High nutrients, and LPS health,

[Ballyhoo]

I have two tanks mostly (other than that two 10 gal Nanos ) but I have a 42 gallon tank with a 10 gallon sump and a 30 gallon tank. The larger tank has very low nutrients and is provides barely visible pink on the Salifert test. That's a good thing given I have most of my valuable coral in the larger tank. The difference also being the larger tank and the sum I have a nice area with macroalgae refugium and I suppose this explains why I have such a low nitrate value in the larger 42 gallon tank. It's really a 52 gallon tank when you consider the sump versus the 30 gallon..
However, as far as the 30 gallon tank goes, there's no refugium and the nitrates seem out of control. I'm concerned for the torch coral in there, even seeing seems pretty healthy. I know that torch take a turn for the worst on a dime. Should I take all torch coral out of my 30 gallon tank given the high nitrate values you see here? Would love to hear some opinions.

 

[Red_Beard]

What is high? Like over 100? Also, what are the additional sources of nitrogen that you are adding to the tank? Food, dosing etc?

 

[VintageReefer]

I have two tanks mostly (other than that two 10 gal Nanos ) but I have a 42 gallon tank with a 10 gallon sump and a 30 gallon tank. The larger tank has very low nutrients and is provides barely visible pink on the Salifert test. That's a good thing given I have most of my valuable coral in the larger tank. The difference also being the larger tank and the sum I have a nice area with macroalgae refugium and I suppose this explains why I have such a low nitrate value in the larger 42 gallon tank. It's really a 52 gallon tank when you consider the sump versus the 30 gallon..
However, as far as the 30 gallon tank goes, there's no refugium and the nitrates seem out of control. I'm concerned for the torch coral in there, even seeing seems pretty healthy. I know that torch take a turn for the worst on a dime. Should I take all torch coral out of my 30 gallon tank given the high nitrate values you see here? Would love to hear some opinions.

Would you interpret that test as a 2.0 for nitrates ? If so, that is low. I aim for 5-10, just tested yesterday and nitrates are 9.5.

Many people run higher also

 

[Ballyhoo]

Would you interpret that test as a 2.0 for nitrates ? If so, that is low. I aim for 5-10, just tested yesterday and nitrates are 9.5.

Many people run higher also

I find Salifert color tests very difficult to interpret. I was amazed how wrong I was with a Sal phosphate test. I thought my phosphates were reasonably low until I got a hanna tester. So if the phosphate and the nitrate test are similar than I have very high nitrates as I'm showing quite dark pink as you see there it looks like 1.0, but my phosphates looked like .25 but then when tested with Hanna was showing them like 1.0. Anyways that's good to know. A lot of people are running high nutrients? Cause I read a lot on the Internet that nitrates can be damaging to coral or torch coral. my experience with torch versus other LPS is well, They have a lower survival rate.

also, as far as dosing goes, I mean, I do a little bit of AFR, some reeroid, but not a crazy amount. Phytoplankton and meaty food for the fish. usually pellet sometimes some flake, but less often.

 

[Fishfinder]

That is a nitrite test NOT a nitrate test. You need to get a NO3 test

 

[Red_Beard]

That is a nitrite test NOT a nitrate test. You need to get a NO3 test

I totally missed that, lol you are right!

I find Salifert color tests very difficult to interpret. I was amazed how wrong I was with a Sal phosphate test. I thought my phosphates were reasonably low until I got a hanna tester. So if the phosphate and the nitrate test are similar than I have very high nitrates as I'm showing quite dark pink as you see there it looks like 1.0, but my phosphates looked like .25 but then when tested with Hanna was showing them like 1.0. Anyways that's good to know. A lot of people are running high nutrients? Cause I read a lot on the Internet that nitrates can be damaging to coral or torch coral. my experience with torch versus other LPS is well, They have a lower survival rate.

also, as far as dosing goes, I mean, I do a little bit of AFR, some reeroid, but not a crazy amount. Phytoplankton and meaty food for the fish. usually pellet sometimes some flake, but less often.

Phytoplankton, reff roids, and fish food will all be nitrogenic input. In my eperience they need to have a nitrogen source readily available. Low nitrates work best when you are heavily inputting other sources, especially because nitrate is at the end of the cycle and takes the most effort for corals to utilize. Keeping available nitrogen in the form of nitrate is a good thing, and specifically how much depends on what other sources on N you are offering as well as how fast those other sources are depleted. If you are only scarcely feeding and dont have much nitrate, you are likely starving them. Whereas if you are dumping in food and roids by the cup full and still have low nitrate, your tank is likely not starving and is metabolising just right. Hopefully those ramblings help some, but i would not worry if it still looks happy and healthy.

 

[Ballyhoo]

That is a nitrite test NOT a nitrate test. You need to get a NO3 test

sorry, I did run a nitrate test. I just used the nitrite color chart. I think they're the same.

 

[Ballyhoo]

I totally missed that, lol you are right!

Phytoplankton, reff roids, and fish food will all be nitrogenic input. In my eperience they need to have a nitrogen source readily available. Low nitrates work best when you are heavily inputting other sources, especially because nitrate is at the end of the cycle and takes the most effort for corals to utilize. Keeping available nitrogen in the form of nitrate is a good thing, and specifically how much depends on what other sources on N you are offering as well as how fast those other sources are depleted. If you are only scarcely feeding and dont have much nitrate, you are likely starving them. Whereas if you are dumping in food and roids by the cup full and still have low nitrate, your tank is likely not starving and is metabolising just right. Hopefully those ramblings help some, but i would not worry if it still looks happy and healthy.

it's just that I have two different tanks, and two different situations. So the situation you describe where I'm dumping a bunch of food in and having low nitrate, that is descriptive ofmy large 42 gallon tank with the 10 gallon sump and macroalgae tefugium.

on the other hand, my smaller 30 gal is the one where I showed the no3 testing as very high pink . Everything looks OK, but I spent a lot of money on these torch and have grown fond of them , so I'm wondering what effect the high nitrate has on my LPS @ the smaller tank. It different situation and I'm pretty sure it's because I've been able to harvest or at least maintain a macro algae area in the larger tank.

 

[Fishfinder]

sorry, I did run a nitrate test. I just used the nitrite color chart. I think they're the same.

That color would probably be 25 on the NO3 test

 

[Ballyhoo]

That color would probably be 25 on the NO3 test

well, I think the image is fairly accurate as far as the amount of pink.

 

[Red_Beard]

25 still isnt really high for LPS. In my experience they tolerate high nitrates better than low/no nitrates. What are you doi g to control them? Waterchanges only? Or carbon dosing/skimming or anything? How quickly are they rising? Like they stay at 25 pretty consistently or you caught it at 25 and by next week it will be 30 or more?

If they are consistently 25, that is no worry at all and a little lower than i kept my hammer/softie tank. It ran at 30 for 4 or so years and the hammers loved it.

 

[VintageReefer]

well, I think the image is fairly accurate as far as the amount of pink.

I agree the pic looks to be accurate but if we don’t have the reference card we dont know what the value is. What’s that squares value on the nitrate reference card? I heard someone say 25. Is that correct?

 

[Fishfinder]

Ya it would be 25 on the NO3 test. My point was that the nutrients aren’t low on the big tank. So the little tank must be 100+

 

[Red_Beard]

I dont think they are. 100 is quite a bit darker than the sample color.

 

[Shirak]

If you are looking at your test results and getting 25ppm NO3 in the smaller tank and thinking it’s high and detrimental to your lps which it is neither high or detrimental, I am more concerned about your larger tank and the nutrients being too low. What are your test results for both tanks, nitrate and phosphate?

You are more likely to have coral health issues with lack of nutrients.
Refugiums are really effective at pulling nutrients and some elements out of the water. Corals need these same things. So if your refugium is too effective it can cause coral issues.

 

[Ballyhoo]

If you are looking at your test results and getting 25ppm NO3 in the smaller tank and thinking it’s high and detrimental to your lps which it is neither high or detrimental, I am more concerned about your larger tank and the nutrients being too low. What are your test results for both tanks, nitrate and phosphate?

You are more likely to have coral health issues with lack of nutrients.
Refugiums are really effective at pulling nutrients and some elements out of the water. Corals need these same things. So if your refugium is too effective it can cause coral issues.

well, you're asking me a couple of questions here. I will just say it with respect to the larger tank It is hard to find any pink in the Salifert sample. I can show another picture, but the thing is my larger appears to be matured now. The coral, and i used to have trouble with achro, and now even those are doing well. with respect to PO 3, I use a GFo reactor on all of my tanks and I keep the phosphate below .1. They've been @ zero occasionally and when that happens i turn off the reactor. I have my reactors and several devices controlled by intelligent power strips.I don't keep the reactors on 24 /seven, rather only a few hours a day.
I probably spent a lot more money and doing a lot more testing than the average person. But I think that's because I'm in into my second year and I have a lot of valuable coral, so i am constantly testing nitrate, phosphate, and alkalinity. Would love to hear more about other experiences with nitrate levels and LPS coral. I would not dare putting any achro in the smaller tank with the nitrates being high.
I also use a lot of different nutrients for the both tanks, RR, oyster sperm, and phytoplankton. Occasionally, I use Restor.

 

[Shirak]

You weren't asking about Acros. LPS generally prefer higher nutrients. 25ppm NO3 isn't high for LPS. Moving to the barely pink test on the larger tank may be worse for them then leaving them where they are. Yes there are other factors such as light, water flow, stability, amount of feeding and with what since LPS can catch food too. Someone that has low test numbers may have a thriving tank if they have a heavy fish population and feed heavily. Fish produce ammonia which the corals can take up directly as well as catch fish waste and particulate food. SO there isn't one straight answer. It's about finding what works for you. If you have had your LPS for multiple months and they look good and are growing and parameters have been where they are, then there isn't an issue. PO4 as you mention is important and glad you are monitoring and keeping below .1 but turning the GFO off when it goes too low (0).

 

[Ballyhoo]

You weren't asking about Acros. LPS generally prefer higher nutrients. 25ppm NO3 isn't high for LPS. Moving to the barely pink test on the larger tank may be worse for them then leaving them where they are. Yes there are other factors such as light, water flow, stability, amount of feeding and with what since LPS can catch food too. Someone that has low test numbers may have a thriving tank if they have a heavy fish population and feed heavily. Fish produce ammonia which the corals can take up directly as well as catch fish waste and particulate food. SO there isn't one straight answer. It's about finding what works for you. If you have had your LPS for multiple months and they look good and are growing and parameters have been where they are, then there isn't an issue. PO4 as you mention is important and glad you are monitoring and keeping below .1 but turning the GFO off when it goes too low (0).

thanks I enjoyed reading your post. It's hard for me to know exactly where I'm at with NO3 on my larger tank. I just know that it's minimal and seems pretty healthy. I'm wondering if I can feed more now . if I can even be more generous with the fish food, etc.

 

[Shirak]

thanks I enjoyed reading your post. It's hard for me to know exactly where I'm at with NO3 on my larger tank. I just know that it's minimal and seems pretty healthy. I'm wondering if I can feed more now . if I can even be more generous with the fish food, etc.

Does appear to just above 0. 2 maybe? You could try increasing feeding a little. I think a big challenge with reef keeping is adjusting feeding as the corals and fish grow and need more nutrients. You have to let your corals and tank inhabitants guide you.

For my current set up, I aim to keep my nitrates between 5 and 20 and my phosphate before .05 and .1 With regular testing at least once a week or sometimes 2 or 3 I can tweak my feeding and dosing. Currently dosing AFR so Alk is pretty stable between 8 and 8.5 ideally. Dosing ammonia since I have no fish in my current set up. I do feed several times a week a variety of dusty things and small pellets for the corals. I also dose phosphate as this one just can bounce all over the place quickly when trying to maintain pretty low levels. So if I am testing it's usually phosphate! The Goniopora get really ticked off and refuse to extend if it's close to 0. Keep in mind that test kits have a margin of error so a really low reading could be 0.

Here is part of the Goni Garden. Currently about 90% Goniopora. A few other things here and there such as a blasto and Paly. Small tank attached to this one that has some zoa, a mushroom and chalice and Stylophora.

Post some more pictures of your tanks!

 

[Ballyhoo]

what size tank is this?