If not ich… then what?

[zyrzyxen]

Hello all, I posted over the past few days on what I had suspected to be ich. This can be seen here.

As an update the following morning after the post I had anticipated starting treatment. Upon inspecting my fish, the fain dots or spots I had sawn only a few hours earlier could no longer be seen. Now I haven’t started any sort of treatment and my clowns are doing great. Nothing indicating otherwise that either may have been sick which has generally been the case. Having been my first experience with clowns, I just get super anxious and assume the worst as I really wanna do right by my clowns and keep them alive.

I guess my question now is what should I do if anything at all with my clowns? They are currently in an observation/QT and I’m checking parameters on a regular as to not have any toxic levels. Should I proceed with a copper treatment in the event my fish does have itch and try to eradicate it? What’s proper procedure any how if I want my DT to be free from any pest that may affect my fish in the future aside from having it run fallow for 70+ days?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

zyrzyxen Welcome to the Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis Forum!

The #fishmedic team and other knowledgeable members of our community will do our best to help you resolve your questions. Please provide as much of the following as you are able:

• Brief description of the issue you are observing and answers to the following questions:
  • How long have you had the fish with the condition?
  • Did you quarantine with medication when you first acquired the fish? (If Yes, which medication?)
• Current water quality measurements
• Clear photos of the issue taken using WHITE light and/or a short video of any behaviors (post in your response or on YouTube).

If you can help us by providing as much of the above info as possible, it will make diagnosing and providing recommendations for treatment MUCH easier! The Fish Medic team will get back to you as quickly as possible. In the meantime, other members of our community may also share their experience with similar situations and advice that they may have regarding your situation.

You may also feel free to provide a more detailed description of the condition if you wish to share more info than the above list.

Additionally, these links may be useful while you await a response:

• CURRENT QT PROTOCOL LINK
• HOW TO ASK FOR DISEASE DIAGNOSIS HELP LINK

 

[fishywishy]

You should still do copper treatment

 

[zyrzyxen]

You should still do copper treatment

literally just came across the BRSTV video on white spot diseases and what I initially saw on my clown looks exactly like that of what they showed for Lymphocystis which they proceeded to state no treatment is known.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

literally just came across the BRSTV video on white spot diseases and what I initially saw on my clown looks exactly like that of what they showed for Lymphocystis which they proceeded to state no treatment is known.

We really need clears pictures and videos to diagnose this for you.

Lymphocystis is a viral disease that goes away on its own without treatment. It creates growths that are much larger than ich and they last a month or so.

Ich spots are small and sharply outlined. At first, the spots will come and go, but if/when the infection ramps up, the spots return in huge numbers and the fish will typically die in a few weeks without treatment.

 

[zyrzyxen]

We really need clears pictures and videos to diagnose this for you.

Lymphocystis is a viral disease that goes away on its own without treatment. It creates growths that are much larger than ich and they last a month or so.

Ich spots are small and sharply outlined. At first, the spots will come and go, but if/when the infection ramps up, the spots return in huge numbers and the fish will typically die in a few weeks without treatment.

Most recent video can be found here.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Most recent video can be found here.

I don’t see lymphocystis on these fish. Ich is really difficult to see in videos of designer clowns, but I don’t see any evidence of that either.
The water seems a bit murky and the fish are breathing a bit fast. I would first add aeration and test for ammonia.

 

[zyrzyxen]

I don’t see lymphocystis on these fish. Ich is really difficult to see in videos of designer clowns, but I don’t see any evidence of that either.
The water seems a bit murky and the fish are breathing a bit fast. I would first add aeration and test for ammonia.

This was immediately post feed with food soaked in selcon so it made the tank murky. After having read what normal procedures look like with new fish and QT it seems copper treatment is fairly standard when QT prior to adding fish to DT. I did not realize this was the case. I had seen a video that stated copper treatment is like chemo for fish so why treat when not entirely sure. I’m just awaiting a Hanna checker to eliminate any guess work.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

This was immediately post feed with food soaked in selcon so it made the tank murky. After having read what normal procedures look like with new fish and QT it seems copper treatment is fairly standard when QT prior to adding fish to DT. I did not realize this was the case. I had seen a video that stated copper treatment is like chemo for fish so why treat when not entirely sure. I’m just awaiting a Hanna checker to eliminate any guess work.

Amine chelated copper like coppersafe and copper power are much safer than ionic copper is.

 

[zyrzyxen]

Amine chelated copper like coppersafe and copper power are much safer than ionic copper is.

Yeah, some had recommended Copper Power over Cupramine. Luckily I was able to swap out. One question I have is after having been in 2.0-2.5 levels for 30 days would Cuprisorb or water changes completely remove the copper?

 

[vetteguy53081]

Yeah, some had recommended Copper Power over Cupramine. Luckily I was able to swap out. One question I have is after having been in 2.0-2.5 levels for 30 days would Cuprisorb or water changes completely remove the copper?

Cuprisorb will remove most of it. To verify any trace left, use copper test kit to determine

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Yeah, some had recommended Copper Power over Cupramine. Luckily I was able to swap out. One question I have is after having been in 2.0-2.5 levels for 30 days would Cuprisorb or water changes completely remove the copper?

Water changes are the best way to remove amine chelated copper. You can use cuprisorb to remove the residual amount, where water changes become less effective. Say you do a 50% water change to start. The copper drops by half right off. Then, it takes another 50% change to remove 25% of the original copper, and so on…law of diminishing returns.

 

[zyrzyxen]

Water changes are the best way to remove amine chelated copper. You can use cuprisorb to remove the residual amount, where water changes become less effective. Say you do a 50% water change to start. The copper drops by half right off. Then, it takes another 50% change to remove 25% of the original copper, and so on…law of diminishing returns.

I did some observation on my clowns and noticed the one that has been bullied in the past couple weeks by the other, his tail doesn’t seem to be looking any better with the nipping. Would this be affected with copper treatment? Should I be placing the aggressor in a separate container within the QT? I would like to add I never see them fighting or nipping at each other and suspect it may be happening at night if anything.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I did some observation on my clowns and noticed the one that has been bullied in the past couple weeks by the other, his tail doesn’t seem to be looking any better with the nipping. Would this be affected with copper treatment? Should I be placing the aggressor in a separate container within the QT? I would like to add I never see them fighting or nipping at each other and suspect it may be happening at night if anything.

Clownfish are sly, they often stop fighting when you are in the room. Also, the fighting can be literally a few seconds each day and easily missed.

Rather than moving one of the fish to a new tank, you could try a tank divider.