Why i can't keep stony corals?

[Gligor]

Hello everybody. My tank is 1 year old, I started with live rock, and live sand, my parameters are stable from the beginning, but I'm struggling with keeping any type of SPS or LPS coral alive. I'm using Aquaforrest Reef Salt, and RO/DI water. I don't use any type of GFO or nitrate or phosphate remover. I only use activated carbon for chemical filtration. I use UVC as well. Filter sock and skimmer for mechanical, and matrix for bio filtration. Waterchanges 25% every 2-3 weeks. I only dose Alkalinity to keep it stable. Coralline is growing everywhere as well as very tiny white dots like microscopic snails.
I feed mysis, krill, nori, brine flakes.
I feed dry phyto to my corals.
My parameters:
Nitrate - 25
Phosphate - 0.03
Alkalinity - 8.5
Salinity - 1.025

That's how far I've come with my testing.
First I tried plating monti, it started to grow and encrust to the rock for about 2 months, and then died. Then I got hollywood stunner chalice, it thrived for a month and a half, then started to lose tissue and died in 4 days (you can see it in the picture, on the sandbed I took the photo when he started to lose tissue).
I also have trumpet coral, 2 heads died, the other 2 are holding up, but they aren't reproducing or growing (i have it for 6 months).
What am I doing wrong?

 

[bryanfuel1]

What’s your lighting setup?

 

[Tahoe61]

You're not testing Calcium and Magnesium ever?
What test methods are you using?

 

[Gligor]

What’s your lighting setup?

I have 2 blades Aquamedic light 2x54w my tank is 50 gal, the spectrum is solid, the BTA is in this tank for over 7 months.

You're not testing Calcium and Magnesium ever?
What test methods are you using?

No, I've never tested calcium and magnesium, both times I was told that water changes will be sufficient for those small frags, and that they are extremely hardy.

 

[Lavey29]

I have 2 blades Aquamedic light 2x54w my tank is 50 gal, the spectrum is solid, the BTA is in this tank for over 7 months.

No, I've never tested calcium and magnesium, both times I was told that water changes will be sufficient for those small frags, and that they are extremely hardy.

With all the coralline your calcium level is probably very depleted.

 

[Pistondog]

If you have to dose alk, you are also using calcium.
Get the red sea pro kit that has alk, calcium and magnesium all in one.
You are right to try plating monti, red is easiest sps.
You have to test those params to know what you are dealing with.

Edit, also looks like you could use more flow

 

[Stevorino]

My money is on Calcium as well.... looking forward to hearing those Calc/Mag numbers :)

 

[Gligor]

With all the coralline your calcium level is probably very depleted.

You're right, I haven't thought about that. When I started the tank, the rocks were kept in FOWLR supm, so they didn't had any coralline, they only had a lot of sponges and small feather dusters. All the coraline grew in my tank.

If you have to dose alk, you are also using calcium.
Get the red sea pro kit that has alk, calcium and magnesium all in one.
You are right to try plating monti, red is easiest sps.
You have to test those params to know what you are dealing with.

Edit, also looks like you could use more flow

I don't think that they have the Red sea pro kit, or Tropic marin All for reef here. But they have magnesium and calcium separate, so I will get those, as well as the test kits.

But I was wondering if there is deficiency of calcium and magnesium, won't the corals live and don't grow? I mean, I had the red plating monti and hollywood chalice that thrived and grew for more or less than 2 months, and then they just died for less than a week. (I didn't had them at the same time, first I got the monti, and after it died, 2 months later I got the challice)

 

[CHSUB]

Source your corals from growers/people with high no3. Nutrients, no3 specifically, that high will only support corals that are already conditioned to a polluted environment.

 

[Gligor]

Source your corals from growers/people with high no3. Nutrients, no3 specifically, that high will only support corals that are already conditioned to a polluted environment.

Yes, but I don't thing that No3 is the problem, and from what I've read these numbers are not that high. Because like I said before, these corals lived and started growing almost immediately after I introduced them for around 2 months, and then all of a sudden they started losing tissue and died. There were no swings in NO3 and PO4.

 

[Lavey29]

Yes, but I don't thing that No3 is the problem, and from what I've read these numbers are not that high. Because like I said before, these corals lived and started growing almost immediately after I introduced them for around 2 months, and then all of a sudden they started losing tissue and died. There were no swings in NO3 and PO4.

Corals decline from the inside out. They can be struggling for months before they show visible signs of stress. Alk and cal deplete proportionally. Magnesium depletes at 1/10th the ratio of the other 2. Weekly water changes can typically suffice for awhile but eventually if you have enough corals, daily dosing of alk and cal is required. I suggest you rent a par meter also and par map your tank.

 

[Liquid361]

I’d say light, flow, and cal.

 

[CHSUB]

Yes, but I don't thing that No3 is the problem, and from what I've read these numbers are not that high. Because like I said before, these corals lived and started growing almost immediately after I introduced them for around 2 months, and then all of a sudden they started losing tissue and died. There were no swings in NO3 and PO4.

It’s certainly not helping. The higher you go the fewer corals will survive. Your explanation of how your corals die is typical of a problem. Sure, some people have success with elevated nutrient levels but lower is better, maybe 5 ppm and eliminate that potential problem. I would also test calcium to eliminate that potential problem.

 

[Gligor]

It’s certainly not helping. The higher you go the fewer corals will survive. Your explanation of how your corals die is typical of a problem. Sure, some people have success with elevated nutrient levels but lower is better, maybe 5 ppm and eliminate that potential problem. I would also test calcium to eliminate that potential problem.

I don't feel ready to start experimenting with chemical removal of NO3 or PO4 yet, and to be honest I don't really want to, because I think that I'm going to create more problems. This is my first reef tank, so I don't have the experience as well.
My goal is to accomplish balanced and stable system with as little as possible chemical filtration. In the following months I'm going to upgrade to 180gal because I have a blue tang and triggerfish as well. so that will be my next challenge. I'm going to make a refugium to keep the parameters in check.
Btw, the store that I'm getting my corals from has NO3 - 30ppm, and PO4 - 0.2, and the corals are thriving and growing like crazy. The guy doesn't even use RO/DI water in his shop...

I’d say light, flow, and cal.

The tank has high, mid and low flow area, I spent a lot of time perfecting it. I don't know the PAR, but I'm sure that I have the correct spectrum for optimal coral growth. I modified the LEDs on my lights to hit Chlorophyll A, Chlorophyll C, and Peridinin.
The calcium is unchecked...

Corals decline from the inside out. They can be struggling for months before they show visible signs of stress. Alk and cal deplete proportionally. Magnesium depletes at 1/10th the ratio of the other 2. Weekly water changes can typically suffice for awhile but eventually if you have enough corals, daily dosing of alk and cal is required. I suggest you rent a par meter also and par map your tank.

I live in North Macedonia, there is no PAR meter here... I go to Greece to buy fish corals and everything else...

 

[CHSUB]

Btw, the store that I'm getting my corals from has NO3 - 30ppm, and PO4 - 0.2, and the corals are thriving and growing like crazy. The guy doesn't even use RO/DI water in his shop...

I’m skeptical of your guy.

I don't feel ready to start experimenting with chemical removal of NO3 or PO4

I’m not suggesting using chemicals. A properly set up reef aquarium can easily maintain low levels of inorganic nutrients with good management. Trying to maintain a well balanced reef aquarium with a trigger is a difficult balancing act starting with the “right” fish….

 

[Liquid361]

I saw what you listed for lighting. I’d say that’s not enough for SPS, but to each his own. Best wishes and good luck!

 

[Gligor]

I’m skeptical of your guy.

I’m not suggesting using chemicals. A properly set up reef aquarium can easily maintain low levels of inorganic nutrients with good management. Trying to maintain a well balanced reef aquarium with a trigger is a difficult balancing act starting with the “right” fish….

Yeah, the trigger was an impulse buy, but I always wanted to have one. He is small though, less tanh 2 inches.

I saw what you listed for lighting. I’d say that’s not enough for SPS, but to each his own. Best wishes and good luck!

Thank you. My lights are set pretty low, and I keep 2 anemones, so I don't think that's the problem. Besides that, the chalice is not a light demanding coral after he started losing tissue, i moved him higher, but nothing changed. The monti cap was set at the same level as the Anemone

 

[Mwatts12]

To give an example for lighting. I have a 20 inch high tank. My lights are hung 8 inches off water line.

2 reefbrites on for 12 hours, 4bulb t5 for 10 hours and 4 XR30 pros at 80% for 8 hours.

So, for 8 hours my tank is cookin with light. The acros appreciate it.

 

[hippolad]

Anemones release chemicals into the water to gain room as well as stinging ( chemical warfare)
Those nems in your tank look quite large.

Live long and prosper :)

 

[Dburr1014]

Hello everybody. My tank is 1 year old, I started with live rock, and live sand, my parameters are stable from the beginning, but I'm struggling with keeping any type of SPS or LPS coral alive. I'm using Aquaforrest Reef Salt, and RO/DI water. I don't use any type of GFO or nitrate or phosphate remover.

I only use activated carbon for chemical filtration.

How often? If it's 24/7, stop. Take it out for a couple weeks.

I use UVC as well.

Why are you using this? Can it be that's cleaning your tank to well? I would shut it off for a couple months and try again.

Filter sock

Again, 24/7? Take them out for a week.

and skimmer for mechanical, and matrix for bio filtration. Waterchanges 25% every 2-3 weeks. I only dose Alkalinity to keep it stable. Coralline is growing everywhere as well as very tiny white dots like microscopic snails.
I feed mysis, krill, nori, brine flakes.
I feed dry phyto to my corals.
My parameters:
Nitrate - 25
Phosphate - 0.03

This is the bottom end for coral survivability. Can you bump it up? I suppose if you do all the things I suggested, it will come up on its own.

Alkalinity - 8.5
Salinity - 1.025

That's how far I've come with my testing.
First I tried plating monti, it started to grow and encrust to the rock for about 2 months, and then died. Then I got hollywood stunner chalice, it thrived for a month and a half, then started to lose tissue and died in 4 days (you can see it in the picture, on the sandbed I took the photo when he started to lose tissue).
I also have trumpet coral, 2 heads died, the other 2 are holding up, but they aren't reproducing or growing (i have it for 6 months).
What am I doing wrong?

Is that cayano i see? That is usually caused by nutrient in balance. Which you have.

I can't tell you how dirty my tank really is. Not in nutrients, just dirty.
My po4 is between 0.1 and 0.2 and no3 is normally zero. My fish feed my coral so I have some.
Dirty meaning, I do socks when I clean my sand bed, it gets all the particles that go in the overflow.
I don't remember last time I did carbon. I ran out last year when I switched tanks. I bought some and been meaning to put some in the sump but I've been busy. Maybe this weekend I'll get to it.
Yeah, my tanks dirty. My glass is dirty. My wife made a mess around my tank with trying to get rid of Christmas stuff, she has a lot and I love the effort. Sorry to wander.

Just let the tank do it's thing, the ocean is NOT clean. Why do we strive to make our tank clean? I don't get it.

My resume, last nights pics, unfiltered, dirty glass and all.