of those cases, a disease then gets into your tank that takes out most or all of the fish. Losing a single fish here and there is typically not caused by a massive disease issue.

Just off the cuff, I keyed in on this statement: "I have an automatic fish feeder set to provide flake food 3 times a day,"

That sort of feeding process works o.k. for vacations and such, but for good long term care, you can't beat feeding a variety of frozen foods, fed while you carefully watch, to ensure every fish is eating, and eating enough to sustain them. Mysid shrimp, gel diet and pellets should provide the main diet for many reef fish. Even frozen brine shrimp can be fed. Flake food is one of my last choices, and then, only to fish who are accustomed to feeding on it, and then, just to augment other food items. Other fish, such as tangs, require supplementation with Nori algae. I would not expect the ones you lost to really thrive being fed flakes. Lawnmower blennies have their own special issue - they tend to die off if there isn't enough algae for them to eat, and it must be a species of algae that they like.

Jay

 

[Danroo]

I am having trouble keeping more than a few fish alive. I am baffled at the cause and thought the community could help.

I have a peaceful 75 gallon saltwater FOWLR tank (pict attached). The tank has been stable and up and running for a couple of years. However, I have been unable to maintain more than a few fish alive for more than 3 - 4 months. I feel like I should be able to maintain 4 - 5 fish without issue in a 75 gallon tank.

Recent parameters:
Temp 81 (range of 78 - 82)
pH 7.8
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 10 (sometimes goes up to 40)
Salinity 1.024
Alkalinity 300

It's currently stocked with a clownfish, sailfin tang, pin cushion urchin, chocolate starfish and a dozen snails -- all of which appear to be healthy. The clownfish and tang have done fine for the past couple of years. At various points over the past 2 years I have also added: firefish, coral beauty angel, pajama cardinal, pearlscale butterfly, hawkfish, chalk bass, lawnmower blenny. I have gotten these fish from a few different LFS. All these other fish have lasted a few months, but then died. None of the fish have been aggressive. I am not seeing any pattern of spots, bulging eyes, red gills, loss of appetite, etc.. What am I doing wrong?

I have an automatic fish feeder set to provide flake food 3 times a day, tank lights are on 12 hours a day, there are a few airstones and a power head. I do 5% or 4 gallon water changes once a week using home RO/DI water (TDS currently at 3). I have a AquaC Remora HOB protein skimmer that runs at night, 50 #s of live rock and 70#s of Argonite sand. Some brown & red algae, but it's under control. My primary (canister) filter is a Fluval 407.

I want to get a few more fish, but I am worried I have an undiagnosed issue and will condemn anything new. Any thoughts are appreciated.

Don’t feed flake foods they’re not so nutritious for marine fish, feed them frozen or live food, pallets should be fed in an emergency situation or once a day and then at night feed them frozen food. PH seems a bit low imo I like to mine around 8.2.

 

[Idech]

I’m not a saltwater expert (yet) but I’m a long time fish keeper.

What I don’t like when I look at your tank is the lack of hiding spaces and caves for the fish. I’ve been studying saltwater fish for a while and it seems that many live around or in rocks and / or are skittish and also need rocks to take shelter in.

Not having a place to hide puts the fish under high levels of stress, which affect their immune systems, just like it does in humans. They then become much more susceptible to being harmed by naturally occurring parasites that live in the water, but don’t harm healthy fish. Fish don’t live long lives as we do, so being put under chronic stress can kill them in a few months.

I would rethink your hardscape completely, having the health and needs of the fish in mind.

 

[MaxTremors]

I’m not a saltwater expert (yet) but I’m a long time fish keeper.

What I don’t like when I look at your tank is the lack of hiding spaces and caves for the fish. I’ve been studying saltwater fish for a while and it seems that many live around or in rocks and / or are skittish and also need rocks to take shelter in.

Not having a place to hide puts the fish under high levels of stress, which affect their immune systems, just like it does in humans. They then become much more susceptible to being harmed by naturally occurring parasites that live in the water, but don’t harm healthy fish. Fish don’t live long lives as we do, so being put under chronic stress can kill them in a few months.

I would rethink your hardscape completely, having the health and needs of the fish in mind.

Good advice here (and above). I would also take out all of the non-aragonite/live rock decorations. One or all of them could be leaching toxins or metals into the water. They could also be perfectly safe, but until you’ve figured out the problem I would take them out. I would also order an ICP test to rule out toxicity, once that’s ruled out we can determine if it’s disease, poor acclimation, unhealthy stock, etc.

 

[jt8791]

Think everyone hit the most likely causes, I have hit or miss luck getting anything to eat flake or pellet but most frozen foods will get eaten. Definitely seems severely low on rock for a 75, the branch pieces don’t do much for the fish as far as hiding places. I would toss the fake decorations and add about 25lbs of good porous rock.

Not sure how much good air bubblers do but question if there is enough flow in the tank. Hard to say if there could be low oxygen with air stones but might be a good idea to add up all your equipment and see how much actual flow you have.

Edit: you didn’t notice any aggression but I question if that sailfin tang might be getting cramped.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

Your post says 50lbs of live rock, but that looks like very Little Rock. More rock equals stronger biofilter to support more fish.
And I agree with all above points too. It’s a combo of several things IMO

 

[threebuoys]

Your parameters are within range and shouldn't be directly contributing to the death of your fish.

My concern is nutrition. I would consider are you feeding enough nutritional food, and are new tank mates eating their fair share?.

The tang and clownfish are long-term residents and I'm sure since they have lived so long they are not bashful eaters. New fish can sometimes hesitate to get into the fray and as a result do not eat enough. Of course, they also may not be adapted to the food you are providing.

I suggest you use a QT for your next fish purchase and in addition to following the recommended protocols, pay close attention to the eating habits of the new fish.Make sure they good enough and none goes to waste. Addressing eating issues is much easier in QT than in a display tank.

Some of the fish you've tried previously are picky eaters. Jay mentioned the Lawnmower blenny. I have one of those doing really well. Unfortunately, I have too much algae in my tank! I'm not sure what will happen when I get the algae under control(my tangs love the algae also)! Butterfly fish can also be difficult to get to eat.

For the next batch of fish, choose several that are not described as picky eaters and see how they work out. I have a hawkfish that loves pellets. He perches on a rock, eyes the pellets floating on the surface, attacks, gets one, back to his perch to eat it, then repeat.

Personally, pellets are the primary food I use. Easy to administer, easy to see if they are all eaten. My clowns, wrasses, tangs cardinals, dwarf angel and damsels all attack the pellets I feed. I supplement that with frozen mysis and brine, and dried nori.

Good luck

 

[alterboy21]

Thanks for all the valuable feedback. I do occasionally feed nori and frozen mysis, but sounds like I should feed more. I will also add more live rock.