Baby Steps into Quarantine

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 27 (12) — Nothing new to report. Dosed Metro again today. Just a couple of doses left and then we're done with it.

QT2 (Inverts)
Water is getting much clearer after installation of air pump/foam bubbler.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 28 (13) — Noticed the watchman goby flashing this morning while feeding. Didn't see it do it the rest of the day, but I will explore a freshwater dip for it and the firefish tomorrow. We can borrow the newly acquired air pump from the invert tank for a few minutes to keep the water oxygenated.

Other than that everything is about the same.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 31 (16) — Only saw the watchman goby flash that one time, Friday morning. We did a 20% water change over the weekend, but the firefish continues to flash. So we put it in a freshwater dip for 5 minutes.

It definitely thrashed around and did not like it, but we pulled it out on time and plopped it back in the tank. I didn't notice very much come off the fish. Only these three white pieces were in the container, but I think two of them were poop or waste. They do not look like little sesame seeds to me.

After getting the firefish back in the tank we did not observe any better behavior. Still flashing. And to that point, it is flashing at the same rate as it was just prior to the FW dip.

So if we didn't knock off any flukes, and if we had just done a water change (which should have eliminated/alleviated any ammonia burn, if there was any), then the only thing I think that could be causing the flashing is a bacterial infection? Hopefully I can wait to run Prazipro after the copper is done and see if that helps.

Beyond that, we did our last tank-dose of metro tonight. Yay.

Here's where we're at:

• Observe all fish and make sure they are eating for 1 week
• Metro+Focus-soaked food for 2 weeks
• Metro tank-dosed every other day for 2 weeks
• Copper, therapeutic for 30 days (16-19 days in)
• Prazipro dosed twice 5-7 days apart
• Med-free observation period for 1-2 weeks

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAYS 32–45 (17–29) — These two weeks were pretty quiet. Outside of a couple of water changes, nothing of note occurred. Copper parameters held steady in the therapeutic range. I think the lowest I saw it was in the mid-2.30s.

None of the fish exhibited any new or different signs to worry about. Aggression was minimal to non-existent, as usual. The firefish still flashed, mostly when feeding.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 46 (30) — We made it. All 5 fish are still alive and kicking. In an effort to rid the tank of copper we did three separate water changes today of ~40% each, as well as, adding a media bag of carbon to the HOB filter. We took the opportunity with the first water change to do a normal deep clean. Wiped down the walls and bottom. Pulled the pipes and powerhead out and scrubbed them down. Cleaned out the filter and popped in some carbon to get that absorption going.

I tested the water later in the evening and copper was down to 0.46ppm. In hindsight that makes sense. Each water change was only swapping out ~40% of the copper in the tank at that time. So even though we were effectively changing 120% of the water, the reality is that we’d be left with about 18% copper in the tank.

If we wanted to get it down to 0% immediately we should have done one 100% water change. However we had nowhere to put the fish in this case. Anyway, noting that for next time—Do as big of an initial water change as you can to really knock down your copper levels.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 47 — Checked copper levels about 24 hours after the final water change and saw they had dropped to 0.36ppm. We're getting there. Planning to do another big water change here soon.

 

[thewalkingdad]

This is great, Bob. I'm all about QT.

I use the Hybrid TTM for my fish, but to each their own. It's just good to see such a solid QT process.

Keep up the good work!

 

[Bob Wiley]

Yep, was just making a note to myself to go Hybrid TTM the next time.

We just didn't have an extra tank + equipment this time to do it. But I'll have a write-up at the end of all this which should hopefully point people in an optimal direction when starting from scratch.

 

[Bob Wiley]

Oh and I should also mention that in the last couple of weeks, QT2 (Inverts) has undergone some changes as well. Most, if not all, of the snails are dead. I think this was due to (a) lack of algae growth on the rocks and walls because the tank was fresh; and (b) I've read about people not keeping hermits and snails together because the hermits will eat them. There's also a pistol shrimp in there that probably got snail-curious a time or two. If either or both of those is true, there you go. Lesson learned.

I might try again with just snails after we transfer these inverts to the DT in a few weeks because the tank has undergone an algae bloom of sorts. There's some nice browning on the glass and rocks. Water is still clear, but I think there's enough nutrition in there now to handle some snails in the future.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 49 — Copper drainage is going slowwwwwww. I did a 50+% water change this afternoon. Checked copper levels about 8 hours later and am still at 0.22ppm. I had thought about ordering some Cuprisorb earlier in the week, but figured by the time it'd get here I'd have all the copper out of the system manually, so why bother.

Anyway, with copper so low and with ample agitation at the water's surface (HOB falling water, powerhead pointed upwards, venturi hose adding air bubbles into powerhead flow), I went ahead and dosed Round 1 of Prazipro. For this 10 gallon tank, I dosed 2.5ml which ≈ 0.5 teaspoon (back of bottle says to dose 1 teaspoon per 20 gallons).

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 52 — The water in the tank got progressively cloudy over the weekend. I was hoping I could swap in new carbon this morning would alleviate it, but nope. On to Plan B: water change.

Tonight I changed out 4 gallons of water, roughly 42%. I believe this is ok because Prazi does its work in the first 24 hours and we're 3 days removed from dosing it. I would have liked to have waited another few days, done a 25% WC and dosed again, but this water was too cloudy and I was not going to lose any fish 50+ days into this thing due to a freakin' bacterial bloom.

The thing I don't understand is there was very little copper in the water (0.22ppm at last count, 3 days ago). Plus, I had both the HOB and a powerhead agitating the surface of the water, as well as a venturi nozzle on the powerhead blowing air bubbles into the water column. I would not have thought the water would have gotten cloudy this quickly.

So anyway, I did a ~40% WC tonight and have another 4 gallons mixing up overnight in anticipation of needing to do another WC sometime tomorrow. Maybe the new carbon and these water changes will drop my copper levels to non-existent by the time Prazi dose #2 happens in 3 days? Fingers crossed.

 

[Bob Wiley]

Starting to think beyond QT and planning out how to transfer the fish to the DT...

The plan for transferring is to match salinity and temp with both tanks so that I can just catch and release without having to do any acclimating.

I think we'll have the pair of clowns go first. They have been solid from the get-go. I'll do the second dose of Prazi in a few days and then watch them like a hawk for a few more days to make sure there are no outward signs of disease/parasites—which I don't anticipate. Since they are hardy fish they will be good candidates to kick my DT into high gear. It's possible we could have them in the DT within a week.

A few days to a week after the clowns go in, we'll transfer the Barnacle Blenny.

A few days to a week after that the inverts should be ready to go in, so we'll transfer them along with the Yellow Watchman Goby. That way, it and the pistol shrimp can finally pair up.

And I think we'll do the firefish last since he's been the only one we've consistently seen issues with (flashing; white, stringy poop). Keeping him in the QT tank til the end will allow us to observe him as long as possible without any medications and make sure he's doing ok before putting him in the DT.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 53 — Tank was only a little less cloudy today, so I went ahead and did another ~40% water change. All fish are still eating well.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 55 — I cannot shake this cloudy water. This week I have done three water changes of 40% — Monday, Tuesday and today. The water has not gotten clear at all. I swapped in new carbon today as well, even though it should not need changing since I just replaced it earlier this week. There should be no more Prazipro in the water (last dose was 6 days ago). And since we hit the 30 day mark with the copper (9 days ago) I've done a total of 7 water changes of 40% or more. If there was a bacterial bloom, I'd think that amount of water changes would have mitigated it, no?

Even more concerning is the yellow watchman goby is now getting red around its gills and has a little red dot on its chin. To me that says ammonia burn, despite the Seachem badge reading zero. I went ahead and dosed a couple ml of Prime (hard to tell if I was at 1 or 2 threads of liquid in the cap) into the tank in attempts to alleviate any ammonia spike that may be occurring.

And I know it's ok to dose Prime with copper in the water, but just to be sure, I ran a copper test tonight and it came back 0 (or, well, 0.06ppm which is the checker's margin of error). So, yay. No more copper. That at least eliminates a copper + Prazipro bacterial bloom causing the cloudy water.

Along with the Prime, I dumped in a couple capfuls of MicroBacter Clean. I don't know if it has any, or many, nitrifying bacteria in the bottle, but it was the only instant bacteria I have on hand. More BioSpira is coming this weekend.

Wondering if the redness could also be due to stress from all the action in the tank lately...

In other News of the Tank, the firefish must be getting picked on. We noticed a few days ago that its dorsal fin is now just a nubbin. It looks like it has a crew cut. And its caudal fin is kind of ragged. I think it might be one of the clowns as they seem to be getting territorial of their pipes. I think moving the clowns into the DT sooner rather than later is probably a good idea. Then as we move the other fish into the DT we can hang them in a specimen box to see if there is any aggression towards them from the clowns before releasing. Oh and its flashing again.

Also noticed one of the clowns had a long, stringy poop this morning. However it was hard to tell if it was white, or more transparent. It definitely had a chunk at the end. Will have to keep an eye out tomorrow at feeding times to see if we can catch it pooping again. I want more confirmation because we're getting to the point of go/no-go for transfer with these two.

Am holding off doing Prazipro dose #2 til tomorrow — which will be 7 days since the last dose. Planning on doing it first thing in the morning so I can keep an eye on the fish and the tank all day.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 57 — Had to rescue the QT tank today. We just couldn’t get the cloudiness under control with normal/heavy water changes and I feared a bacterial bloom was overtaking the tank. Furthermore the yellow watchman goby had starting showing signs of ammonia burn (or something like it) with the red gills. Maybe it was an ammonia spike; maybe it was oxygen deprivation due to the cloud. I don’t know but I didn’t want to dance around it anymore.

On top of all that, I realized I had made a mistake over the last week when dosing Prazipro. I had thrown carbon in the filter after 30 days of copper to get all the copper out of the system. But I neglected to take it out when I did my first, and second, Prazipro doses. So I cannot count on any of the Prazipro meds benefitting the tank, while at the same time dealing with the adverse effect of the oxygen-binding liquid in Prazipro probably causing my cloudy issues.

Right. On with the rescue.

I had 4 gal of new water mixed up overnight. I dumped that in a 5 gal, tall bucket and added a heater and an airline to start getting it warm and oxygenated. I immediately mixed up another 4 gal in another bucket to have on hand.

After 30-60 mins of letting the new water get oxygenated and making sure the temp matched my QT closely, we started the process of moving the fish out. First we drained about 4 gallons out of the QT. Then we caught all of the fish and transported them to the waiting bucket. We had pulled all of their hiding pipes from the QT, cleaned them, and then placed a couple in the waiting bucket for them to hide in/under/behind.

Once all of the fish were in their temporary home, we proceeded to drain the rest of the QT tank completely. We scrubbed it down, rinsed it, scrubbed it again, repeat, repeat, repeat. And we did the same with all of its components. Everything got pulled out, pulled apart and scrubbed down. Power heads, impellers, heater, suction cups, filters, you name it.

With the tank crystal clear and sparkling clean, we commenced to setting it all back up. First, I used the tank itself as a mixing vessel, putting 6 gal of fresh water in there and mixing my salt with the aid of two power heads causing turbulence. While this was mixing I got the filter reconstructed, gingerly siphoned some water into it to cover the ceramic media rocks and then poured a whole 2 oz. bottle of Dr. Tim’s Nitrifying Bacteria onto them and let that sit for awhile (over an hour I think).

Meanwhile, the only issue I had left before reintroducing the fish into the QT was that the water was too warm. At first I thought I could vent the lid and let it cool down on its own, but that proved to take forever. I then got the idea to — PRO TIP — fill a Solo cup with ice cubes and hold the cup in the circulating water. This would cool the water down without diluting it as it would have had I just thrown ice cubes in the water. And it didn’t take long either. I was able to drop the temp ~3°F in probably 20-30 mins. If that. Every couple of minutes my thermometer would drop 0.2°F. It was a short enough period of time that I could tolerate standing in one spot holding my arm over the tank to keep the cup of ice upright. Also, it took me 2 cups of ice to accomplish this. The first cup melted to the point where only a few cubes remained floating at the top. The second cup was definitely watery. Probably half-melted. This technique helped immensely. And once I got the temp down to my desired range I safely put the fish back in, using their own water from the temporary bucket to fill the rest of the QT up.

And that’s where we are at this point. Count me as a nay on the Prazipro. I have General Cure coming early next week. The Prazipro can go in the trash for all I'm concerned. In the meantime, we’re going to take these next few days to observe everyone and make sure they are eating and returning to normal. I’m worried about the goby, but hopeful that improving the quality of the water will nurse it back to health.

And when the GC comes, I will be sure to pull the carbon from the tank, do my 2 doses and then be done (hopefully) with QT and start transferring fish to the DT.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 58 — The goby's redness is gone (at least the intense red that it had). Its cheeks still seem kind of rosy, but this is much improved over where it was mere days ago. I can only hope it didn't suffer any internal damage to its organs.

Besides the goby's irritation concerns, here's how all of the other fish are doing post-abduction—

• Clowns – Both are doing about the same. Just happy little puppies through it all. I think they were the only ones who ate last night after being back in the tank for a few hours. Indeed, this morning they were meeting me at the top of the tank during feeding.
• Goby – As mentioned, the redness and irritation has subsided considerably. It was very lethargic for the remaining of the evening last night. But that is to be expected after all the action. I have not seen it eat yet.
• Firefish – Normally one of our free swimmers and good eaters, this one has been lethargic with no appetite as well. Currently this fish concerns me the most since yesterday's business because of how much its been resting underneath the pipes and not eating. On top that it looks pathetic, as previously mentioned, due to its dorsal fin being chewed down and its caudal fin kinda ragged.
  
  (this photo is from 3 days ago, prior to the deep clean)
  
  
  
  
  
• Blenny – Little guy is hard to keep tabs on because it hides out in one corner of the tank. Its a dark fish resting against the black trim and your view of it is obscured by silicone. After 2 feedings, we have not seen it eat, either.

On another note, when cleaning the tank yesterday, I must have messed up the ammonia alert badge as it is now reading blue and yellow. Another trip to Amazon and a new badge is ordered and due to arrive tomorrow.

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 59 — We have witnessed the clowns and the barnacle blenny eat since the big clean. However, the firefish and the goby just are not themselves.

Both are very lethargic and generally spend their time laying on the bottom. Sometimes they tuck themselves in under a pipe. Sometimes they're just laying next to a wall and on their side, or kind of curled. Then all of a sudden they'll spring into action and swim around like nothing's wrong. Or even sometimes they will dart or flash for no apparent reason.

The goby's coloring is more muted. Kind of gray. The redness is still gone, so there's that.

I don't believe either of them have eaten. Maybe they've hoovered up a few bits here and there, but they don't come and get food during feeding time like they used to. But I'm not sure what is causing them to look so pathetic.

One thing I can rule out is anything related to ammonia spikes. We got the replacement ammonia badge today and it is registering yellow.

Also received General Cure in the mail today. I was hesitant about trying it right now, but these two fish aren't getting any better. So I'm wondering if they are suffering from something that GC can remedy? Anyway, I dumped a packet into the water about a half hour ago and will let that ride for 5-7 days before another dose. And yes I removed my bag of carbon from the filter before dumping in the GC.

 

[thewalkingdad]

Have you tried live baby brine shrimp? I've used those to entice fish to eat again after not being interested in it for some time. BBS also only takes about 24 hours to hatch and harvest which makes them pretty easy to get ready if you can anticipate a day's notice.

I got this hatchery and really like it. Very high success rates and easy to clean.

Brine Shrimp Hatchery Dish

No Aeration, Heat, or Tubing Required! Brine Shrimp Direct's Brine Shrimp Hatchery Dish is probably the easiest to use hatchery on the market today. The unique design keeps all the unhatched eggs and shells in the outer ring, while the hatched shrimp will seek out the light and swim to the open...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

 

[Bob Wiley]

Have you tried live baby brine shrimp? I've used those to entice fish to eat again after not being interested in it for some time. BBS also only takes about 24 hours to hatch and harvest which makes them pretty easy to get ready if you can anticipate a day's notice.

Interesting. That might be an option, thanks!

 

[Bob Wiley]

DAY 60 — Woke up today to two completely different fish. The firefish was out and about swimming in the water column like normal all day. The goby's redness is still gone and it, too, was crawling about the bottom and hovering around the walls like it normally would. Furthermore, both of them were witnessed eating today which is huge. I'm not ready yet to call them cured, but its definitely trending in the right direction.