Can this remote sump plumbing work or will it just cause problems…

[homer1475]

I have some photo's of the build I helped with.

 

[homer1475]

Forget the actual pump used, but I think it was a reeflo barracuda.

 

[mandarin417]

Looking at specs, cross off amp master 24' max, MRC has the HP8500 at 55', and you're looking at the tigershark, mantaray, or higher hp pumps

Thanks Jubei2006 - My horizontal run has little head impact correct? Most if from the vertical run of 10' and the bends 0 right?

 

[mandarin417]

I have some photo's of the build I helped with.

Thanks Homer1475! Were the drain lines > 1"?

 

[jhuntstl]

I did a basement sump under my tank and quickly regretted it being near all my utilities. I moved the sump about 12ft further away. I use a DCP-15000 and only run it half wattage(50w). It's pumping up about 11ft and there's quite a few 90s.

 

[homer1475]

Thanks Homer1475! Were the drain lines > 1"?

All plumbing was 1 1/2" if I remember correctly. May even have been 1", but it was certainly not under one inch. Did this 2 years ago, and still running just fine with 0 leaks, and he actually hasn't touched the gate valve since we tuned it initially.

 

[mandarin417]

here is a picture of the sump room

here is a picture of the sump room

Great looking setup. Looks like you used flex pvc on the drains. Do you know how far your horizontal runs are? May I ask what return pump you are using?

 

[mandarin417]

I did a basement sump under my tank and quickly regretted it being near all my utilities. I moved the sump about 12ft further away. I use a DCP-15000 and only run it half wattage(50w). It's pumping up about 11ft and there's quite a few 90s.

Yeah - that is why I want to run the sump against the wall. To keep it away from my furnace.

 

[homer1475]

IMO, other then needing a bigger pump, having a remote sump is no different then one under the tank.

People tend to way overthink this when planning it out.

 

[Jubei2006]

Thanks Jubei2006 - My horizontal run has little head impact correct? Most if from the vertical run of 10' and the bends 0 right?

Correct, but you still have some head height added for friction loss of the pipe. So you said about 10 feet vertically, plus 4 feet for the 90 degree bends, and estimate 4 feet for the horizontal lengths. So say about 18 feet of head. Then you have to look at the flow charts for the pumps. A pump with 20' of head might only push 50 to 100 gph at that height. So take that into consideration as well to meet the flow through you want through the tank.

 

[mandarin417]

Correct, but you still have some head height added for friction loss of the pipe. So you said about 10 feet vertically, plus 4 feet for the 90 degree bends, and estimate 4 feet for the horizontal lengths. So say about 18 feet of head. Then you have to look at the flow charts for the pumps. A pump with 20' of head might only push 50 to 100 gph at that height. So take that into consideration as well to meet the flow through you want through the tank.

Got it. I used the BRS estimates for head pressure and I get around 17' of head pressure. If I use 5 - 10 turnovers per hour, I would need a pump that could handle 775 to 1550 gallons per hour with that head pressure. When folks talk about expensive pumps - that means a pump $300 and up as far as I can tell. That's not counting redundancy!

 

[homer1475]

Sounds about right.

My friend was very surprised when he speced out a pump too. Think his reeflo was around $450.

 

[Stephensx04]

Check out my build thread. Set up is just like what you are doing. Mine runs through roughly 30 ft of pipe to get to sump. Up one story. So far has been flawless.

 

[Stephensx04]

The gate valve at the end of the run will constrict your flow rate. Sort of like four lanes of cars going into one. Better to ease the flow velocity by introducing some bends and curves

False. The gate valve at the end 1 allows the full siphon to happen faster and easier. And 2 allows the entire line to run at full siphon allowing pipe to flow much greater amount then just being an open drain. 1 inch pipe open only flows around 300 GPH if i remember right and over 900 GPH in full siphon.

 

[homer1475]

False. The gate valve at the end 1 allows the full siphon to happen faster and easier. And 2 allows the entire line to run at full siphon allowing pipe to flow much greater amount then just being an open drain. 1 inch pipe open only flows around 300 GPH if i remember right and over 900 GPH in full siphon.

I honestly don't think it matters where the valve is. I tried it in both locations. Only thing I gained between the 2, having the valve upstairs allowed me to adjust the drains. With it in the basement next to the sump, it required 2 people. Oh and the siphon started marginally faster with it in the basement(talking like 1 or 2 seconds).

The amount of water coming down the drain line was the same in both scenarios.

 

[mandarin417]

False. The gate valve at the end 1 allows the full siphon to happen faster and easier. And 2 allows the entire line to run at full siphon allowing pipe to flow much greater amount then just being an open drain. 1 inch pipe open only flows around 300 GPH if i remember right and over 900 GPH in full siphon.

I can put gate valves on both sides of the line(s).
What happens if you put a 1.5 inch pipe in the overflow box through the 1" bulkhead and then from the bulkhead, run a 1.5 line to the sump. Can water pass faster through the entire system with only a constriction at the bulkhead? Crap - I need to find someone with a Civil Engineering degree with good fluid dynamics background now. Overthinking?

Check out my build thread. Set up is just like what you are doing. Mine runs through roughly 30 ft of pipe to get to sump. Up one story. So far has been flawless.

Thanks - I will!

 

[homer1475]

Overthinking?

Just slightly. lol

 

[Jubei2006]

My valve is right under the tank before it goes through the floor, that way I can adjust it and listen to the height of water falling over the weir to fine tune it. Flow is not a problem with a 2 inch siphon and 2 inch emergency. I use a reeflo hammerhead for return. About 14 to 15 feet of head. Estimate about 3500 gallons per hour. The reeflo barracuda gives 600gph at 20', 1810gph at 16'. Mrc mp6100 and hammerhead are equivalent 3000gph at 20' and 3800gph at 16' (so probably overkill for your app). Looks like the abyzz a400 is between the barracuda and hammerhead flow wise at these heights.

 

[Jubei2006]

Stephensx04 is correct about full siphons. If you look at my 2 inch siphon, if it's full open, it pulls more than my hammerhead can return. A two inch pipe is supposed to do 2400 gallons per hour, my hammerhead should be 3500 gallons per hour full open at 15 feet. For flow control, I have a gate valve on my siphon, and a ball valve on the hammerhead (for removal to clean and service), shouldve gone gate as well on it.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Yes, I would love your recommendations. I am open to tubing for sure! As far as water velocity, I intend to put my gate valve in the basement at the sump so that may mitigate the speed of water through the system.

Putting the gate valve so far down the drain line won't mitigate the speed as well as if you put it just after the tank bulkhead. You want to slow the water down as soon as possible, not bring it to a screeching halt after it falls 10 feet.