Green zoas taking over

pseudorand · Aug 29, 2021

Below is my zoa garden. 1.5 years in and it's starting to look good.

But those green ones. Not the big protopalys, but the small ones with green and purple in the center. They've already overgrown a very nice orange batch that I got at the same time. Now I'm worried about the taller brown ones in the upper right and the orange ones in the lower left.

Any hints? Can I just scrape them off with a razor blade and suck them up during a water change?

I know you're supposed to surround them with frag plugs and bring them to the lfs, but getting frag plugs around what is now a huge colony would be a major PITA. Plus, it would look bad. I've seen wonderful pictures of zoa gardens where different species grow right up next to each other and seem perfectly happy. How do I get that?

RedFrog211 · Aug 29, 2021

A key element to a balanced Zoa garden is similar growth rate; those Radioactive Dragon Eyes will continue to bloom and grow, so I would recommend cutting.

pseudorand · Aug 29, 2021

RedFrog211 said:
A key element to a balanced Zoa garden is similar growth rate; those Radioactive Dragon Eyes will continue to bloom and grow, so I would recommend cutting.

And an ID to boot! I was too lazy to keep track when I bought them. Thanks

So how do I cut them? I guess I'd ideally like to move them to somewhere barren away from the other zoas. I can do that by moving the original frag plugs (it's in there somewhere), but how do I get rid of the rest? Just scrape and kill, or is there a way to move them?

pseudorand · Aug 29, 2021

RedFrog211 said:
A key element to a balanced Zoa garden is similar growth rate; those Radioactive Dragon Eyes will continue to bloom and grow, so I would recommend cutting.

How do I know the growth rate of a zoa before I put it in? Even Tidal gardens doesn't warn about those being aggressive.

Also, they didn't just grow faster than their orange brethren -- they actively surrounded and killed the colony. Is that expected?

If it was just that my garden would be too green, I wouldn't be that concerned. But will they murder other zoas?

I'd been lead to believe zoas all get along, but I can testify from first hand experience that that's not the cases. (Thought perhaps the now-missing orange ones died of something else and the dragon eyes were just opportunistic.)

RedFrog211 · Aug 29, 2021

Observing is the best way to learn growth rate. See which colonies have an additional 2 polyps in a month, versus which have 5. I also personally frag colonies before attempting a Zoa garden, so I always have an isolated frag with that polyp incase things go wrong or I want to try a different orientation. Hope this can help! You can try to remove the Dragon eyes, or, as much as it sucks, remove the other colonies and try starting fresh on a new rock. Best of luck friend!

Reef and Dive · Aug 29, 2021

Most zoas and palys will have pretty different growth rates, and that changes a bit between tanks and even on the same tank.

If you want a garden with a lot of different ones you will often need to cut the fast growers:

After gardening:

pseudorand · Aug 29, 2021

What I'm trying to ask is how you cut them back. Just scrape them off with a razor and suck them up with the python? Or is there more to it?

anthonygf · Aug 29, 2021

This tool you can make yourself is great at removing unwanted pests, 1/4" stainless steel straw stuffed into a 1/2" hose with rubber band for a seal. I used it to suck out GHA, mushrooms maybe even aiptasia. Just start a siphon and scrape&suck what you want to remove. Easy and fun.

littlebigreef · Aug 29, 2021

An alternative is to kill your pumps, whip up some kalk paste and then apply it with a large syringe. Usually give it 15-20 mins and then siphon out the mess while being careful not to stir it up.

Cantusaurus · Aug 29, 2021

Are you in the LA area? I’d be willing to buy some of them off you

pseudorand · Aug 30, 2021

Cantusaurus said:
Are you in the LA area? I’d be willing to buy some of them off you

I'm not in L.A., sorry. But if I were, how would I get them off my rocks to sell?

BoneDoc · Aug 30, 2021

Can you move your rock out? If so, just take it out, cut it with a sharp razor and then peel them off from the rock, the reflux to a frag plug

Cantusaurus · Aug 30, 2021

pseudorand said:
I'm not in L.A., sorry. But if I were, how would I get them off my rocks to sell?

Hmm yeah. I've heard the best option if taking the rock out isn't an option would be to just use a razor/surgical blade to cut the stalk/scrape them off as close to the rock as possible, and then remove the zoas. But that isn't full proof, and the Zoas will grow back. Also small bits of toxin may flow around the tank. BUT either way definitely run extra, or new carbon with whatever method you decide. You may be able to use a plastic card (like credit card thing) to try and scrape them off the rock without cutting them, but this usually only works on flat surfaces on not as well on rock, but it may of the rock is flat enough, and depending on how the particular Zoas grow).
Also Do you want to take out all of the green dragon eyes? If not then maybe remove most of them, and then the other Zoas will have time to fill in the empty real estate, and the dragon eyes will not be able to cover as much territory since they will need more time.
Either way it'll take a lot of time out of one of your days, but I think it'll be worth it, and you can make a bunch of frags. They are "basic" Zoas, but hey I mean if theres a good amount of polyps on a frag plug I'm sure you can get 10-15 bucks depending on the size. If they are good growers, and a nice color people will definitely buy them and that will make it seem more worth it by doing this whole process.
With whatever you decide you should definitely do some extra things you may want to do such as fragging other additional zoas here and there, and possibly adding rubble or frag plugs in cleared out spots. Make the time worth it, and just do as much in one go

Hopefully this helps, but hey your tank looks beautiful!

But you can also move the orange Zoas too if you think they are not compatible growing together.
You can always move either Zoa to a small rock/rubble island on the sand bed or on the backwall of your tank (which they should be able to be easily fragged off with a credit card type object)

Best of wishes!

pseudorand · Sep 8, 2021

BoneDoc said:
Can you move your rock out? If so, just take it out, cut it with a sharp razor and then peel them off from the rock, the reflux to a frag plug

Turns out that rock is easily removable, and I harvested as many of the green dragon eyes as I could in the 5-10 min I dared leave it out of the water. I'll do more tonight.

However, the picture shows some green dragon eyes stick to the larger unidentified zoas. They're really stuck together and I didn't dare cut them off for fear of hurting the big ones I want to keep. Any ideas? Will the big ones be fine since they're taller and will get all the light, or will the dragon eyes eventually kill them?

On a brighter note, the dragon eyes I cut off are doing well and destined for my LFS. I also found some of the little orange ones I thought had perished, which are now alive and well, and will go back as soon as they reattach to a frag plug.

Just John · Sep 9, 2021

Can you get scissors in there to snip off the dragon eyes on both sides of the larger ones and just leave a bit of tissue stuck to the larger stalks?

Aldrinlights · Sep 14, 2021

I'm having a similar issue. The zoas in the center back section of this rock are growing so fast they are cutting through everything else. I'm now stuck with them I believe they will completely take over this entire garden. Also they are a lot larger than the others. Lesson learned I guess. Just gonna see how it goes.