ATI ICP Test - Results Are In!

Discussion in 'Reef Chemistry by Randy Holmes-Farley' started by tsav87, Mar 9, 2018.

  1. tsav87

    tsav87 Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    Today's the day! The day that I finally got in my ATI ICP Test Kit from @MarineDepot !

    I wanted to share my experience here with you all.

    Small background on my tank...
    70g CadLights Artisan II
    Less than a year old
    6 bulb Hamilton T5HO
    Running ATI Essentials
    Last water change was around Thanksgiving 2017. :eek:......:D

    Recent tank vid


    Here it is, the kit.
    20180309_194012340_iOS.jpg

    Inside are three plastic test tubes. Two for the tank, and one for RODI.

    The instructions say to rinse the two tubes for the tank water with tank water and then fill them up with tank water. Done.
    20180309_203618305_iOS.jpg

    The third tube says to rinse with RODI water then fill. Done. Now, I may be doing this incorrectly, but I figured for the most realistic results, I should sample the water from my ATO reservoir. I figured it was next to pointless to test it straight from the RODI unit as the water is stored in one container, then dispensed to the reservoir. I'm sure someone will let me know if that was a good idea or a goof. :)
    20180309_203808251_iOS.jpg

    And finally it was ready to go after I slapped the PREPAID (love this) shipping label onto the pouch.
    20180309_205813574_iOS.jpg

    Now the wait. The instructions stated it would be a 2-3 week wait. Stay tuned! (if anyone cares :rolleyes:)
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2018

  2. Want2BS8ed

    Want2BS8ed Active Member R2R Supporter

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    Turnaround time is usually faster. My last ATI sample was mailed on 2/27 and I had results in hand by 3/6. Pretty impressive considering it went USPS First Class from Virginia to California before being shipped to Germany and tested!
     
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  3. tsav87

    tsav87 Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    Wow! That is fast!
     
  4. tsav87

    tsav87 Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    And the results are in.

    [​IMG]

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    Last edited: Mar 20, 2018
  5. Randy Holmes-Farley

    Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Expert Contributor

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    From these results, I'd boost potassium.

    Bromide and fluoride may or may not be beneficial to boost.

    Do you use any white media, like Phosguard or MarinePure that might be releasing the aluminum?

    The barium is not a concern (IMO).

    While i do not consider it useful, the iodine is low and you might experiment with adding some and seeing if there's an obvious effect. :)
     
  6. tsav87

    tsav87 Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    Thank you Randy.

    I use Sechem's Pond Matrix and Brightwell's NO3 export brick. Are the aluminum levels of concern?
     
  7. Randy Holmes-Farley

    Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Expert Contributor

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    Those may be the source. If you have issues with leathers or other soft corals not opening like they should, the aluminum may be a concern. If not, I'd ignore it. :)
     
  8. tsav87

    tsav87 Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    I do have leather corals, they open, but maybe not as much as they should be. Hmmm...

    If I remove the media, is there any particular method to remove the aluminum other than the obvious (water change)?
     
  9. Randy Holmes-Farley

    Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Expert Contributor

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    Don't panic and solve a problem that may not exist for you.

    Triton says GFO binds aluminum, but I do not know that for a fact.

    Skimming and water changes will likely remove it over time.

    Do you have a picture? In the worst cases, leathers shrunk right up. It may not be impacting your corals.

    I had to add more aluminum (500 ug/L) than you have to see this effect:

    https://web.archive.org/web/20040313012212/https://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/july2003/chem.htm

    Figure_4thumb.jpg

    Jason had less aluminum by ICP (20 ug/L) than you do and saw this effect (which is "probably" due to the product beign tested, but might not be:
    https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/h...t-leach-lets-guess.247034/page-5#post-2910376
    [​IMG]

    Figure_4thumb.jpg
     
  10. tsav87

    tsav87 Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    Alright, let's look at raising Iodine.

    The bottle of brightwell says 1ml will raise 1 gallon by 4 ppm.

    I have 70 gallons of water (guesstimating)

    My current level is at 24.69 µg/l and needs to be 63.50 µg/l

    38.82 µg/l should be equal to 0.03882 ppm.

    @Randy Holmes-Farley, would my calculations be correct to say that I need to add 0.67935 mL to raise it to 63.50 µg/l? That doesn't seem like much at all to add to 70 gallons of water.
     
  11. tsav87

    tsav87 Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    And Potassium

    The bottle of brightwell says 1ml will raise 1 gallon by 21 ppm.

    Again, I have 70 gallons of water (guesstimating)

    My current level is at 348.5 mg/l and needs to be 398.6 mg/l

    50.09 mg/l should be equal to 50.09 ppm.

    @Randy Holmes-Farley, would my calculations be correct to say that I need to add 166.9667 mL to raise it to 398.6 mg/l?
     
  12. Land Shark

    Land Shark Valuable Member R2R Supporter Tampa Bay Reef Keepers Build Thread Contributor

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    Did your test results also include analysis of your rodi water? Just curious.
     
  13. tsav87

    tsav87 Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    Yes it did. The sugested action was to change the DI resin.
     
  14. Land Shark

    Land Shark Valuable Member R2R Supporter Tampa Bay Reef Keepers Build Thread Contributor

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    I’ve been using triton icp testing up until now. I think I’ll switch over to ATI icp going forward for the additional benefit of rodi water analysis and lower cost. Thanks for info about the suggestion to change out di resin.
     
  15. Randy Holmes-Farley

    Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Expert Contributor

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    Just be careful how you interpret the RO/DI values. It is not trivial to determine if something in the RO/DI water is an issue or not just by a raw number that may or may not be significant to the reef itself.
     
  16. Land Shark

    Land Shark Valuable Member R2R Supporter Tampa Bay Reef Keepers Build Thread Contributor

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    Will do Randy. I’m on a mission to figure out what is introducing tin at dangerously high levels according to triton. My latest icp test results are posted in my build thread (latest post). It isn’t just the numbers that have me concerned, all of my SPS are either dead, dying or looking really stressed.
     
  17. Randy Holmes-Farley

    Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Expert Contributor

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    I understand. It would just be somewhat surprising to get tin from o ppm TDS RO/DI effluent. It's not typically a big contaminant in drinkable water.
     
  18. Land Shark

    Land Shark Valuable Member R2R Supporter Tampa Bay Reef Keepers Build Thread Contributor

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    How about a TDS of 16ppm? That’s the number right now and the filters in the Rodi system are less than 90 days old. I get 0ppm when the filters are fresh but they seem to loose their effectiveness quickly.

    I actually suspect my whole house water softener system may be the culprit. When it backflushes each month, there is a stong salty taste in our drinking water the next morning. Something is wrong with it and I’m wondering if the water softener salt has tin.
     
  19. Randy Holmes-Farley

    Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Expert Contributor

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    What tin level in the tank are we talking about?

    The EPA doesn't have a specification for tin in drinking water (at least as best I can tell).

    The world health organization says in assessing tin that a "maximum value" of 2 ug/l might be assumed to be in drinking water. Assuming the RO took out 90% of it and the DI took out nothing, that would still only be 0.2 ug/L, and that would not seem the likely primary source for an existing tank that had more than a few ug/L tin.

    http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/dwq/chemicals/tin.pdf

    " For the general population, drinking-water is not a significant source of tin. Based on a maximum value of 2 µg/litre, its contribution will be 4 µg (WHO, 1980; Magos, 1986; JECFA, 1989)."
     
  20. Land Shark

    Land Shark Valuable Member R2R Supporter Tampa Bay Reef Keepers Build Thread Contributor

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    According to triton, my tank water tested Tin at 40ug/l last week. Back in June it tested at about half that amount. Is that high by your thoughts?
     
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