Zombies?? Fish coming back from the dead

[KEEVlllNN]

Hi all,

I've been keeping salt and freshwater fish for about 15yrs now and I have never had this happen. My healthy tang randomly had spasms and was upside down being carried across the tank by the current. It was breathing heavily and was upside down stuck in the rock work and wouldnt react to touch. I accepted he wouldnt make it and decided to come back later to scoop him out the tank. When I came back an hr later it was completely fine and eating again like nothing happened?? I thought this was a freak incident but a few days later my other tang and royal gramma had the exact same behavior.. lifeless upside down and not reacting to touch. An hour or so passes and they're back to eating. Any thoughts??

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi all,

I've been keeping salt and freshwater fish for about 15yrs now and I have never had this happen. My healthy tang randomly had spasms and was upside down being carried across the tank by the current. It was breathing heavily and was upside down stuck in the rock work and wouldnt react to touch. I accepted he wouldnt make it and decided to come back later to scoop him out the tank. When I came back an hr later it was completely fine and eating again like nothing happened?? I thought this was a freak incident but a few days later my other tang and royal gramma had the exact same behavior.. lifeless upside down and not reacting to touch. An hour or so passes and they're back to eating. Any thoughts??

Sounds like you for some reason had spikes which are very short term and their O2 levels or saturated oxygen content was restored. Best news is that they are normal. I see nitrite noted- Are these Api Kits ?

 

[Soren]

That seems strange... is there any chance you have or had low oxygen levels in the tank?
Normally, I would agree that stray voltage does not effect the fish, but maybe stray voltage is messing with their lateral line sensing systems? This seems a far shot in the dark, but maybe worth checking.

I'm really not sure about your case.

#reefsquad @Jay Hemdal

 

[KEEVlllNN]

Sounds like you for some reason had spikes which are very short term and their O2 levels or saturated oxygen content was restored. Best news is that they are normal. I see nitrite noted- Are these Api Kits ?

I'm not sure what test kits they are I can find out though. Its from my LFS. And I was also leaning towards oxygen levels but I'm not sure how to measure that or restore it to normal? My tank has pretty high flow.

 

[KEEVlllNN]

That seems strange... is there any chance you have or had low oxygen levels in the tank?
Normally, I would agree that stray voltage does not effect the fish, but maybe stray voltage is messing with their lateral line sensing systems? This seems a far shot in the dark, but maybe worth checking.

I'm really not sure about your case.

#reefsquad @Jay Hemdal

I was thinking low oxygen or stray voltage as well. I'm not sure how to measure oxygen levels in a tank though. Weird thing is it only affects one fish at a time several days apart.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I'm not sure what test kits they are I can find out though. Its from my LFS. And I was also leaning towards oxygen levels but I'm not sure how to measure that or restore it to normal? My tank has pretty high flow.

Water change will help as will addition of air stone

 

[Soren]

I was thinking low oxygen or stray voltage as well. I'm not sure how to measure oxygen levels in a tank though. Weird thing is it only affects one fish at a time several days apart.

Sorry I'm not of more specific use...

Does your system have a sump?
Does the flow break up the water surface with a lot of agitation?
Do you have mesh lids, glass lids, no lid, etc.?
Do you use a skimmer on your system?
Does the room in which the system resides have good air exchange?
At what temperature do you run your system?

These all can affect oxygen levels.

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

For measuring oxygen:

SALIFERT Aquarium Oxygen Test Kit - Chewy.com

Buy Salifert Aquarium Oxygen Test Kit at Chewy.com. FREE shipping and the BEST customer service!

www.chewy.com

HI3810 Dissolved Oxygen Test Kit

The HI3810 is a chemical test kit for the determination of dissolved oxygen.

www.hannainst.com

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hi all,

I've been keeping salt and freshwater fish for about 15yrs now and I have never had this happen. My healthy tang randomly had spasms and was upside down being carried across the tank by the current. It was breathing heavily and was upside down stuck in the rock work and wouldnt react to touch. I accepted he wouldnt make it and decided to come back later to scoop him out the tank. When I came back an hr later it was completely fine and eating again like nothing happened?? I thought this was a freak incident but a few days later my other tang and royal gramma had the exact same behavior.. lifeless upside down and not reacting to touch. An hour or so passes and they're back to eating. Any thoughts??

I've never seen fish do that and recover. I did have a parrot though, that if startled, would drop unconscious to the cage floor....seemingly dead. A few hours later it would be up on its perch eating seed. It did that a few times and then did actually die. In that case, I presume it was a cardiac issue.

I have had fish drop dead from even a minor scare - these were fish that had fatty liver disease and had been compensating for that. When we tried to net them up, they just went catatonic and died in a few minutes.

I don't want to guess at what is going on here, but it isn't from "stray" or induced voltage. That gets blamed for a lot of things, it is though, a sort of "bogeyman" and gets attributed to any problem of unknown cause (grin). Now - if the tank has an intermittent short circuit, that could be an issue, both for you and the fish. Is the tank of a GFCI protected circuit? If so, that isn't the issue. If not, and if, say there is a short circuit in something that turns on and off (usually a heater) you *might* see neurologic issues in fish in that tank.

I really doubt that it is a water quality issue or low dissolved oxygen, those issues don't randomly come and go - something would have to change and you would be aware of that I think.

Jay


Jay

 

[MnFish1]

It would seem to be some anesthetic chemical (outside the tank) - or - ammonia or oxygen or CO2. You alkalinity is LOW - and your pH is LOW - which will protect to a degree against ammonia - so lets forget that. Oxygen SHOULD affect every fish the same way - as should CO2 - that leaves a chemical - which you do not know about - so let's toss that out. My guess is that it's a low alkalinity - (i.e. low buffering capacity) - resulting in Co2 narcosis - and subsequent recovery. Oxygen - unless you changed something should not have an affect. And in thinking about it - unless there were some CO2 event in your house (more people, crowded conditions, etc) - neither should that - but I'm going to put my money on CO2

 

[KEEVlllNN]

Looks like everyone is leaning towards low oxygen, but wouldn't that affect the whole tank? I also want to note I have a large anemone in the tank, this is a mixed reef. Is it possible the fish got stung and temporarily paralyzed? Tank setup is not the issue I've been keeping fish for a long time and I have done the basic troubleshooting. I'll try to slowly bring the Alk up to par and see.

 

[Pridedcloth3]

Looks like everyone is leaning towards low oxygen, but wouldn't that affect the whole tank? I also want to note I have a large anemone in the tank, this is a mixed reef. Is it possible the fish got stung and temporarily paralyzed? Tank setup is not the issue I've been keeping fish for a long time and I have done the basic troubleshooting. I'll try to slowly bring the Alk up to par and see.

I'm wondering if there's something stinging them into a temporary paralysis.

 

[brandon429]

I would rule out ammonia as a causative in all display reef tank challenges, especially fully stocked ones with other fish swimming around + corals + live rock. it's never going to be your cycle even if api or red sea disagrees and says .2

 

[MnFish1]

Looks like everyone is leaning towards low oxygen, but wouldn't that affect the whole tank? I also want to note I have a large anemone in the tank, this is a mixed reef. Is it possible the fish got stung and temporarily paralyzed? Tank setup is not the issue I've been keeping fish for a long time and I have done the basic troubleshooting. I'll try to slowly bring the Alk up to par and see.

Re-read my reply

 

[MnFish1]

Looks like everyone is leaning towards low oxygen, but wouldn't that affect the whole tank? I also want to note I have a large anemone in the tank, this is a mixed reef. Is it possible the fish got stung and temporarily paralyzed? Tank setup is not the issue I've been keeping fish for a long time and I have done the basic troubleshooting. I'll try to slowly bring the Alk up to par and see.

BTW - I think this is a CO2 issue. Not an oxygen issue - your alkalinity (i.e. the buffer for acid for Co2) - is quite low. Once it reaches a certain point - it's just not redcoverable. - UNLESS - the lights come on - and the Co2 is removed, etc etc - there are numerous possibilities. I'm going to phone a friend @Jay Hemdal

 

[blackhole88]

Hi all,

I've been keeping salt and freshwater fish for about 15yrs now and I have never had this happen. My healthy tang randomly had spasms and was upside down being carried across the tank by the current. It was breathing heavily and was upside down stuck in the rock work and wouldnt react to touch. I accepted he wouldnt make it and decided to come back later to scoop him out the tank. When I came back an hr later it was completely fine and eating again like nothing happened?? I thought this was a freak incident but a few days later my other tang and royal gramma had the exact same behavior.. lifeless upside down and not reacting to touch. An hour or so passes and they're back to eating. Any thoughts??

I’ve sadly encountered this several times I owned and operated huge saltwater fish store in south Florida and ordered fish directly from the countries of origin bypassing wholesalers. Anyway I first encountered this issue with a salicin tang. Would die or appear to die every time I went to catch him once I even discarded him only to hear him flopping in garbage pale. Long story short I encountered this again and again and after some harsh conversations with guys catching the fish I finally learned there was one only one collector using poison to collect fish I went over all invoices n sure enough every fish that suffered this was indeed caught by that specific guy. It’s some sort of nerve paralyzing substance and unfortunately there was no remedy. One of the tangs lived almost a year but most only a few months. Sad but true.

 

[surfcreatr]

Sounds like you for some reason had spikes which are very short term and their O2 levels or saturated oxygen content was restored. Best news is that they are normal. I see nitrite noted- Are these Api Kits ?

Try to create more bubbles in tank. Recently I had my purple rhinopias acting really weird going to the top of tank, and swimming a lot more, which is very unusual for him

I lowered water level in tank so return hoses will make more bubbles, since doing that he has returned to normal

 

[vetteguy53081]

Try to create more bubbles in tank. Recently I had my purple rhinopias acting really weird going to the top of tank, and swimming a lot more, which is very unusual for him

I lowered water level in tank so return hoses will make more bubbles, since doing that he has returned to normal

Great to hear

 

[KEEVlllNN]

I’ve sadly encountered this several times I owned and operated huge saltwater fish store in south Florida and ordered fish directly from the countries of origin bypassing wholesalers. Anyway I first encountered this issue with a salicin tang. Would die or appear to die every time I went to catch him once I even discarded him only to hear him flopping in garbage pale. Long story short I encountered this again and again and after some harsh conversations with guys catching the fish I finally learned there was one only one collector using poison to collect fish I went over all invoices n sure enough every fish that suffered this was indeed caught by that specific guy. It’s some sort of nerve paralyzing substance and unfortunately there was no remedy. One of the tangs lived almost a year but most only a few months. Sad but true.

Interesting... I hope this is not the case. But I bought the 3 fish from 2 different vendors. Can you say which country your fish came from?

 

[KEEVlllNN]

BTW - I think this is a CO2 issue. Not an oxygen issue - your alkalinity (i.e. the buffer for acid for Co2) - is quite low. Once it reaches a certain point - it's just not redcoverable. - UNLESS - the lights come on - and the Co2 is removed, etc etc - there are numerous possibilities. I'm going to phone a friend @Jay Hemdal

Sorry, I did read your first comment completely wrong lol