Herbie Overflow with a manifold

[Idoc]

I'm designing the plumbing layout for my 75g (40g sump) tank. I'm planning on using a VarioS-6 DC return pump with a 1" return line that may or may not reduce to 3/4" with over-the-rim return line...still open on that!

I would like to use the Herbie overflow design, but was going to plumb the system to incorporate a manifold now (or at least make a connection...tee...in the return line in order to accommodate one in the future as my equipment grows). I should have plenty of output from my return pump to support the return to the tank plus the head pressure and a manifold. But, I've read mixed forum responses on the use of a Herbie system with a manifold...ie: having to re-dial in the drain flow, etc... if you add/stop items on a manifold. The other option is to add an additional smaller pump later to run a manifold on a separate line...but, don't want to go that route if not necessary!

Anybody (or know a friend) with a Herbie system and manifold and if it is actually a big problem? I'm open to suggestions...especially on the 1" vs 3/4" return line (LFS owner says go 1" to accommodate any flow requirements later).

 

[ironman20725]

Following

 

[Smo]

Conventional wisdom suggests don't T off your drain lines for the reasons you have already identified. Too much variability for the full syphon--not just turning equipment on and off but over time as flow rates thru reactors change as media begins to clog, etc. Also, you may be disappointed with the flow rates from a gravity drain.
Better to build a manifold on your return side. Should be no need for an additional pump.

 

[Xclusive Reef]

Conventional wisdom suggests don't T off your drain lines for the reasons you have already identified. Too much variability for the full syphon--not just turning equipment on and off but over time as flow rates thru reactors change as media begins to clog, etc. Also, you may be disappointed with the flow rates from a gravity drain.
Better to build a manifold on your return side. Should be no need for an additional pump.

Maybe I did not read the op but I don't think he intended to put a manifold on a drain line. Op what size returns are you going to have?

 

[Smo]

Maybe I did not read the op but I don't think he intended to put a manifold on a drain line. Op what size returns are you going to have?

As I read it again you are correct. A return manifold works just fine with my BeanAnimal. Same full syphon technique as a Herbie.

 

[Idoc]

Conventional wisdom suggests don't T off your drain lines for the reasons you have already identified. Too much variability for the full syphon--not just turning equipment on and off but over time as flow rates thru reactors change as media begins to clog, etc. Also, you may be disappointed with the flow rates from a gravity drain.
Better to build a manifold on your return side. Should be no need for an additional pump.

Sorry...maybe my original wording was confusing! I wasn't planning to "tee" off the drain line, but rather "tee" off the return line. Just wasn't sure if the "tee" off the return would mess with the full-siphon and dialing in the Herbie drain-line (which I plan on placing a gate valve on the full siphon line). Some have said that changing things on the manifold...just like you mention flow rates changing on reactors over time due to media...may cause fluctuations in the return pressure that will cause the herbie drain syphon to have to be altered regularly (or the DC pump flow altered regularly).

 

[Idoc]

Maybe I did not read the op but I don't think he intended to put a manifold on a drain line. Op what size returns are you going to have?

I will be using two 1" drain lines (a full siphon line and an emergency overflow line...tank was already pre-drilled with 2 holes (1.75") to accommodate 1" bulkheads). I'm open to suggestions on the actual return line that I will be placing over the top of the rim...1" vs 3/4"....many posts say 3/4" line is sufficient for the flow for a 75g tank, while others say go ahead with the 1" return line to the DT. I believe the VarioS-6 DC Pump has a 1.25" output that I will need to reduce down anyhow...

 

[Reefer1978]

The are lots of tanks with very complex manifolds on the return like that work just fine. Main thing to consider for your design is how much water you want to cycle through the tank, and make sure the return pump can push enough. I am running a manifold with 3 reactors on my return.

With VarioS line of pumps, I think you only get 6 speed settings. If you run it through Apex, you get more control. Make sure you add valves on every reactor on the manifold, and a gatevalve for the tank return line to be able to dial everything in as you need to. Gatevalves everywhere would be even better.

I am running 3/4 across the board on a 92 gallon tank.

 

[Idoc]

The are lots of tanks with very complex manifolds on the return like that work just fine. Main thing to consider for your design is how much water you want to cycle through the tank, and make sure the return pump can push enough. I am running a manifold with 3 reactors on my return.

With VarioS line of pumps, I think you only get 6 speed settings. If you run it through Apex, you get more control. Make sure you add valves on every reactor on the manifold, and a gatevalve for the tank return line to be able to dial everything in as you need to. Gatevalves everywhere would be even better.

I am running 3/4 across the board on a 92 gallon tank.

Thanks for the response! I was using 10x flow (750gph) as a baseline since this is what I see a lot in the threads on figuring out which pump to use. I was factoring in almost 4.5-5ft from sump to top of tank rim (I built a 40" stand) for head pressure. The VarioS-6 gives a max pressure of 1720gph...but is expected to give 1025gph at 4.8ft height. I figured that would be a good pump to use which would also allow me some loss pushing water to a manifold as well. I will be using a GHL Profilux4 controller...hopefully this controller will also be able to more accurately control the pumps output.

 

[Smo]

10x flow rate is old school. 5-6x is plenty good enough thru the sump to get good contact time. Make up the difference within the DT with well placed power heads.

 

[Idoc]

10x flow rate is old school. 5-6x is plenty good enough thru the sump to get good contact time. Make up the difference within the DT with well placed power heads.

Thanks! 5-6x does sound more reasonable. I've seen several stating that amount as well.