Vertex Cerebra - New Breakdown Video #46

[joshkirkland83]

That is a MSRP. That doesn't mean it will be that price after the release. Also, everyone is only making responses on limited information about the controller is worth. I understand apex has been doing it for years but look at Neptune's reaction to the Cerebral release. Their actions explain a lot. Something that isn't a threat shouldn't/wouldn't make a company change course so hastily.

True, but maybe everyone thought it would be a lot better...

 

[Marquiseo]

True, but maybe everyone thought it would be a lot better...

Better how? What to say it is not good? No one has even tested it. Most are making assumptions based on looks and not on what it can do.

Side note: The new apex looks like it belongs on the shelf at Toys R Us. (I own an Apex Gold; now Classic.)

 

[joshkirkland83]

Better how? What to say it is not good? No one has even tested it. Most are making assumptions based on looks and not on what it can do.

Side note: The new apex looks like it belongs on the shelf at Toys R Us. (I own an Apex Gold; now Classic.)

I'm basing it off of the big box display, you have to buy all accessories separate, most of all the lack of information and presentation.

I have two apex golds on a 90g and a 75g also.

 

[Marquiseo]

I'm basing it off of the big box display, you have to buy all accessories separate, most of all the lack of information and presentation.

I have two apex golds on a 90g and a 75g also.

- Block touch screen display ( it is probably an android computer. it needs room to store the ram, hard drive, so on.) vs Mono-gameboy display or use of 3rd party Tablet from Amazon which I may add that you won't get support from Neptunes for it.

lets crunch some numbers:

- Cerebra with multibar which has all the ports you need and not separate modules and a smart temp probe that has light indicators - $374

We will add the basic probes everyone use. Not many actually use ORP so we will leave that out.

- Dual Junction pH probe - $62.99
-Conductivity Probe - $80.99

Total: $518.97 which is less than the Apex Classic ( $549.95) and you also have a conductivity probe.

Lets go a little further and say you want to add the ORP probe and want another energy bar which is the same as the New Apex:

ORP Probe: $71.99
Energy Bar: $149.99

Total: $740.95 (Still less than the New Apex $799.95 + you still have more room to add another pH probe without having to buy another module; Also you have 12 energy sockets to use.)


Vertex Accessories: http://www.aquariumspecialty.com/equipment/controllers-monitors/accessories?manufacturer=7003

 

[ngvu1]

5.5 inch display is a bit small like my cell phone; it's 2016 I would have started with 8 inch LCD at least :-). The introductory package only comes with 1 temp probe and 6 outlets. The good thing is that Vertex "base" has a lot of ports even more ports than the new apex base.......Android open source is a plus but we have seen that with ReefAngle already ......

 

[ngvu1]

You forget this is just an introductory price. If you use their "intended" price, then it will be more fair! "Introductory" of a brand new product to the market is for "Beta testers" to me.....I get paid to test products :)

- Block touch screen display ( it is probably an android computer. it needs room to store the ram, hard drive, so on.) vs Mono-gameboy display or use of 3rd party Tablet from Amazon which I may add that you won't get support from Neptunes for it.

lets crunch some numbers:

- Cerebra with multibar which has all the ports you need and not separate modules and a smart temp probe that has light indicators - $374

We will add the basic probes everyone use. Not many actually use ORP so we will leave that out.

- Dual Junction pH probe - $62.99
-Conductivity Probe - $80.99

Total: $518.97 which is less than the Apex Classic ( $549.95) and you also have a conductivity probe.

Lets go a little further and say you want to add the ORP probe and want another energy bar which is the same as the New Apex:

ORP Probe: $71.99
Energy Bar: $149.99

Total: $740.95 (Still less than the New Apex $799.95 + you still have more room to add another pH probe without having to buy another module; Also you have 12 energy sockets to use.)


Vertex Accessories: http://www.aquariumspecialty.com/equipment/controllers-monitors/accessories?manufacturer=7003

 

[joshkirkland83]

- Block touch screen display ( it is probably an android computer. it needs room to store the ram, hard drive, so on.) vs Mono-gameboy display or use of 3rd party Tablet from Amazon which I may add that you won't get support from Neptunes for it.

lets crunch some numbers:

- Cerebra with multibar which has all the ports you need and not separate modules and a smart temp probe that has light indicators - $374

We will add the basic probes everyone use. Not many actually use ORP so we will leave that out.

- Dual Junction pH probe - $62.99
-Conductivity Probe - $80.99

Total: $518.97 which is less than the Apex Classic ( $549.95) and you also have a conductivity probe.

Lets go a little further and say you want to add the ORP probe and want another energy bar which is the same as the New Apex:

ORP Probe: $71.99
Energy Bar: $149.99

Total: $740.95 (Still less than the New Apex $799.95 + you still have more room to add another pH probe without having to buy another module)

I really do see your point, and I may change my mind after a few months of reefers evaluations. The presentation and information is what worrys and bothers me the most. Before the omega came out there was loads of information and they were previewing it all around the country at reefing shows. I have an IN-100 and a omega 150. They are awesome and well built Skimmers. I just feel let down with this aspect of the cerebra coming out, especially being 5 years in the making...but like you said, it's capabilities do LOOK promising.

 

[Marquiseo]

You forget this is just an introductory price. If you use their "intended" price, then it will be more fair!

It may be an introductory price but it may become a permanent price since it is an MSRP. If Vertex can pull this pricing off, there is no doubt it can become a permanent one. In the end, now would be the best time to buy it even if you just get the base and get the probes later. You can always sell the unit and get your money back if they raise the price and pass the savings on to another reefer.

 

[ngvu1]

Good point, unless something unexpected happens.

You can always sell the unit and get your money back if they raise the price and pass the savings on to another reefer.

 

[ngvu1]

Too many "IF"s and "May"s; I will respond to that with "Not likely" :-)

It may be an introductory price but it may become a permanent price since it is an MSRP. If Vertex can pull this pricing off, there is no doubt it can become a permanent one. In the end, now would be the best time to buy it even if you just get the base and get the probes later.

 

[Marquiseo]

I really do see your point, and I may change my mind after a few months of reefers evaluations. The presentation and information is what worrys and bothers me the most. Before the omega came out there was loads of information and they were previewing it all around the country at reefing shows. I have an IN-100 and a omega 150. They are awesome and well built Skimmers. I just feel let down with this aspect of the cerebra coming out, especially being 5 years in the making...but like you said, it's capabilities do LOOK promising.

I would see the hold off as a chance to get majority of the bugs out of the way to release a stable product. Also, it allows the company to observing growing technology and incorporate them into the final release without screwing early adapters. I think it will be stable enough. I may just buy the unit and store it for when I return back to reef keeping; I have to take a break due to upcoming events and I need a worry free vacation.

 

[Marquiseo]

Too many "IF"s and "May"s; I will respond to that with "Not likely" :)

I can only say "if" because it is speculation on my behalf based on information presented. Once they say it is so then it will be a definite answer.

 

[joshkirkland83]

Good points made here. Thanks for the constructive debate.

 

[Marquiseo]

Taken from: http://www.aquariumspecialty.com/media/wysiwyg/Manuals/Cerebra-Details.pdf

 

[Marquiseo]

This function alone makes Apex a thing of the past:

Heart-Beat Function, Cerebra transmit a complete status list every…..minutes. This heart beat contains all data to be backed up to cloud server. If the connection to server or power is lost the Cloud Server will generate an email and SMS to alert the system administrator of such event. Along with the Alert the last reported status of system data such as Temperature, PH… will be provided.

Currently, Apex Fusion only transmits after power has been restored detailing the time it went out and when it was restored. In that time frame, everything could be dead and you would have not known about the outage until you got your late alert. It has happened to me before minus the dead corals.

 

[Hack]

Ok let's examine this....Neptune released their new controller early to curb Vertex's potential consumers.

Doubtful. Controllers take months or even years to bring to market. There is nothing to suggest that Neptune released their product early to curb anything. However, slashing the price of your 4 years to market, untested controller in an obvious attempt grab market share should speak volumes. Ask yourself this: who on earth would want to buy these when the price goes up? The introductory price should give a fairly good indicator of the component value in these units. And why would anyone want to be their beta tester?

Then later attempts to persuade current apex users to buy 3rd party tablets to use with their controller in an attempt to compete with the visual display of Vertex's

Not how I read it at all. I, for one respect a company who shows me a way to make my reefing experience more enjoyable, even at the expense of a non-sale of their own display (which they do sell). I believe they are right - tablets have become so stupid cheap that this only makes sense. And why would anyone want a display connected to the main unit? When a pixel dies, do you send the whole unit back for repair?

Neptune systems feels the threat from vertex which makes me more intrigued of this product.

Well, you certainly seem to know more about what Neptune Systems feels than me. Time will tell. For me, I will be sticking with something I know works. I'll leave the bargain basement hunting to others.

 

[ngvu1]

This is a good thing to have. I hope they have option to turn that off or change the heart-beat rate....Basically make it configurable please.
Currently, don't know about the new apex, the old apex does not have heart beat option, but there is reefTronics.net that will ping the apex and send notification to the apex owner for free....

This function alone makes Apex a thing of the past:

Heart-Beat Function, Cerebra transmit a complete status list every…..minutes. This heart beat contains all data to be backed up to cloud server. If the connection to server or power is lost the Cloud Server will generate an email and SMS to alert the system administrator of such event. Along with the Alert the last reported status of system data such as Temperature, PH… will be provided.

Currently, Apex Fusion only transmits after power has been restored detailing the time it went out and when it was restored. In that time frame, everything could be dead and you would have not known about the outage until you got your late alert. It has happened to me before minus the dead corals.

 

[ngvu1]

You got my vote on this. I have not thought of that because I never count on the display even the Apex display. They, Vertex, have the wifi/network so I guess you can still use it, but to get it fixed.....You got a point there LOL.

And why would anyone want a display connected to the main unit? When a pixel dies, do you send the whole unit back for repair?

 

[Marquiseo]

Doubtful. Controllers take months or even years to bring to market. There is nothing to suggest that Neptune released their product early to curb anything. However, slashing the price of your 4 years to market, untested controller in an obvious attempt grab market share should speak volumes. Ask yourself this: who on earth would want to buy these when the price goes up? The introductory price should give a fairly good indicator of the component value in these units. And why would anyone want to be their beta tester?

Who says it has to take that long? Is that based on your controller you built? It makes sense to release something when it is ready to release instead of releasing it and fixing hiccups along the way. Grabbing market share is not bad at all. After all, they are entering the US market where Neptune dominates. Secondly, Neptune did release it ahead of their normal release pattern. Look at the videos they have released since the knowledge of the Cerebra. Coincidences? I think not. Right, who would pay once they go up. Idk certainly not me which now is the best time to get it while the grabbing is good.
People beta test all the time. Look at several ecotech products that were beta tested long before hand. Look at kick starter projects that have had beta testers.


Not how I read it at all. I, for one respect a company who shows me a way to make my reefing experience more enjoyable, even at the expense of a non-sale of their own display (which they do sell). I believe they are right - tablets have become so stupid cheap that this only makes sense. And why would anyone want a display connected to the main unit? When a pixel dies, do you send the whole unit back for repair?

When the tablet needs repair will Neptune do it? No. When a seasoned reefer need help configuring their tablet to Fusion will Neptune help? Probably but it isn't guaranteed. The display is an android computer that has the potential perform more complex functions that the Apex can't but that isn't its main selling point. It is simple for the end-user to use but has the potential to be much more. I see this from a technological standpoint. I have an Apex and none of Vertex products.


Well, you certainly seem to know more about what Neptune Systems feels than me. Time will tell. For me, I will be sticking with something I know works. I'll leave the bargain basement hunting to others.

I watch the business make move the same as if I were in to stock trading. Actions as such means something is going on. I don't blame you and you have the right to do so. This is not an apex sucks thread or Apex Die! thread. This thread is about a new controller to the market and what it can do for reefers. In the end, your beliefs and I respect them. Happy Reefing!

 

[Bj’s Reef]

I ordered one today from Aqurium Specility. I can't wait to get it in my hands to try out for my. To me it's hard to down a product based on a video. For the current price it is worth it to me to, give it a try.