Cycle Process Help

[tuxy_v8]

Hi All,

I'm following this guide - https://reef2reef.com/threads/the-supreme-guide-to-setting-up-a-saltwater-reef-aquarium.138750/

I'm onto the Cycle stages.

My tank is now showing no signs of ammonia (which i assume is good), however is now showing signs of Nitrites and Nitrates.

So I assume I am somewhere between the "Stage 2: Nitrite Cycle" and "Stage 3: Nitrate Cycle".

My question is.

Do I continue to "ghost feed" the bacteria to ensure the process continues and bacteria does not die off or do I stop ghost feeding and allow the tank to continue through to the end of the cycle stages?

I'd appreciate some clarification on this part of the stage.

Thanks,
Tuxy

 

[tuxy_v8]

Additional bits of information.

- Salinity is looking good and stabilising around 1.026
- Bacteria used was Colony
- Salt used was Aquavitro
- Temperature is around 26.4 degrees C
- Ammonia is next to nothing if that
- Lights are on the schedule, should I turn them off until stage "Pre-Algae Cycle"?

Thanks,
Tuxy

 

[brandon429]

Bac can't ever starve if wet, no need to ghost feed. We're missing the most important part of your cycle measure: how many days underwater? That chart has a critical #days variable

Extra feed input feeds algae, it's best to wait until animals consumers are in there

#2 needed detail - what kind of rock did you use

Dry rock
Liferock painted in bac
Totally live rock with animals in it and coralline?

All valid cycling articles should start off sentence #1 discerning if a cycle is even required, live rock never needs more bac added nor supported for example.

 

[tuxy_v8]

Bac can't ever starve if wet, no need to ghost feed. We're missing the most important part of your cycle measure: how many days underwater? That chart has a critical #days variable

Extra feed input feeds algae, it's best to wait until animals consumers are in there

#2 needed detail - what kind of rock did you use

Dry rock
Liferock painted in bac
Totally live rock with animals in it and coralline?

All valid cycling articles should start off sentence #1 discerning if a cycle is even required, live rock never needs more bac added nor supported for example.

When you say, how many days underwater. Do you mean the rock or the bacteria that I added?

The rock is 3rd Generation Rock and was dry for a few days and in a crashed tank. It was cleaned, allowed to dry then re-added prior to adding the bacteria.

 

[brandon429]

How many days for the rock being underwater, not factoring the bac just seeing which part of that chart your time matches for adding water to the system. The live rock still brought bac into the system along with actually filling the tank with water (deep core area still wet). Bottle bac only speeds up or boosts, it’s not required to cycle which is why none of the charts factor for added bac but it’ll be faster than 30 days now

Anytime we create an aquarium in our home, filter bac hitched in on day one, and we can never starve wet bac even if you didn’t feed for nine years. Gnats, skin cells, other bac, aerial food etc / never ending by nature

Go low on lights those rocks have an innate nutrient loading that needs time to cure

 

[tuxy_v8]

How many days for the rock being underwater, not factoring the bac just seeing which part of that chart your time matches for adding water to the system. The live rock still brought bac into the system along with actually filling the tank with water (deep core area still wet). Bottle bac only speeds up or boosts, it’s not required to cycle which is why none of the charts factor for added bac but it’ll be faster than 30 days now

Anytime we create an aquarium in our home, filter bac hitched in on day one.

I added the rock approximately 4 days ago after the Salinity had settled and the water had settled down.

 

[tankstudy]

My question is.

Do I continue to "ghost feed" the bacteria to ensure the process continues and bacteria does not die off or do I stop ghost feeding and allow the tank to continue through to the end of the cycle stages?

I'd appreciate some clarification on this part of the stage.

I would stop the ghost feeding and allow the process to continue all the way thru. Over abundance of ammonia has been shown to stall/prolong/inhibit the cycle. Even if you don't feed, your bacteria shouldn't die off that quickly. You just need some initial ammonia to start the cycle.

 

[tuxy_v8]

I would stop the ghost feeding and allow the process to continue all the way thru. Over abundance of ammonia has been shown to stall/prolong/inhibit the cycle. Even if you don't feed, your bacteria shouldn't die off that quickly. You just need some initial ammonia to start the cycle.

Yes, I only added food once to start the process. I didn't add anymore after that.

 

[tuxy_v8]

How many days for the rock being underwater, not factoring the bac just seeing which part of that chart your time matches for adding water to the system. The live rock still brought bac into the system along with actually filling the tank with water (deep core area still wet). Bottle bac only speeds up or boosts, it’s not required to cycle which is why none of the charts factor for added bac but it’ll be faster than 30 days now

Anytime we create an aquarium in our home, filter bac hitched in on day one, and we can never starve wet bac even if you didn’t feed for nine years. Gnats, skin cells, other bac, aerial food etc / never ending by nature

Go low on lights those rocks have an innate nutrient loading that needs time to cure

I've reduced the lights

 

[brandon429]

hey great, just let it proceed to day 30, change water and begin. The arrangements in place will grow bac, needs time factor only. easy cycle here no testing even required ha nice. its done before day 30, but clearly that's a universal date for ammonia processing and you already show some/we discussed ways some bac were already there. Only ammonia and submersion time matters in updated cycling, nitrite and nitrate are nearly always mis testing in the hobby its handier not to use them/# of days underwater clearly solves for them anyway, the above shows.

 

[tuxy_v8]

hey great, just let it proceed to day 30, change water and begin. The arrangements in place will grow bac, needs time factor only. easy cycle here no testing even required ha nice. its done before day 30, but clearly that's a universal date for ammonia processing and you already show some/we discussed ways some bac were already there. Only ammonia and submersion time matters in updated cycling, nitrite and nitrate are nearly always mis testing in the hobby its handier not to use them/# of days underwater clearly solves for them anyway, the above shows.

So do I just leave it till day 30 now? Then water change and perform a load of tests to be safe?

 

[brandon429]

I would perform no tests, leave till day 30 total submersion, change water and begin with whatever bioload you have planned it'll be ready. We dont use testing other than ammonia and submersion time in my cycling threads, since nitrate and nitrite are almost never, ever read correctly in the hobby from titration test kits and that chart above solves for all variables when we know time only. you have a mighty easy cycle, nothing you do can stop it other than if you turned your tank water into literal bathroom cleaner. feed more, feed none, light v no light, add some liquid ammonia or not, add a rotten shrimp or not, all are the same ends at day 30 same as literally doing nothing and waiting now.

all we do is create interim spikes and troughs that wont matter after the water change at the end of 30 days, that kind of testing just creates concerns that the cycle wont complete but they always do, 100% of the time. wastewater testing is what drives the hobby crazy ha yep. check this thread out, 16 pages of tank cycling using all forms of rocks, and no testing. we predict the start date based on pics and statements, not tests. seems we're onto something/no death:

The microbiology of reef tank cycling.

You can skip your cycle. Ive been reefing online for twenty years and have never waited one second for a tank to cycle, because I buy rocks that are already cycled and move them home. Here's two: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/octo-high-end-sps-skip-cycle-build.713256/...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[tuxy_v8]

I would perform no tests, leave till day 30 total submersion, change water and begin with whatever bioload you have planned it'll be ready. We dont use testing other than ammonia and submersion time in my cycling threads, since nitrate and nitrite are almost never, ever read correctly in the hobby from titration test kits and that chart above solves for all variables when we know time only. you have a mighty easy cycle, nothing you do can stop it other than if you turned your tank water into literal bathroom cleaner. feed more, feed none, light v no light, add some liquid ammonia or not, add a rotten shrimp or not, all are the same ends at day 30 same as literally doing nothing and waiting now.

all we do is create interim spikes and troughs that wont matter after the water change at the end of 30 days, that kind of testing just creates concerns that the cycle wont complete but they always do, 100% of the time. wastewater testing is what drives the hobby crazy ha yep. check this thread out, 16 pages of tank cycling using all forms of rocks, and no testing. we predict the start date based on pics and statements, not tests. seems we're onto something/no death:

The microbiology of reef tank cycling.

You can skip your cycle. Ive been reefing online for twenty years and have never waited one second for a tank to cycle, because I buy rocks that are already cycled and move them home. Here's two: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/octo-high-end-sps-skip-cycle-build.713256/...

www.reef2reef.com

Sweet, so I should just leave it all alone now till day 30? No tests, no ammonia, nothing?

I trust you know what you're doing, however the local shop says that if I leave it that long, the bacteria will die as there's no ammonia for it to feed on. Is this correct? I thought bacteria lives on Ammonia and Nitrites?

 

[brandon429]

gotta read that thread for new info, they're wrong. in the thread we have a 3 year no feed test/proves new info is there for the observing. thread has lots of writing/threads/volume ha = price of free info. enjoy your so-simple cycle, we've saved you from buying extra bottle bac, wasting food, starting off with big algae challenges, and concerning about messing up the cycle. you cant lose whether you feed or not. fwd the email to your lfs crew and have em respond we need the new discussion energy there.

you can add some more feed and ammonia if you like, its no harm either way. the thread shows collections of those who both did and didnt. the final water change at 30 days/ everyone started off with a cycled tank (new fish didnt die overnite) regardless of their variance in the ramp up. the final water change is to start clean from all the random additions of ammonia people add, even the initial amounts they thought they added are usually totally ballparked.

 

[tuxy_v8]

gotta read that thread for new info, they're wrong. in the thread we have a 3 year no feed test/proves new info is there for the observing. thread has lots of writing/threads/volume ha = price of free info. enjoy your so-simple cycle, we've saved you from buying extra bottle bac, wasting food, starting off with big algae challenges, and concerning about messing up the cycle. you cant lose whether you feed or not. fwd the email to your lfs crew and have em respond we need the new discussion energy there.

you can add some more feed and ammonia if you like, its no harm either way. the thread shows collections of those who both did and didnt. the final water change at 30 days/ everyone started off with a cycled tank (new fish didnt die overnite) regardless of their variance in the ramp up.

haha! Thankyou for your help!

I'll just leave it alone then.

Are you able to advise on the lights? I'm honestly not sure where to start with them, but the profile I have seems ok?

 

[brandon429]

this is the definitive answer on all reef lighting: find the type of lights you use being used to grow coral in a search thread here to see details, any kind of sps growth means they'll grow every coral we keep. start your new tank at 40% less than norm or you'll be farming algae fast. work up only when coral density requires it. if you cant locate your lights on a search thread being used to grow coral then you get to make the new reference. if they can shine blue they'll work, I bet a big setup like that has reference threads already and works perfectly.

 

[tuxy_v8]

I would perform no tests, leave till day 30 total submersion, change water and begin with whatever bioload you have planned it'll be ready. We dont use testing other than ammonia and submersion time in my cycling threads, since nitrate and nitrite are almost never, ever read correctly in the hobby from titration test kits and that chart above solves for all variables when we know time only. you have a mighty easy cycle, nothing you do can stop it other than if you turned your tank water into literal bathroom cleaner. feed more, feed none, light v no light, add some liquid ammonia or not, add a rotten shrimp or not, all are the same ends at day 30 same as literally doing nothing and waiting now.

all we do is create interim spikes and troughs that wont matter after the water change at the end of 30 days, that kind of testing just creates concerns that the cycle wont complete but they always do, 100% of the time. wastewater testing is what drives the hobby crazy ha yep. check this thread out, 16 pages of tank cycling using all forms of rocks, and no testing. we predict the start date based on pics and statements, not tests. seems we're onto something/no death:

The microbiology of reef tank cycling.

You can skip your cycle. Ive been reefing online for twenty years and have never waited one second for a tank to cycle, because I buy rocks that are already cycled and move them home. Here's two: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/octo-high-end-sps-skip-cycle-build.713256/...

www.reef2reef.com

My tank is starting to show signs of algea.ia this normal? Will it clear on it’s own?

 

[brandon429]

You are now at the classic crossroads: do we allow or do we hand garden early growths

there’s no right answer, but I’ll tell you one thing- a neat way to gain perspective on best practices is to make threads for several years that invite people to post any invasion they have in your thread and you fix it in front of the world live time and discern causatives at the same time. The opinions you gain tend to diverge from the safe zoners

once those threads get out beyond ten pages, we begin to wish in total hindsight that the first layer of supporting growths was never allowed. Since new tanks had few grazers, or a hundred grazers who didn’t actually target anything, we wish they would have become the grazer and never allowed a 100% takeover of mass, seated in every rock crevice and in between every sand grain.

Ergo, you get two totally different answers about hands on/hands off early technique based on whether or not someone runs invasion restoration threads, which is a neat divider of perspective. The best info on invasions ironically doesn’t come from someone being an author or a practiced home aquarist/ super old or $ awesome tank, it comes from if they can link one iota of demo on working in others tanks where they don’t have full control. Anyone who runs those work threads recommends practice full tank control now before it’s all filled with goods, time to certainly clean. And next month too, as much as it takes.

 

[brandon429]

Also, that growth is an interesting bioindicator, it means your tank is cycled for nitrifying bacteria
filter bac / invisible without microscopy always deposit before benthic growths we can see with the unaided eye. By rule, filter bac have arrived and set up a slick shop before secondary growths appear which are the classic scums/reds/greens and hair algae. The order of ops for things we can and cannot see are underway here. No-test cycle confirmation has occurred

the bottle bac you added have seated and are done, it’s why we didn’t have to wait 30 days, the new growth mass is the indirect proof. These slicks give rise to new invasions which is part of how a reef matures into coralline and coral accretions vs plant selected, we can intervene and guide as needed and much guiding is required before coralline rules all surfaces. It’s easy/hands off work only at that point. Guide the reef clean, plant lots of good frags, feed well and change water very well during gardening months and dose liquid coralline seed is a good move.

 

[tuxy_v8]

Also, that growth is an interesting bioindicator, it means your tank is cycled for nitrifying bacteria
filter bac / invisible without microscopy always deposit before benthic growths we can see with the unaided eye. By rule, filter bac have arrived and set up a slick shop before secondary growths appear which are the classic scums/reds/greens and hair algae. The order of ops for things we can and cannot see are underway here. No-test cycle confirmation has occurred

the bottle bac you added have seated and are done, it’s why we didn’t have to wait 30 days, the new growth mass is the indirect proof. These slicks give rise to new invasions which is part of how a reef matures into coralline and coral accretions vs plant selected, we can intervene and guide as needed and much guiding is required before coralline rules all surfaces. It’s easy/hands off work only at that point. Guide the reef clean, plant lots of good frags, feed well and change water very well during gardening months and dose liquid coralline seed is a good move.

Apologies, I don't understand.

Do I leave the tank alone or clean it?