Is an Apex worth it?

[omar jawad]

Personally, I love the APEX. The stability in my tank has been great. I build an 8 pump dosing system and the control of that is seemless. I haven't tried any other solutions, so for me, I'm not sure what to compare it to.

 

[smh254]

But if u have everything covered you will be just fine without it. I have 2 cobalt heaters in case one goes out I still have a back up. From what I understand these heaters are very unlikely to get stuck on. I have baby monitors facing the tank so I can look at it anytime. My Tunze ATO has multiple failsafes. I've done every test that I could think of Power outage, pumps fails, ATO stays on everything stays contained. Now with all that said I still want one but first I think I'm going to get the Mindstream if its ever released. Now that's something that will help me every day.

 

[smh254]

I sure hope I didn't just jinx myself.

 

[Newtybar]

I'm of a different opinion than some and say DO get the Apex Jr.

For the very reason you are stating. A lot of the newer equipment has built in self control (often times, much more advanced than what the Apex can do). However, there are nice things you can do with the Apex Jr. that makes life a bit easier. It also costs significantly less and you can pick it up used from those guys who feel they must have the best Apex for around $125.

• Temperature monitoring / regulation. If you don't buy an Apex, you'll probably have to buy one for $30-40 anyway....
• pH monitoring.
• Refugium light timer
• Return Pump (turn on and off from phone)
• Skimmer (turn on and off from phone)

That is all I am using it for, maybe I am under utilizing...but...

Lights have built in controller...
Doser has built in controller...
Gyre has built in controller...

Maybe one day when there is a device that can monitor all the levels (Nitrates, Phosphates, Calcium) and then connect to a doser to automatically dose based on the monitored levels...that will be when these things truly come in handy.

 

[ssdawood]

You know it's like this.

You don't realise you need an apex till you have one. Once you have it you wonder how you survived for so long.

 

[reeferKen]

Shiftline,
youtube AmericanReefChannel, his newest video up has the APEX disadvantages.

Then the video "Neptune Apex Sucks Power" on the same channel is interesting. Cheers.

 

[Terence]

Guys I will only chime in here to make a general point about internet connected controllers. For less than $250 a product from my company or a couple of others can do the most important thing to protect you from the most common reason people get out of this hobby - they lose a tank due to overheating due to a stuck on heater or due to environmental control failure (usually HVAC). No other "bits or bobs" can do this.

What they do is

1. Provide a second tier of control for your heater(s) and/or chiller in case they stick on. This can happen to both. (Even electronic thermostat heaters can and do stick, and it is not uncommon for children/grandchildren to play with chiller thermostat controls)

2. They alert you via email and text if your tank is out of temperature range and then even take measures to fix the issue by turning off equipment or turning on fans or air stones, etc.

Another misconception is that these things only happen when you are away for long periods of time. I only wish this were true. A night out for dinner and a movie is about all the time it takes to take most tanks from 78 to 84 degrees.

Yet another misconception is that these devices are only necessary for large tanks. The opposite is actually true as changes happen faster the smaller the tank.

And the last misconception is that they cost a ton of money. $240 gets you four controlled outlets, temperature monitoring and control, and internet connected monitoring and email and text alerts. And, with our product, the Apex Jr you also,get a great cloud service.

Add up the cost of mechanical timers and the more expensive electronic heaters instead of the less expensive ones and see how little extra you would pay to swap it out for a basic monitoring and control system.

 

[chris31759]

I use the middle model of the Apex with the lab grade Ph probe. I think of it as insurance. It sounds like you have everything covered except the heater part. As everyone has mentioned, the biggest plus is the ability to monitor and control so many things remotely. Receiving alerts is awesome. I will say the echosmartlive is a better and prettier web interface to control your lights. But I still use my Apex everyday.
Here is a list:
1 Temperature +/-
2 Leak Detection
3 Ph (stop dosing)
4 Remote Camera
5 Lighting
6 Turning equipment on and off for cleaning.
7 Feeding schedule.

You can buy an additional probe to monitor ORP. After reading Randy Holmes Farley's description of ORP, I decided not to monitor ORP. It is one less thing I have to worry about.

It is an expensive controller but I do feel it is worth it. I still would classify the controller as a want versus a need.

Now that I own one, I wouldn't go back to living with out one.

 

[Reef_Obsession]

Just pulled the trigger on an Apex system. I'm setting up a new 120g in a brand new house so I want to do things right and I feel like an Apex system is a step in the right direction. now... have to decided on lighting... o_O

 

[shiftline]

The alerts are one of the best features in my eyes. Especially when away. Much more advanced than my crude system!

I still love the idea of the controller however I have a hard time shelling out the $$ (especially with the Canadian dollar right now.. They are a good 30% more roger now ). I do keep hearing ever know who has one wouldn't go back so they must be good ;)

My budget leak detector

And mantiance switches.... And backup heater controller :)

I still like the idea of them assuming the price is right. May keep an eye out for a used one for my future build.

Is the whole point of monitoring PH to deal with a doser malfunction? Is there any other real benefit to monitoring it?

 

[reeferKen]

smh254,
might want to read up on the 16 page long Cobalt neotherm heater thread at reef central.

"From what I understand these heaters are very unlikely to get stuck on"

 

[shiftline]

In my experience mine has been great. The heater cont let is just an additional safety that will hopefully never be used.

 

[jt17]

Totally worth it. If I had one on my FOWLR 125 gal. back in college (not that that technology was around then, but if), I would have known there was a power failure and could have got there in time save a lot of great fish. I was only an hour away over the weekend and returned to our second worse fear in the hobby. Now we have battery back ups (which was my first purchase when I got back into the hobby), but they don't run forever and with an apex you will know how long they've been running for. Ive had a heater fail and got an alert the temp was down. It runs my chiller and 3 heaters each set to come on in at 77.8, 77.7 and 77.6 degrees. I push one button to turn off all power heads during feeding and they automatically come back on 5 minutes later. A nice feature for tank sitters. Just picked up 2 WAV pumps. Nothing revolutionary about them but what I like is the dry side magnet is enclosed and can be submerged in my overflows so I can mount them on the side of the overflow to eliminate the dead spots in-between the overflows.
It's all about control of everything attached to your tank in one spot. Do you have to have one? No, there are many amazing tanks that do not. It is about peace of mind.

 

[EllisJuan]

They are a luxury item. They are not needed to run a tank, but they are nice to have. If you have the disposable income to spend on your tank, imho an Apex is a great way to spend it. I can tell you, once you have one you will wonder why you did not get one sooner.

 

[Terence]

...Just picked up 2 WAV pumps. Nothing revolutionary about them but what I like is the dry side magnet is enclosed and can be submerged in my overflows so I can mount them on the side of the overflow to eliminate the dead spots in-between the overflows.
It's all about control of everything attached to your tank in one spot. Do you have to have one? No, there are many amazing tanks that do not. It is about peace of mind.

Thanks for being an awesome customer of ours!

I will have to chime in here though and say that there are a number of unique and innovative features on the WAV. I will not list them all here, but one thing you may have not seen is that when you lower your water level for a water change or remove them from the water for cleaning, they will automatically turn off. When you return them to the water, they will come back on. Also, they can alert you (by text or email) when they run out of normal parameters (like when they might be overly dirty) and they can be set up to automatically turn off if they fall off the glass (and alert you).

 

[diablomaster9045]

Thanks for being an awesome customer of ours!

I will have to chime in here though and say that there are a number of unique and innovative features on the WAV. I will not list them all here, but one thing you may have not seen is that when you lower your water level for a water change or remove them from the water for cleaning, they will automatically turn off. When you return them to the water, they will come back on. Also, they can alert you (by text or email) when they run out of normal parameters (like when they might be overly dirty) and they can be set up to automatically turn off if they fall off the glass (and alert you).

that's cool!!! I might need to pick up a pair of these when one of my jebao's crap out

 

[smh254]

smh254,
might want to read up on the 16 page long Cobalt neotherm heater thread at reef central.

"From what I understand these heaters are very unlikely to get stuck on"

Thanks for the info

 

[Titanwerx]

Worth it! Love it!

 

[trahelyk]

I just bought an Apex and set it up over the weekend, so I'm about 3 days into the experience. I do think it's a luxury item, if a somewhat irresistible one. A big part of the appeal to much of the hobby for me is the cool gadgetry, and the Apex is a really fantastic gadget. I'm a biostatistician in my day job, so having access to all that real-time data really pushes my buttons--being able to see how the PH swings in sync with the light cycle, how far the tank temperature swings between heater cycles, how energy use correlates with various pieces of equipment--I just can't resist that stuff. And so far I've been really surprised at just how customizable the thing is: you can do everything you need to do through the very user-friendly Fusion interface, or you can telnet into this thing and manipulate data files directly. So cool.

Having said that, if it doesn't fit the budget or if gadgetry doesn't do it for you, I don't see why you couldn't accomplish the main things the Apex does with disparate pieces of equipment. Probably the main non-luxury thing it offers is the safety features--things like leak detection, notifications, and the ability to shut things down (or turn things on) remotely. That piece of mind is probably worth a lot, but for me it's really overshadowed by just what a fun toy it is.

 

[trahelyk]

Is the whole point of monitoring PH to deal with a doser malfunction? Is there any other real benefit to monitoring it?

I think it can also be helpful to monitor PH so you can do things to minimize how much PH fluctuates with your light cycle. For example, you might tweak the timing or intensity of your sump light to keep PH more stable throughout the day and night.