Chaeto Test Part III: We've proven it works, now time to up the game! | BRStv Investigates

[jason2459]

If possible I would say rotating it is ideal but that's not realistic for most people with normal flow rates and normal amounts of cheato. I guess with something like a Gyre it could be done in a large fuge. Someone should design a cheato rotisserie : )

....

The best Chaeto sump I've seen is by @d2mini

No substrate, gyre like flow, lots of good light, and plenty of room to dance!

If you want to grow chaeto this is how to do it IMO.
http://www.everydayreef.com/blog/2015/6/6/chaetomorpha-algae

 

[Ashish Patel]

As always, great studies, but please answer this : most DT lights are on for a limited time to reflect
daylight hours, so if the refuge lights are on 24/7, isn't the photo period longer regardless of the lamp par/pur for the algae in the refuge to out compete the algae in the DT. Plants that are growing under lights 24/7 need high nutrients to grow during a long photo period. Once the DT lights are on, competition starts for both algaes, but the DT algae is starting and only competing for a small amount of time, really not enough to get going I believe. Please investigate this end of your experiment, I'm hoping this would make the biggest difference, and conclude why a refuge would be so important. Thanks in advance

I've been running my fuge 24-7 for over 2 months.. My theory for running it 24-7 was I wanted the cheato to get a head start over nuisance algaes. I would say this worked very well . However, I have to cut it down to 15-18 hrs b/c my green chaeto is now turning light/pale green. If you got low nutrients don't do 24-7, keep it on for 12-15 hrs or until you see some algae on the glass. If you have high nutrients ramp that sucker up

 

[VJV]

The best Chaeto sump I've seen is by @d2mini

No substrate, gyre like flow, lots of good light, and plenty of room to dance!

If you want to grow chaeto this is how to do it IMO.
http://www.everydayreef.com/blog/2015/6/6/chaetomorpha-algae

I know, I follow d2mini's threads for a long time. I added a small pump to the refugium section but chaetomorpha tends to get sucked in and kills the pump

 

[VJV]

If possible I would say rotating it is ideal but that's not realistic for most people with normal flow rates and normal amounts of cheato. I guess with something like a Gyre it could be done in a large fuge. Someone should design a cheato rotisserie : )

I have run into the GHA issue before but just manually removing it for a few weeks while the cheato gets going normaly eliminates that issue for me. Might want to try just flipping it from time to time.

As to the cheato bleaching, with higher power lights I have seen it turn light green but not white. I'll also note that it often looks white in the purple light many lights put off but under a full spectrum light it looks green. Like any other photosynthetic organism, I would absolutely acclimate it if you intend on using high PAR lighting. Switching from 100 par to 1500 par over night is very likely to produce negative results in a variety of ways. If you are having issues raise the light up a bit.

Lastly, I personally had very poor luck with a 24 hour photoperiod. Cheato didn't grow and there was a ton of GHA. A 12 on/ 12 off cycle worked a lot better and once the cheato covered the entire surface there was no GHA.

Thanks. A couple of days ago I decided I had enough with my ugly fudge and took it out. GHA grew all over the chaetomorpha if it did not rotate and smothered it. However, the chaetomorpha would always get into the small Tunze pump and shut it out every three days. My sump was looking terrible and my water column always filled with tons of algae filaments that were floating from the fudge to the main display. At times if you looked through the tank when a light was shinning on the other side (it is a peninsula) it would almost seem like a soup. Two days later and the water clarity improvement is amazing. I will keep it like this for another week or two in order to kill off all the remaining algae (not much, as I cleaned the sump after removing the chaetomorpha) before adding a new ball of chaetomorpha. As a side note, my PH used to be at 8,06 at night and now drops down to 7,8 (I was running in reverse mode). I'll update in a week or two. Perhaps a
I need a shorter photoperiod (say 6h) given how strong the grow light is. I must say however that before the growlight I was using a 6500k 32w led for planted tanks and GHA was also grown so not sure the grow light is responsible for it.

 

[JamesP]

I don't like algae on my fudge

 

[Ryanbrs]

Thanks. A couple of days ago I decided I had enough with my ugly fudge and took it out. GHA grew all over the chaetomorpha if it did not rotate and smothered it. However, the chaetomorpha would always get into the small Tunze pump and shut it out every three days. My sump was looking terrible and my water column always filled with tons of algae filaments that were floating from the fudge to the main display. At times if you looked through the tank when a light was shinning on the other side (it is a peninsula) it would almost seem like a soup. Two days later and the water clarity improvement is amazing. I will keep it like this for another week or two in order to kill off all the remaining algae (not much, as I cleaned the sump after removing the chaetomorpha) before adding a new ball of chaetomorpha. As a side note, my PH used to be at 8,06 at night and now drops down to 7,8 (I was running in reverse mode). I'll update in a week or two. Perhaps a
I need a shorter photoperiod (say 6h) given how strong the grow light is. I must say however that before the growlight I was using a 6500k 32w led for planted tanks and GHA was also grown so not sure the grow light is responsible for it.

One possible difference between my own experience and many others is we are starting with near zero nitrate and phosphate not trying to reduce it after the fact. I don't know if thats the case here.

With any new method, I always recommend a few large water changes near each other to get parameters in line before starting something new rather than use the new equipment/method to fix the problem and then maintain it as well which are entirely different things.

 

[jason2459]

I know, I follow d2mini's threads for a long time. I added a small pump to the refugium section but chaetomorpha tends to get sucked in and kills the pump

Need a pump in another section and pumping into the chaeto area to get it rolling. The spray bar in d2mini's setup worked great.

 

[VJV]

One possible difference between my own experience and many others is we are starting with near zero nitrate and phosphate not trying to reduce it after the fact. I don't know if thats the case here.

With any new method, I always recommend a few large water changes near each other to get parameters in line before starting something new rather than use the new equipment/method to fix the problem and then maintain it as well which are entirely different things.

Thanks Ryan. My case is similar as I started from scratch with Triton. Always had zero Nitrates (not even a shade) and near zero phosphates 0,018 Hanna Phosphorus ULR) and algae still took over the sump. I believe I have derbesia and has proven very hard. Have heard several accounts of zero Nitrates leading and some phosphates leading to GHA. I am actually considering dosing Nitrates but still have not found the courage. 10 fish in a 200 gallon tank is very light bioload and my filtration is extremely effective, starting with a ClariSea SK15 filter fleece that polishes the water (had a Rollermat, swapped with this and oh boy, this is in another league!!). My SPS tens to turn pale but welt the same time my LPS are happy which kind of contradicts the low nutrient evidence... anyway, stuff for another thread (but seriously, you need to look at the ClariSea. It is 1/4 the size of the Rollermat with twice the L/h capacity, and a much more efficient design).

 

[joeyhatch11]

 

[VJV]

Now that is showing off [emoji1][emoji1][emoji1]

 

[joeyhatch11]

Now that is showing off [emoji1][emoji1][emoji1]

Im going to just let it grow and grow, tons of room to have it move. Best part is, once it gets too big for that flow to tumble I can adjust the flow on the pump to be more forceful. Currently running at a tad less than half speed. Anything faster with that size ball its starts breaking it apart.

 

[VJV]

Yes... I guess I could have a separate pump in a different section of the sump a plumb it into the fuge with a spray bar. That way I would not have issues with the chaeto getting etílico in the pump... not really keen on the added complexity though...

 

[Grey Guy]

Any method can work. But jumping from method to method does not. I know this has been true in my own experience.

 

[VJV]

I would have to disagree. No method works the same on two tanks because no tank is the same. So what may work for some may not work for others. I tried Triton for 6 months and for me (much like for a lot of others such as d2mini) it did not work. Allowing chaetomorpha to die off instead of harvesting lead to GHA and massive die offs. Having to dose exactly the same of each component also does not work in my tank because my Alk, Cal and Magnesium consumption rates are different. My tank consumes almost zero Mag so because I had to keep dosing equal amounts my Mag was constantly rising. Etc... very curious to see how the BRS160 fares with Triton.

 

[Biglurr54]

I have a 60 gallon with just an ats no skimmer. If I see any algae on the glass or sand I clean the screen. I have never had tradable nitrate or phosphate. I have the tank overloaded at the time. Feeding is one cube of mysis, a bunch of live black worms, and a nori sheet or two. My scrubber is 4x6 diy scrubber.

My next/current build is a red sea 525xl. I am doing triton from the start and going to do a fuge. After my ats crashed after forgetting to turn the flow back on to the scrubber I have decided a fuge with cheato is a better, less maintenance option.

I would love to see an apples to apples comparison of fuge lights.

Something live a vidaspectra 300w grow light vs h380 vs 4 or 6 bulb t5 vs 150w hqi. This would be a closer comparison than a compact florescent vs a h380.

No one wants to see a 6500k led light bulb vs a 360we. But a comparable light is worth exploring.

Thank you brs for your hard work. I know I owe a large part of my success and enjoyment in the hobby to the you guys. Your honesty and dedication to the hobby has made me into a loyal customer. I wouldn't buy from anyone else.

 

[Ryanbrs]

I've been running my fuge 24-7 for over 2 months.. My theory for running it 24-7 was I wanted the cheato to get a head start over nuisance algaes. I would say this worked very well . However, I have to cut it down to 15-18 hrs b/c my green chaeto is now turning light/pale green. If you got low nutrients don't do 24-7, keep it on for 12-15 hrs or until you see some algae on the glass. If you have high nutrients ramp that sucker up

There has been some considerable talk around the shop about running two fuges on opposing light schedules but it seems kind of overkill : )

My own personal experience with a 24 hour light cycle was the cheato just didn't grow. The moment we went back to 12/12 it took off. It would be interesting to try and identify why different reefers have different experiences.

 

[Ryanbrs]

I have a 60 gallon with just an ats no skimmer. If I see any algae on the glass or sand I clean the screen. I have never had tradable nitrate or phosphate. I have the tank overloaded at the time. Feeding is one cube of mysis, a bunch of live black worms, and a nori sheet or two. My scrubber is 4x6 diy scrubber.

My next/current build is a red sea 525xl. I am doing triton from the start and going to do a fuge. After my ats crashed after forgetting to turn the flow back on to the scrubber I have decided a fuge with cheato is a better, less maintenance option.

I would love to see an apples to apples comparison of fuge lights.

Something live a vidaspectra 300w grow light vs h380 vs 4 or 6 bulb t5 vs 150w hqi. This would be a closer comparison than a compact florescent vs a h380.

No one wants to see a 6500k led light bulb vs a 360we. But a comparable light is worth exploring.

Thank you brs for your hard work. I know I owe a large part of my success and enjoyment in the hobby to the you guys. Your honesty and dedication to the hobby has made me into a loyal customer. I wouldn't buy from anyone else.

We are exploring t5's as well. End of the day I think a low cost HO T5 fixture like the sun blaze with growth specific spectrum bulbs (not 6500k) is going to to be the best option for PAR, spread, and cost. However, the same could be said about the display end of the tank as well. T5's are pretty old tech that no one seems to want to adopt any longer. However, in this case, I think low cost will be a significant motivator.

I wish I could say I am following my own advice on this but even though I know T5's are probably a better value for a fuge I still want to use LED's myself because this is a hobby and tunable LED grow lamps is what's cool and new.

 

[Joey Merrell]

And I just bought an h80...looks like I'm gonna need a 380.

 

[Jstn]

There has been some considerable talk around the shop about running two fuges on opposing light schedules but it seems kind of overkill : )

My own personal experience with a 24 hour light cycle was the cheato just didn't grow. The moment we went back to 12/12 it took off. It would be interesting to try and identify why different reefers have different experiences.

Interesting, I am running my chaeto at 18/6 and haven't seen any growth at all despite nitrates at 10 and PO4 floating around 0.06; i wonder if going 12/12 would help?

And I just bought an h80...looks like I'm gonna need a 380.

I feel the same way, I picked up the h80 and so far has not grown my chaeto, I know the BRS team was able to grow with this light but i am not having the same results.

 

[joaquin706]

Really guys? C'mon.

Water changes (utilizing 0 TDS RO/DI + quality salt) are probably the best way to reduce nutrients and maintain major and minor trace elements.

I love the concept of the Triton Method, it is the next level of reef keeping, in my opinion. However, it is considerably more expensive long term than consistent water changes, and significantly more difficult for new aquarists to comprehend.

Of course, I understand you sell refugium lights and Triton system supplements, but let's not take it to the point of misleading.

I noted the Inherent inconsistency, water changes has been tried and true. Now water changes are the poorest method according to brs . I know the commercial goal is to sell trition but anyone offended by the misrepresentation ??!?!?