Stop using it. Grow some chaeto and get another 26 hd and raise them up. You’ll thank me later.
Why can't I grow Acro's
- Thread starter IslandLifeReef
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Instead of being dismissive you could ask questions.
That is a 120 for a long time I used 4 Hydra non HD on it which is single light per 30g, not that dissimilar.
Here is a 3 gallon sps pico I had but it's even less relevant because it's small right?
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29bonsaireef
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What you said is basically the same as me or another telling someone it's okay to use a 1bulb t5 when I use 5bulbs, because mine works.. A single vs multi LED fixture is much different since they have overlapping spread.
I just don't see the point in trying to wipe off lighting as an issue when it's becoming pretty obvious that is the issue here, or part of.
Been keep acro’s now for 26 years in all kinds of systems doing coral spawning system next. Always learning new things with SPS. Started with a 20 gallon all the way up to 3000 gallons. Many paths with many turns but simple is best. Chasing numbers when you don’t no what to do is not a good path.
Cleary I disagree light is a major issues for his acro positioned where it is. Also you have no idea where in the my tank the light overlapped nor did you ask or consider it. Shocking you had issues.
Huh???? Im confused because bonsai29 doesn’t use leds and your reply/English doesn’t make sense.
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IslandLifeReef
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Been keep acro’s now for 26 years in all kinds of systems doing coral spawning system next. Always learning new things with SPS. Started with a 20 gallon all the way up to 3000 gallons. Many paths with many turns but simple is best. Chasing numbers when you don’t no what to do is not a good path.
So, @reefwiser, do you think that going back to the dosing amount that had my corals looking their best is tilting at windmills? I will be reducing the amount by almost 50%, and if it is Alk burn, shouldn't that help?
I am also keeping everyone else's suggestions in mind, but I only want to change one thing at a time so I don't mess anything else up. I've found changing too many things at once rarely solves the problem and only left me more confused about what I needed to change.
Best of luck to you with your tank chas.
Anywho island I hope some of this has been useful at least. Not going to follow this thread anymore, too reefcentral-ish for my taste. I'm sure your going to crack it soon and have great success!
IslandLifeReef, I haven't taken the time to read all the posts in your thread so some of this may be redundant. I did see someone mentioned PAR and it would be a good idea to know what the PAR readings at various places in you tank are. I see you're keeping PO4 at very low levels, low enough you may be seeing the negative effects of corals having a phosphate deficiency, especially if you are also feeding amino acids. Keep in mind as phototrophs (or mixotrophs) corals can switch between autotrophic feeding (using inorganic forms of nitrogen and phosphate and competing with algae) or feed autotrophicly (feeding off particulate matter or organic forms of nitrogen and phosphate, amino acids and urea the most common forms of organic nitrogen). This paper by University of Hawaii demonstrates that species preferences vary at least at the genus level (I suspect research will show it's as variable as the individual photobiology in species, time will tell). Some species are unaffected by feeding and some are not only affected by feeding but feeding indicates a "J" curve where too little can be as bad as too much. (And I would point out the terms "SPS" and "LPS" really have no relavance regarding coral husbandry.)
Here's more info on PO4 deficiency. PO4 deficiency really screws up the coral holobiont simbiosis and keep in mind it can take months for corals to recover. Here's a good video to start with:
And here's a list of papers to read. The first three were done with a closed system at Southampton Univeristy started over ten years ago, so longer term than is often seen. And keep in mind corals are looking at the TOTAL amount of nitrogen and phosphate available, organic, inorganic, dissolved and particulate. PO4 and Nitrate are small parts of the overall nitrogen and phosphorus picture the coral holobiont is working with.
Phosphate deficiency promotes coral bleaching and is reflected by the ultrastructure of symbiotic dinoflagellates
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0025326X17301601?via=ihub
Nitrate enrichment can increase the susceptibility of reef corals to bleaching
http://www.indiaenvironmentportal.org.in/files/file/Nutrient enrichment.pdf
Ultrastructural Biomarkers in Symbiotic Algae Reflect the Availability of Dissolved Inorganic Nutrients and Particulate Food to the Reef Coral Holobiont
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fmars.2015.00103/full
High phosphate uptake requirements of the scleractinian coral Stylophora pistillata
http://jeb.biologists.org/content/214/16/2749.full
Increased phosphate increases growth
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022098111004588
Here's two quotes from two preeminate coral reef researchers:
"When I see the colors of some of these low nutrient tanks, I can't help but be reminded of bleached coral reefs. It should therefore not come as a surprise that feeding corals in such systems becomes a very important component in these systems. Though reefs are often catagorized as nutrient "deserts" the influx of nutrients in the form of particulates and plankton is quite high when the total volume of water passing over a reef is taken into consideration.
Our crystal-clear aquaria do not come close to the nutrient loads that swirl around natural reefs. And so when we create low-nutrient water conditions, we still have to deal with the rest of a much more complex puzzle. Much like those who run their aquarium water temperature close to the thermal maximums of corals walk a narrow tight rope, I can't help but think that low-nutrient aquariums may be headed down a similar path." Charles Delbeck, Coral Nov/Dec 2010, pg 127
"Imported nutrients are usually transported to reefs from rivers; but if there are no rivers, as with reefs remote from land masses, nutrients can only come from surface ocean circulation. Often this supply is poor, and thus the vast ocean expanses have been refered to as "nutrient deserts". The Indo-Pacific has many huge atolls in these supposed deserts which testify to the resilience of reefs, but the corals themselves may lack the lush appearance of those of more fertile waters. Many reefs have another major supply of inorganic nutrients as, under certain conditions, surface currents moving against a reef face may cause deep ocean water to be drawn to the surface. This "upwelled" water is often rich in phosphorus and other essential chemicals." J. E. N. Veron "Corals of Austrailia and the Indo-Pacific" pg 30
Conkrite, et al, 1999 gives much higher phosphate levels for the ocean surface than the .003 mg/l sometimes recommended
https://gmao.gsfc.nasa.gov/research/oceanbiology/reprints/conkrightetal_DSR1999.pdf
Here's more info on PO4 deficiency. PO4 deficiency really screws up the coral holobiont simbiosis and keep in mind it can take months for corals to recover. Here's a good video to start with:
And here's a list of papers to read. The first three were done with a closed system at Southampton Univeristy started over ten years ago, so longer term than is often seen. And keep in mind corals are looking at the TOTAL amount of nitrogen and phosphate available, organic, inorganic, dissolved and particulate. PO4 and Nitrate are small parts of the overall nitrogen and phosphorus picture the coral holobiont is working with.
Phosphate deficiency promotes coral bleaching and is reflected by the ultrastructure of symbiotic dinoflagellates
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0025326X17301601?via=ihub
Nitrate enrichment can increase the susceptibility of reef corals to bleaching
http://www.indiaenvironmentportal.org.in/files/file/Nutrient enrichment.pdf
Ultrastructural Biomarkers in Symbiotic Algae Reflect the Availability of Dissolved Inorganic Nutrients and Particulate Food to the Reef Coral Holobiont
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fmars.2015.00103/full
High phosphate uptake requirements of the scleractinian coral Stylophora pistillata
http://jeb.biologists.org/content/214/16/2749.full
Increased phosphate increases growth
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022098111004588
Here's two quotes from two preeminate coral reef researchers:
"When I see the colors of some of these low nutrient tanks, I can't help but be reminded of bleached coral reefs. It should therefore not come as a surprise that feeding corals in such systems becomes a very important component in these systems. Though reefs are often catagorized as nutrient "deserts" the influx of nutrients in the form of particulates and plankton is quite high when the total volume of water passing over a reef is taken into consideration.
Our crystal-clear aquaria do not come close to the nutrient loads that swirl around natural reefs. And so when we create low-nutrient water conditions, we still have to deal with the rest of a much more complex puzzle. Much like those who run their aquarium water temperature close to the thermal maximums of corals walk a narrow tight rope, I can't help but think that low-nutrient aquariums may be headed down a similar path." Charles Delbeck, Coral Nov/Dec 2010, pg 127
"Imported nutrients are usually transported to reefs from rivers; but if there are no rivers, as with reefs remote from land masses, nutrients can only come from surface ocean circulation. Often this supply is poor, and thus the vast ocean expanses have been refered to as "nutrient deserts". The Indo-Pacific has many huge atolls in these supposed deserts which testify to the resilience of reefs, but the corals themselves may lack the lush appearance of those of more fertile waters. Many reefs have another major supply of inorganic nutrients as, under certain conditions, surface currents moving against a reef face may cause deep ocean water to be drawn to the surface. This "upwelled" water is often rich in phosphorus and other essential chemicals." J. E. N. Veron "Corals of Austrailia and the Indo-Pacific" pg 30
Conkrite, et al, 1999 gives much higher phosphate levels for the ocean surface than the .003 mg/l sometimes recommended
https://gmao.gsfc.nasa.gov/research/oceanbiology/reprints/conkrightetal_DSR1999.pdf
You’re alk is fine, but you’re artificially stripping your water and you don’t have enough light/spread. Even if your par is adequate your getting led hot spotting because the fixture is too low and the UV and Violet are too high. I love the videos the BRS guys do but the Radion to hydra sps ab+ Settings killed all my acros.
@hart24601 your tank is amazing. It’s awesome and encouraging to see a fellow hydra user getting such amazing growth and color.
@hart24601 your tank is amazing. It’s awesome and encouraging to see a fellow hydra user getting such amazing growth and color.
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IslandLifeReef
Valuable Member
I am going to reduce the amount of carbon dosing that I do, but I am hesitant on cutting it out completely because the last time I tried, it reeked havoc on my tank. The light setting I am using is the same one my LFS uses with the same light and they have no trouble with their Acro's. The reason I am going to go back to the Alk dosing I was using before is that my tank looked great then, and even the Acro I am having trouble with now managed to heal from shipping damage. I am considering adding a light like you suggested, but I am going to wait and see what happens with the change I am making.
Thank you again for all of your help and suggestions. It's hard knowing which ones to follow due to the fact that everyones tank is different. Some carbon dose, some run multiple reactors, and some run chaeto (don't those turn your fingers orange, but they are good
) Your tank pictures are amazing BTW.
TexasTodd
Valuable Member
Yeah, definitely NOT growth tips! Thanks for the better photo.
Lots of advice here.
What is your RO/DI at for TDS? Do you make it or get from a store?
Stop using NoPox unless you test and it's way too high. Even then I'd still opt for a water change.
Find someone locally with a PAR meter. Sometimes shops will loan them in addition to local clubs.
Lots of advice here.
What is your RO/DI at for TDS? Do you make it or get from a store?
Stop using NoPox unless you test and it's way too high. Even then I'd still opt for a water change.
Find someone locally with a PAR meter. Sometimes shops will loan them in addition to local clubs.
Never mind. You stated the same in your previous comment. I’m only so confident because I also watched every acro I had stn. As soon as I increased par/spread and stopped stripping my nutrients everything turned around. Look at the label on your nopox. It states that sps frags should have 0.08 phosphates. Your acros are starving because the nopox is competing for nutrients and there isn’t adequate par from the single fixture. Do you have a par meter?
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IslandLifeReef
Valuable Member
A couple of tanks with Hydra 26HD's.
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IslandLifeReef
Valuable Member
I get my RO/DI water as well as my salt water from my LFS. It reads 0 TDS.
I have reduced the amount of NoPoX already, and will slowly try to wean my tank off of it.
I've looked around locally for a PAR meter with no luck. My LFS uses the same light setting on their Hydra 26 with the same tank and have great Acro growth in their tank.
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IslandLifeReef
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I am going to try to raise my nutrients by slowly reducing the NoPoX. The last time my tank went cold turkey, it had withdraw
. No one has said whether they think this frag can recover. Do you think it can?
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