Beginner at culturing Rhodomonas Phyto, need guidance please

[BanZI29]

I am starting to culture my own phyto and I have got a decent collection going. I am having issues finding info on culturing Rhodomonus, the red phyto.
As it stands now, I started the culture 4 days ago from a fresh starter culture, and it was verified to be Rhodo. It started out green, and not it seems to be turning yellow.
I am running mainly red and blue lighting and temp is 79 during the day and 76 at night. I run the lights 12 hours.
So am I doing something wrong or what is going on?
Thank you for any help you can give.

 

[BanZI29]

I know it looks sorta red in the pic, the color correction on my fone is not very good

 

[BanZI29]

?

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

I know @taricha and @Fishfreak2009 have cultured Rhodomonas before, so maybe they’ll have some thoughts (if not, I’ll see what info I can dredge up for you).

 

[Fishfreak2009]

I know @taricha and @Fishfreak2009 have cultured Rhodomonas before, so maybe they’ll have some thoughts (if not, I’ll see what info I can dredge up for you).

Rhodomonas should be red... mine was either pale red or dark red depending on how close to harvest. I found it did better in dimmer light and slightly cooler temps than the other phyto I cultured (Isochrysis galbana, Nannochloropsis oculata, Tetraselmis chuii, Tetraselmis suecica, and Thalassiosira weissflogi). It also was VERY easily contaminated by other phyto, so much so I grew it in an entirely different room. I also usually light my phyto 24/7, but Rhodomonas seemed to do better with a 12 hr photoperiod. I lit all my cultures with dual 4' LED shop lights up against the sides of the jars, with the light spectrum roughly 6500K.

Unfortunately I don't culture any phyto currently, but hoping to get it going again once I finish remodeling the house and have my displays set and done (plus the baby on the way puts a halt on a lot of side projects).

 

[Subsea]

Rhodomonas should be red... mine was either pale red or dark red depending on how close to harvest. I found it did better in dimmer light and slightly cooler temps than the other phyto I cultured (Isochrysis galbana, Nannochloropsis oculata, Tetraselmis chuii, Tetraselmis suecica, and Thalassiosira weissflogi). It also was VERY easily contaminated by other phyto, so much so I grew it in an entirely different room. I also usually light my phyto 24/7, but Rhodomonas seemed to do better with a 12 hr photoperiod. I lit all my cultures with dual 4' LED shop lights up against the sides of the jars, with the light spectrum roughly 6500K.

Unfortunately I don't culture any phyto currently, but hoping to get it going again once I finish remodeling the house and have my displays set and done (plus the baby on the way puts a halt on a lot of side projects).

When growing phytoplankton, I only considered size and ease of cultivation. What is the advantage of growing Red over the standard green.

 

[Fishfreak2009]

When growing phytoplankton, I only considered size and ease of cultivation. What is the advantage of growing Red over the standard green.

Different varieties feed different animals and have different nutritional profiles. Some have higher fatty acid contents (Isochrysis) which in turn leads to more nutritious copepod nauplii to feed larval fish for those who breed and raise their reef aquarium fish, some are ideal foods for clams and other bivalve mollusks like flame scallops, and others are just a good overall way to help supplement feed corals and lower nitrate since they grow easier than other varieties (Nannochloropsis).

This is why I liked raising a variety of phyto, so I could feed them all and get the benefits of each variety. And by rearing them in separate cultures, you are able to maintain all the varieties. Otherwise in a mixed culture one variety almost always outcompetes the others (usually Nannochloropsis).

This was my old 110 gallon after dosing phyto. I added almost 1 gallon of mixed phytoplankton every other day. Filter feeders like feather dusters, flame scallops, and sponges thrived, and even the corals would open right up for feeding. It would clear within 2 hours of dosing

 

[Subsea]

Different varieties feed different animals and have different nutritional profiles. Some have higher fatty acid contents (Isochrysis) which in turn leads to more nutritious copepod nauplii to feed larval fish for those who breed and raise their reef aquarium fish, some are ideal foods for clams and other bivalve mollusks like flame scallops, and others are just a good overall way to help supplement feed corals and lower nitrate since they grow easier than other varieties (Nannochloropsis).

This is why I liked raising a variety of phyto, so I could feed them all and get the benefits of each variety. And by rearing them in separate cultures, you are able to maintain all the varieties. Otherwise in a mixed culture one variety almost always outcompetes the others (usually Nannochloropsis).

This was my old 110 gallon after dosing phyto. I added almost 1 gallon of mixed phytoplankton every other day. Filter feeders like feather dusters, flame scallops, and sponges thrived, and even the corals would open right up for feeding. It would clear within 2 hours of dosing

Wow! You got 110G display that dark with phytoplankton. Please grace this thread with pictures of filter feeders in your systems.

I just started heavy dosing on a 30G display of mixed filter feeders with emphases on ornamental sponges.

PS: The 30G glass tank on cement pad for Jacuzzi initially was a Tilapia salt water conversion experiment in which 10 fingerling Blue Israeli Tilapia started out with well water with a TDS of 990ppm. Each day I added 1G of partial water change from a healthy 25 year nature system. In addition to heavy mineral makeup, biodiversity of micro inverts was important to me. Food was also added each day. At some point the water turned green. While I can’t tell size or species, tank inhabitants consume it readily.

So, let’s talk nutritional value of my green water culture. No matter what culture you grow, if the culture water lacks nutritional value, then the phytoplankton has reduced nutritional value. I suggest that even though I don’t know what the name of my green water is, I do know that filter feeders readily consumed it. So now, in addittion to nutrient rich tank .water change, I am strongly considering adding modified Guillard f2 along with liquid seaweed (kelp),

 

[BanZI29]

Hey all. So my Rhodo looks very yellow now. is it dead orvis there a way to get it back? Please help.

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

Hey all. So my Rhodo looks very yellow now. is it dead orvis there a way to get it back? Please help.

It's likely Nitrogen or other nutrient limited:
"It has been found that the colour of Rhodomonas salina cultures grown in nitrogen-limited mediums turned to be green or yellow, which is different from the cultures in nitrogen-replete mediums (red)."*

*Sources:

Frontiers | Selective Feeding of a Mixotrophic Dinoflagellate (Lepidodinium sp.) in Response to Experimental Warming and Inorganic Nutrient Imbalance

Mixotrophic protists are widely observed in the aquatic ecosystems, while how they respond to inorganic nutrient imbalance and ocean warming remains understu...

www.frontiersin.org

https://www.researchgate.net/post/Why_my_Rhodomonas_salina_pigments_composition_has_changed_in_monoculture

Edit: So, probably not dead, just needing fed to regain the red coloration.

 

[BanZI29]

I am loking into getting fritz f/2 part A and B instead of the 1 part I have now. Wjat anout addding something like brightwell neonitro?

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

I am loking into getting fritz f/2 part A and B instead of thev1 part I have now. Wjat anout addding something like brightwell neonitro?

Without knowing exactly what their "proprietary nitrogen salts" are, I can't say for sure (and chemistry isn't my forte at this point), but it sounds like you'd either need some Fritz F/2 Part B, or some of the neonitro.

 

[BanZI29]

What about iso? Is it the same need as rhodo?
Whats your thoughts on providing a CO2 source besides the ambient air?

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

What about iso? Is it the same need as rhodo?
Whats your thoughts on providing a CO2 source besides the ambient air?

I really need to look into this stuff more in depth soon. They seem to have relatively similar needs (though I’d imagine Rhodomonas would appreciate more green and yellow light for photosynthesis than Isochrysis would prefer).

For info on Isochrysis, I’d recommend the thread below (there seems to be quite a bit of variation in what the scientific community has deemed to be optimal for Isochrysis - such as one study saying 100 PAR is optimal while another says 400 is; the disparity may be due to differences between equipment/techniques/water parameters used in the culturing or between strains of Isochrysis, I’m not sure — either way, I’d say the thread below may be the safest option for figuring out Iso’s needs at the moment):

Calling all Isochrysis Galbana Phytoplankton culture growers! Share your tips and tricks with us please! Isochrysis galbana growing guide

ISOCHRYSIS GALBANA PHYTOPLANKTON Hello, The goal of this thread is to consolidate information, questions and answers for people looking to culture Isochrysis galbana phytoplankton I appreciate those that have cultured isochrysis galbana sharing their secrets and knowledge with us In this post I...

www.reef2reef.com

For the CO2, I’d say it depends on how high your ambient CO2 levels are; Rhodomonas salina has been shown to produce the highest amount of fatty acids (generally a good thing for phyto cultures) at a moderate level of CO2 (800 μatm) - higher and lower levels (400 and 1200 were the levels tested) produced less fatty acid.* So, I’d suggest aiming for a moderate CO2 level in the culture - if that’s provided by the ambient air, great; if not, you could add some extra CO2.

*Source:

Direct and indirect effects of elevated CO2 are revealed through shifts in phytoplankton, copepod development, and fatty acid accumulation

Change in the nutritional quality of phytoplankton is a key mechanism through which ocean acidification can affect the function of marine ecosystems. Copepods play an important role transferring energy from phytoplankton to higher trophic levels, including fatty acids (FA)—essential...

journals.plos.org

 

[BanZI29]

I really need to look into this stuff more in depth soon. They seem to have relatively similar needs (though I’d imagine Rhodomonas would appreciate more green and yellow light for photosynthesis than Isochrysis would prefer).

For info on Isochrysis, I’d recommend the thread below (there seems to be quite a bit of variation in what the scientific community has deemed to be optimal for Isochrysis - such as one study saying 100 PAR is optimal while another says 400 is; the disparity may be due to differences between equipment/techniques/water parameters used in the culturing or between strains of Isochrysis, I’m not sure — either way, I’d say the thread below may be the safest option for figuring out Iso’s needs at the moment):

Calling all Isochrysis Galbana Phytoplankton culture growers! Share your tips and tricks with us please! Isochrysis galbana growing guide

ISOCHRYSIS GALBANA PHYTOPLANKTON Hello, The goal of this thread is to consolidate information, questions and answers for people looking to culture Isochrysis galbana phytoplankton I appreciate those that have cultured isochrysis galbana sharing their secrets and knowledge with us In this post I...

www.reef2reef.com

For the CO2, I’d say it depends on how high your ambient CO2 levels are; Rhodomonas salina has been shown to produce the highest amount of fatty acids (generally a good thing for phyto cultures) at a moderate level of CO2 (800 μatm) - higher and lower levels (400 and 1200 were the levels tested) produced less fatty acid.* So, I’d suggest aiming for a moderate CO2 level in the culture - if that’s provided by the ambient air, great; if not, you could add some extra CO2.

*Source:

Direct and indirect effects of elevated CO2 are revealed through shifts in phytoplankton, copepod development, and fatty acid accumulation

Change in the nutritional quality of phytoplankton is a key mechanism through which ocean acidification can affect the function of marine ecosystems. Copepods play an important role transferring energy from phytoplankton to higher trophic levels, including fatty acids (FA)—essential...

journals.plos.org

This is ALOT of GREAT info. Thank you so much for all this!

 

[BanZI29]

I really need to look into this stuff more in depth soon. They seem to have relatively similar needs (though I’d imagine Rhodomonas would appreciate more green and yellow light for photosynthesis than Isochrysis would prefer).

For info on Isochrysis, I’d recommend the thread below (there seems to be quite a bit of variation in what the scientific community has deemed to be optimal for Isochrysis - such as one study saying 100 PAR is optimal while another says 400 is; the disparity may be due to differences between equipment/techniques/water parameters used in the culturing or between strains of Isochrysis, I’m not sure — either way, I’d say the thread below may be the safest option for figuring out Iso’s needs at the moment):

Calling all Isochrysis Galbana Phytoplankton culture growers! Share your tips and tricks with us please! Isochrysis galbana growing guide

ISOCHRYSIS GALBANA PHYTOPLANKTON Hello, The goal of this thread is to consolidate information, questions and answers for people looking to culture Isochrysis galbana phytoplankton I appreciate those that have cultured isochrysis galbana sharing their secrets and knowledge with us In this post I...

www.reef2reef.com

For the CO2, I’d say it depends on how high your ambient CO2 levels are; Rhodomonas salina has been shown to produce the highest amount of fatty acids (generally a good thing for phyto cultures) at a moderate level of CO2 (800 μatm) - higher and lower levels (400 and 1200 were the levels tested) produced less fatty acid.* So, I’d suggest aiming for a moderate CO2 level in the culture - if that’s provided by the ambient air, great; if not, you could add some extra CO2.

*Source:

Direct and indirect effects of elevated CO2 are revealed through shifts in phytoplankton, copepod development, and fatty acid accumulation

Change in the nutritional quality of phytoplankton is a key mechanism through which ocean acidification can affect the function of marine ecosystems. Copepods play an important role transferring energy from phytoplankton to higher trophic levels, including fatty acids (FA)—essential...

journals.plos.org

Last question on Iso, do i need to add silicate?

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

Last question on Iso, do i need to add silicate?

To my understanding, Iso needs silicate, but not too much. So, if the fertilizer you use has silicate, you probably don’t need to add more, but if it doesn’t have silicate, you should add some.

 

[taricha]

fritz f/2 part A and B instead of the 1 part I have now.

What about iso? Is it the same need as rhodo?
Whats your thoughts on providing a CO2 source besides the ambient air?

I cultured rhodomonas accidentally. I used a cheap blend (phycopure copepod blend) that usually cultured up T-Iso, and that's what I was trying to raise. I got red rhodomonas from that batch.
Anyway. So I aimed for T-iso culture conditions. I grew them on sunlight near a window. I was using the Fritz bottles you mentioned.

Once a culture has gone off-color or lightened up - throw in the towel. It's not coming back. If your "verified rhodomonas" was green initially, I would get a different source - that's not the characteristic color.

 

[taricha]

many (me too) grow T-iso fine on Frtitz - no noticeable Silica need.

 

[El Toro]

I cultured rhodomonas accidentally. I used a cheap blend (phycopure copepod blend) that usually cultured up T-Iso, and that's what I was trying to raise. I got red rhodomonas from that batch.
Anyway. So I aimed for T-iso culture conditions. I grew them on sunlight near a window. I was using the Fritz bottles you mentioned.

Once a culture has gone off-color or lightened up - throw in the towel. It's not coming back. If your "verified rhodomonas" was green initially, I would get a different source - that's not the characteristic color.

Clear can be saved in my experience if there is some phyto still settled out at the bottom. I tried culturing Chlorella at a 30% starter and the water went clear, not medium green. I had it right next to my Tetr.chui and wonder if it got contaminated so threw it out. Yet, I once had a Tetraselmis go clear and I dosed F2 alternate days for an additional week and it came back. Go Figure