All Corals Dying

[Project1004]

Using vodka to lower your nitrate is fine….

It’s the after method of these bacteria’s are not being removed from your tank and your tank is probably not suitable. Having oversized skimmer is needed for carbon dosing in most case. So like many say. Water change is a must.

 

[bikerbutter]

My tank is around 6 months old, it's my 3rd attempt to add a batch of LPS corals that i'm adding to the tank, and everything is dead within 2 hours, except the Zoas.

I'm thinking the issue is either the Bayer pest killer that I dip them in before, (10 ML per cup of tank water for 5 min) or that I don't do water changes, but my numbers look good.

below are my numbers
NO3 10, PO4 .03, CA 400, ALK 10, PH 7.5.

I dose Vodka for Carbon Dosing. and I never did a water change.

Do you think the issue is with the Bayer coral dip? Or that I don't do water changes? Or maybe I should make a ICP test? Or maybe I still need to wait a bit

Need something to explain everything dying so quick.

Thank you very much for your help.

Some corals including certain zoantage can release toxins that build up in the water. This can build up over time and nuke the tank. Not saying that this is your problem, but just offering one plausible alternative. In my opinion water changes are necessary and vital in keeping toxins from building up in the water and keeping our aquatic Life healthy and happy.

 

[bikerbutter]

I just don't have the time for it.

I can do a 4 gallon change on our 36 gallon in about 20 minutes. That's with mixing up the salt water and everything. There have been times when I have been lazy or slack in my responsibilities and I have noticed that the corals would not be quite so perky looking. We really love our creatures and want them to be happy and prosperous in their environment.

 

[Fanreef]

So the consensus from everyone is that the issue is looking to be in the no water change?

 

[jgabbsxx]

At the beginning of my reefing journey, I did the same thing and have since learned. I thought water changes were completely unnecessary because I would just top-off whatever water had evaporated throughout the week. Then I experienced a bunch of algae/bacterial blooms, my numbers were all wacky, and you could just tell my corals were unhappy (specifically my LPS).

I suggest take the 15/20 minutes out of one of your days to water change and you will probably see a huge difference!

 

[Macdaddynick1]

So the consensus from everyone is that the issue is looking to be in the no water change?

I think there’s a little more to it. Most of us have been in your shoes. When most people start reefing, they think they can mold the tank to fit their lifestyle. I know I thought that way in the beginning too. But the reality is, it doesn’t work like that — the tank dictates what you need to do, not the other way around. Accepting that is one of the most important parts of being successful in this hobby.

There’s a reason why about 95% of reefers do regular water changes. It’s the simplest, most effective way to keep things stable.

Here is a quote I heard, I can’t recall who said it but , “As reef-keepers we don’t keep corals we keep water”. If your water is good 99% of the time your corals are good.

I personally hate doing water changes, and I love acropora. Recently I started losing them 1 by 1. Did an ICP test, just to find out that I have ton of heavy meatballs, Zinc, Tin, Copper, Vandium, you name it. Guess what the best solution is?! Yup, water changes. I have no choice in this matter. On top of that I had to spend hours removing every rusty screw around my tank, painting and covering things in hopes of preventing further contamination.

My vote is, get rid of vodka dosing, I’ve killed more corals with carbon dosing than with heavy metals in my system. Change bunch of water, and add one coral to test.

MOST IMPORTANTLY, do you rinse your corals for a while after dipping them in bayer? Or do you just dip them in bayer then put them directly into the tank? That stuff is nasty, if it gets into the system, it will kill corals and all inverts.

 

[js-3Design]

I think there’s a little more to it. Most of us have been in your shoes. When most people start reefing, they think they can mold the tank to fit their lifestyle. I know I thought that way in the beginning too. But the reality is, it doesn’t work like that — the tank dictates what you need to do, not the other way around. Accepting that is one of the most important parts of being successful in this hobby.

There’s a reason why about 95% of reefers do regular water changes. It’s the simplest, most effective way to keep things stable.

Here is a quote I heard, I can’t recall who said it but , “As reef-keepers we don’t keep corals we keep water”. If your water is good 99% of the time your corals are good.

I personally hate doing water changes, and I love acropora. Recently I started losing them 1 by 1. Did an ICP test, just to find out that I have ton of heavy meatballs, Zinc, Tin, Copper, Vandium, you name it. Guess what the best solution is?! Yup, water changes. I have no choice in this matter. On top of that I had to spend hours removing every rusty screw around my tank, painting and covering things in hopes of preventing further contamination.

My vote is, get rid of vodka dosing, I’ve killed more corals with carbon dosing than with heavy metals in my system. Change bunch of water, and add one coral to test.

MOST IMPORTANTLY, do you rinse your corals for a while after dipping them in bayer? Or do you just dip them in bayer then put them directly into the tank? That stuff is nasty, if it gets into the system, it will kill corals and all inverts.

Can you send a picture of how a ton of heavy meatballs look in a aquarium ? hahaha

jokes aside, you are absolutly correct:)

 

[Macdaddynick1]

Can you send a picture of how a ton of heavy meatballs look in a aquarium ? hahaha

jokes aside, you are absolutly correct:)

I’m not fixing that. Lmaooo. That’s hilarious.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

So the consensus from everyone is that the issue is looking to be in the no water change?

Thats not what I got out of this thread.

Since you did the same thing 3 times and got the same result 3 times, everyone suggested you do it differently.

Change the water regularly, use something else besides a bayer dip, and cut out the vodka dosing for a while.

 

[schooncw]

I believe that water changes are not effiecent, timewise, moneywise and envorimently

Makes sense, I'll do this. thank you very much!

I have been in the hobby for my entire life and in the aquatic industry for many years. I believe in regular water changes with quality salt, no matter your nutrient levels.
Proactivity is the key in this hobby; don't wait for a problem, head it off and IMO, W/C's are crucial for this.
Seems to me, that whatever you are doing/not doing now, IS not efficient in any regard.

 

[Rixar]

I don't understand why you add vodka

Most new people don't succeed with their aquariums because they add a lot of things that don't make sense.

Stop adding things to your aquarium, do several water changes to refresh the water in the system, and then make the decision to do one change a week.

If nitrates in your new aquarium are very high, something is wrong: poor circulation, too many fish, low phosphate...

Once you fix those things, I'll simply leave the aquarium alone, touching it only once a week to change the water and make some small changes. Don't touch the aquarium, forget it exists, just observe it.

The only products I see as necessary are KH, CA, and food. If you can't maintain your nutrients, some NO3 and PO4, the rest of the things, in my experience (15 years), are not necessary.

 

[BrettMallette]

My big question is how did you get to 75ppm Nitrates in the first place to think it warranted vodka. Can we start there OP... What all do you have in the tank currently that arent coral?

 

[RobertK]

I doubt its the Bayer. I've dipped dozens of frags (both LPS and SPS) in Bayer using the same amount as you and never lost a coral that quickly.

 

[Reginald Reefer III]

Lots of good comments on here, but I think there might be something going on with the 10+dkh alk and very low phosphates. If the vodka dosing is putting the bacteria into overdrive and processing PO4 very quickly, that high dkh is going to really stress any stony coral type and starve it.

I would get your alk down to 8ish while your nutrients are out of whack.

 

[schooncw]

I don't understand why you add vodka

Most new people don't succeed with their aquariums because they add a lot of things that don't make sense.

Stop adding things to your aquarium, do several water changes to refresh the water in the system, and then make the decision to do one change a week.

If nitrates in your new aquarium are very high, something is wrong: poor circulation, too many fish, low phosphate...

Once you fix those things, I'll simply leave the aquarium alone, touching it only once a week to change the water and make some small changes. Don't touch the aquarium, forget it exists, just observe it.

The only products I see as necessary are KH, CA, and food. If you can't maintain your nutrients, some NO3 and PO4, the rest of the things, in my experience (15 years), are not necessary.

If you don't understand why vodka is added, research carbon dosing. It makes perfect sense and is not just for nutrient reduction but is an optimal way to feed corals.

 

[n3ttst3r]

As someone who doesn’t do many water changes in a year- that’s not for new tanks new tanks I’m changing water weekly until the tank is fully established and matured THEN I taper them back and monitor things and dose as needed it’s not a straight no water changes from the get go, as a tank matured trace elements are used up a lot faster to build the colonies of the good stuff up, you need to be replenishing that with water changes or everything will stall out and you’ll run into problems, once everything is matured out coraline is coating all the things etc THEN I taper back and test everything to figure out what’s being depleted at what rates and dose, and then any changes to the tank (new coral fish etc) I start testing again to see how the needs of the tank has changed and adjust dosing accordingly, I wouldn’t dream of no water changes on a 6 month tank, assuming I started the system with fresh live rock off an existing established mature tank I’d still be hesitant to flip it to minimal water changes because everything else in the tank is still maturing at that point.

 

[Dom]

> I believe that water changes are not effiecent, timewise, moneywise and envorimently

You know what's a big waste of time? Spending time selecting corals that die in hours. You know what's a big waste of money? Buying a lot of corals and then watching them die in hours. You know what's a big environmental waste? Taking a lot of corals out of the ocean and then having them die in your tank.

Bravo!

 

[bikerbutter]

Bravo!

Well said.

 

[Coral Memere]

How about some macro algae in your sump for nitrate control? It controlled mine right out of existence (bringing different problems).

I've read about more people crashing everything with vodka dosing for instant gratification-type nitrate control...before I did the research, I did too. Yes, carbon dosing, like TM NP bacto, is a good way to feed corals, but not when you can't keep them alive.

As for what's killing the OP's immediately? I'm truly stumped. I've killed many a coral... But never immediately. Unless we're not getting the whole process of your acclimation, it would have to be your dip... Too much? Too long? Iodine works fine and also disinfects. Plus you really can't leave it in "too long". I moved into trying food-grade KCl and other things, like Reef Primer. They all work about the same, IMO.

Good luck and keep us posted. Aside from some who have jumped down your throat, this place is for support and learning.

Having said that, you need to do water changes... We owe it to the animals as good husbandry. Imagine you were stuck in a box swimming in (breathing) your own refuse and someone's chemicals.

 

[TCK Corals]

My tank is around 6 months old, it's my 3rd attempt to add a batch of LPS corals that i'm adding to the tank, and everything is dead within 2 hours, except the Zoas.

I'm thinking the issue is either the Bayer pest killer that I dip them in before, (10 ML per cup of tank water for 5 min) or that I don't do water changes, but my numbers look good.

below are my numbers
NO3 10, PO4 .03, CA 400, ALK 10, PH 7.5.

I dose Vodka for Carbon Dosing. and I never did a water change.

Do you think the issue is with the Bayer coral dip? Or that I don't do water changes? Or maybe I should make a ICP test? Or maybe I still need to wait a bit

Need something to explain everything dying so quick.

Thank you very much for your help.

Are you in NYS? Can you show us a photo of the back ingredients label of the bayer/bioadvance bottle?

Specifically, is it 0.72% Imidacloprid,0.36% Beta-Cyfluthrin

or Cyfluthrin 0.75%