Corals safe for a predator tank???

Maximizer · Apr 6, 2016

FiremanRick said:
I have a 200 with 3 triggers, large tang, 2 large wrass' and some catfish. Not a snail or crab to be found. They don't touch coral. Personally, go with what you want to look at. If the tank is full of fish you "settled for", then you might not be as apt to enjoy it and take care of it. Sure it sucks not having the cool invertebrates, but triggers are full of personality, the wrass' are always busy, and the catfish are constantly turning my sand. I wouldn't have it any other way. The maintenance is part of the hobby, if you ask me

Do you have any pictures of your tank or a build thread? Love predator fish and would like to see your tank.

FeliciaLynn · Apr 8, 2016

This question really depends on exactly which predators you're talking about. However, a lot of the predator fish are actually 100% coral safe. They're just listed as not reef safe because they will eat smaller fish or inverts, especially shrimp. I have 3 lionfish and a snowflake eel in a mixed reef tank without any issues. I actually really don't have any issues with the CUC either, but again that depends on what predators. Lionfish will eat shrimp, but mine show absolutely no interest in my snails, conchs, hermit crabs, mithrax crab, urchin, or serpent starfish. My snowflake eel also completely leaves my CUC alone. However, I know triggers will eat all your snails, so you have to get more creative with some of the predator fish in terms of CUC.

I have 3 different lionfish species and a snowflake eel with gorgonians, sponges, soft corals, zoas and palys, LPS, SPS, anemones, and tridacna clams without any issues. As others have mentioned, the big consideration with predators and corals is having enough filtration to support the bioload. I run a skimmer that is rated for twice the water volume of my system, a biopellet reactor, and have a refugium with macro algae. I also try to stick to weekly 10 gallon water changes to keep nutrients at a reasonable level. If you have enough filtration and keep up with water changes though, you can definitely have predator fish in a full mixed reef tank.

Here's my predator reef :)

tomxreef · Apr 8, 2016

FeliciaLynn said:
This question really depends on exactly which predators you're talking about. However, a lot of the predator fish are actually 100% coral safe. They're just listed as not reef safe because they will eat smaller fish or inverts, especially shrimp. I have 3 lionfish and a snowflake eel in a mixed reef tank without any issues. I actually really don't have any issues with the CUC either, but again that depends on what predators. Lionfish will eat shrimp, but mine show absolutely no interest in my snails, conchs, hermit crabs, mithrax crab, urchin, or serpent starfish. My snowflake eel also completely leaves my CUC alone. However, I know triggers will eat all your snails, so you have to get more creative with some of the predator fish in terms of CUC.

I have 3 different lionfish species and a snowflake eel with gorgonians, sponges, soft corals, zoas and palys, LPS, SPS, anemones, and tridacna clams without any issues. As others have mentioned, the big consideration with predators and corals is having enough filtration to support the bioload. I run a skimmer that is rated for twice the water volume of my system, a biopellet reactor, and have a refugium with macro algae. I also try to stick to weekly 10 gallon water changes to keep nutrients at a reasonable level. If you have enough filtration and keep up with water changes though, you can definitely have predator fish in a full mixed reef tank.

Here's my predator reef :)

And one of the nicest reefs I have ever seen!

FeliciaLynn · Apr 8, 2016

Tmr8188 said:
And one of the nicest reefs I have ever seen!

Thank you so much! That is such a lovely compliment! I definitely wanted to share since I definitely love seeing people put predators in a mixed reef tank instead of assuming that they can only be in a FOWLR system. I definitely have some nutrient issues in my system, but I'm able to manage them with filtration and regular water changes, and as a result all of my corals are thriving :)

tomxreef · Apr 9, 2016

FeliciaLynn said:
Thank you so much! That is such a lovely compliment! I definitely wanted to share since I definitely love seeing people put predators in a mixed reef tank instead of assuming that they can only be in a FOWLR system. I definitely have some nutrient issues in my system, but I'm able to manage them with filtration and regular water changes, and as a result all of my corals are thriving :)

It is absolutely true! Your reef is seriously having my consider adding a fu Manchu and forgoing sps in order to bulk up on my shroom and chalice collection. My only hangups are that my clowns are relatively small and training the lion.

FeliciaLynn · Apr 9, 2016

Tmr8188 said:
It is absolutely true! Your reef is seriously having my consider adding a fu Manchu and forgoing sps in order to bulk up on my shroom and chalice collection. My only hangups are that my clowns are relatively small and training the lion.

You wouldn't necessarily have to forgo the SPS as long as you had enough filtration to keep the water clean enough for them. In my small system and with being overstocked, I can't keep the more delicate SPS, but I can keep some of the easier hardier ones no problem. I've got a bali slimer and digitata that do great, as well as some small frags of a yellow acro and pink lemonade that are doing well. I've had issues with some other SPS though, but my nitrates tend to usually be around 15-20 ppm, which is too high for a lot of SPS.

Yeah the clownfish could be an issue since lionfish can eat anything about 3/4 of their size or less. I have a pair of smaller clowns in my tank, but they live in a big cluster of 8-9 BTA's, which is what I think keeps them safe. They've been in with my lionfish for over 10 months now without issues, but they basically don't stray from their big BTA cluster, so they're protected. That's the purpose of clowns living in BTA's in the wild, so nice to see that it works! My lionfish don't go close to the anemones. I don't know that this would work with just one or two small BTA's though since the clowns really can't get down inside them. My clowns can completely vanish from sight down in their anemones.

And yes, training a lionfish onto frozen food can definitely take some work and patience. It really varies between the individual fish. I have 3 lionfish, one of which decided to just go ahead and take frozen silversides at the fish store no problem, one that took a couple weeks to wean onto frozen, and one that took months and was super stubborn. You basically have to go into it being willing to feed live and work on weaning for several months if necessary. Fu manchus are supposedly one of the more difficult species to wean onto frozen, but my fu manchu is actually the one that just took straight to frozen silversides while still at the fish store. I think its really just luck of the draw! If you decide to get a lionfish, just make sure you have a reliable supply of live food for while you're weaning onto frozen. A lot of stores sell freshwater ghost shrimp, which are easy to keep in a small freshwater tank and can be gut loaded with high quality marine pellets or flakes so that their nutritious. Also, there are online retailers (like Floridapets.com) that sell saltwater ghost shrimp, which you can keep in a breeder box in your sump and gut load.

tomxreef · Apr 9, 2016

FeliciaLynn said:
You wouldn't necessarily have to forgo the SPS as long as you had enough filtration to keep the water clean enough for them. In my small system and with being overstocked, I can't keep the more delicate SPS, but I can keep some of the easier hardier ones no problem. I've got a bali slimer and digitata that do great, as well as some small frags of a yellow acro and pink lemonade that are doing well. I've had issues with some other SPS though, but my nitrates tend to usually be around 15-20 ppm, which is too high for a lot of SPS.

Yeah the clownfish could be an issue since lionfish can eat anything about 3/4 of their size or less. I have a pair of smaller clowns in my tank, but they live in a big cluster of 8-9 BTA's, which is what I think keeps them safe. They've been in with my lionfish for over 10 months now without issues, but they basically don't stray from their big BTA cluster, so they're protected. That's the purpose of clowns living in BTA's in the wild, so nice to see that it works! My lionfish don't go close to the anemones. I don't know that this would work with just one or two small BTA's though since the clowns really can't get down inside them. My clowns can completely vanish from sight down in their anemones.

And yes, training a lionfish onto frozen food can definitely take some work and patience. It really varies between the individual fish. I have 3 lionfish, one of which decided to just go ahead and take frozen silversides at the fish store no problem, one that took a couple weeks to wean onto frozen, and one that took months and was super stubborn. You basically have to go into it being willing to feed live and work on weaning for several months if necessary. Fu manchus are supposedly one of the more difficult species to wean onto frozen, but my fu manchu is actually the one that just took straight to frozen silversides while still at the fish store. I think its really just luck of the draw! If you decide to get a lionfish, just make sure you have a reliable supply of live food for while you're weaning onto frozen. A lot of stores sell freshwater ghost shrimp, which are easy to keep in a small freshwater tank and can be gut loaded with high quality marine pellets or flakes so that their nutritious. Also, there are online retailers (like Floridapets.com) that sell saltwater ghost shrimp, which you can keep in a breeder box in your sump and gut load.

My system is an IM lagoon 25. I am however running biopellets and an aquamax hob-1 skimmer, with marine pure spheres in my other basket. I actually work for an lfs and have a fu manchu. Ill spend work time training him.

FeliciaLynn · Apr 9, 2016

Tmr8188 said:
My system is an IM lagoon 25. I am however running biopellets and an aquamax hob-1 skimmer, with marine pure spheres in my other basket. I actually work for an lfs and have a fu manchu. Ill spend work time training him.

A 25 gallon is definitely a bit on the small side for a lionfish, but it could maybe work for a fu manchu. The recommended minimum tank size for a fu manchu is 3o gallons, so you can maybe get away with a 25 gallon. You just have to keep in mind that with the smaller water volume and no sump, the bioload would be even more of a concern. Training one at the LFS sounds like a good plan!

Bracka345 · Apr 9, 2016

Duke4Life said:
I see you saying chain moray, do you mean Chain link?

Correct!

Bracka345 · Apr 9, 2016

FeliciaLynn said:
This question really depends on exactly which predators you're talking about. However, a lot of the predator fish are actually 100% coral safe. They're just listed as not reef safe because they will eat smaller fish or inverts, especially shrimp. I have 3 lionfish and a snowflake eel in a mixed reef tank without any issues. I actually really don't have any issues with the CUC either, but again that depends on what predators. Lionfish will eat shrimp, but mine show absolutely no interest in my snails, conchs, hermit crabs, mithrax crab, urchin, or serpent starfish. My snowflake eel also completely leaves my CUC alone. However, I know triggers will eat all your snails, so you have to get more creative with some of the predator fish in terms of CUC.

I have 3 different lionfish species and a snowflake eel with gorgonians, sponges, soft corals, zoas and palys, LPS, SPS, anemones, and tridacna clams without any issues. As others have mentioned, the big consideration with predators and corals is having enough filtration to support the bioload. I run a skimmer that is rated for twice the water volume of my system, a biopellet reactor, and have a refugium with macro algae. I also try to stick to weekly 10 gallon water changes to keep nutrients at a reasonable level. If you have enough filtration and keep up with water changes though, you can definitely have predator fish in a full mixed reef tank.

Here's my predator reef :)

Thanks. Beautiful setup!!!

Bracka345 · Apr 9, 2016

FeliciaLynn said:
You wouldn't necessarily have to forgo the SPS as long as you had enough filtration to keep the water clean enough for them. In my small system and with being overstocked, I can't keep the more delicate SPS, but I can keep some of the easier hardier ones no problem. I've got a bali slimer and digitata that do great, as well as some small frags of a yellow acro and pink lemonade that are doing well. I've had issues with some other SPS though, but my nitrates tend to usually be around 15-20 ppm, which is too high for a lot of SPS.

Yeah the clownfish could be an issue since lionfish can eat anything about 3/4 of their size or less. I have a pair of smaller clowns in my tank, but they live in a big cluster of 8-9 BTA's, which is what I think keeps them safe. They've been in with my lionfish for over 10 months now without issues, but they basically don't stray from their big BTA cluster, so they're protected. That's the purpose of clowns living in BTA's in the wild, so nice to see that it works! My lionfish don't go close to the anemones. I don't know that this would work with just one or two small BTA's though since the clowns really can't get down inside them. My clowns can completely vanish from sight down in their anemones.

And yes, training a lionfish onto frozen food can definitely take some work and patience. It really varies between the individual fish. I have 3 lionfish, one of which decided to just go ahead and take frozen silversides at the fish store no problem, one that took a couple weeks to wean onto frozen, and one that took months and was super stubborn. You basically have to go into it being willing to feed live and work on weaning for several months if necessary. Fu manchus are supposedly one of the more difficult species to wean onto frozen, but my fu manchu is actually the one that just took straight to frozen silversides while still at the fish store. I think its really just luck of the draw! If you decide to get a lionfish, just make sure you have a reliable supply of live food for while you're weaning onto frozen. A lot of stores sell freshwater ghost shrimp, which are easy to keep in a small freshwater tank and can be gut loaded with high quality marine pellets or flakes so that their nutritious. Also, there are online retailers (like Floridapets.com) that sell saltwater ghost shrimp, which you can keep in a breeder box in your sump and gut load.

Thanks!!!