Is reef keeping just madness?

[The Opinionated Reefer]

I have been thinking about this a lot recently and if you really think about it, reef keeping is just plain madness. It is an extremely difficult hobby in fact harder than any other pet-related hobby by a wide margin. I know there are different levels of reef keeping with softies being the easiest then LPS and SPS with Acropora dominant tanks being the hardest by far. But the reality is if you are not a highly intelligent, highly conscientious, and diligent person you'll really struggle. The type of person who is able to spend weeks and months trawling through forums and blogs researching and collating information and is able to interpret this information that has come from many different sources into workable solutions to problems while at the same time able to grasp the subtleties and finesse involved in managing a reef tank. Your average extroverted social media-using person is not this.

Of the people who actually do manage to get to grips with the hobby many of them quit because they realize that it is much more costly and time-consuming than they had initially thought. The level of care, dedication, and perfectionism involved is just not worth it to them. I mean you could have something like a Lake Malawi cichlid tank for far less money and hassle and it will look almost as nice in your home.

The hobby for most is a never-ending stream of problems stemming from not managing water params properly to fish and coral parasites, diseases, and general pests. We don't understand coral pests, diseases, stressors, or life cycle in any depth & until the coral reefs have ridiculous money thrown behind in-depth research we never will.

I have this goal of creating a stunning successful SPS-dominated tank and for a large part, I have achieved that goal. But I find the constant stream of issues from Cyano to STN to AEFW and basically anything tank-related that detracts from the goal extremely stressful and annoying to point of thinking this is just madness. Especially when you count up how much money all this costs.

 

[JumboShrimp]

Q: “Is reef keeping just madness?”
A: “Yes.”

(Next question, please.) Ahahahahaha.

 

[brandon429]

reefkeeping is madness when we select tanks too big to control. I guarantee anyone serious can run a reefbowl 3 years and enjoy it if you follow directions, grow any coral you want. even if you don't understand reefing you can run a thermometer and thump the bubbles off a swingarm hydrometer to create saltwater. and that's all a reef bowl needs to run...that and having directions followed.

fish bring in the headaches

 

[RMS18]

Yea this hobby is madness for sure, after a few years I think all reefers come to understand the pests and bad stuff is part of the hobby. I don't see many long term tanks either. It's be cool to know the average life out R2R tanks. Maybe R2R can put up a poll.

 

[Nick Steele]

It all depends on the person and the type of tank they want to run.

You could easily setup a softie tank and have it be very easy and super cheap too. Barely need to test anything.

Lps aren’t much more difficult than softies and add a bit more depth etc IMO. Testing a little more important.

Sps on the other hand if you want to give a sps dominant tank a shot you better be ready for some trail and error.
Testing is super important and needs to be done to have a successful tank.

I set my tank up almost 2 years ago and started with lps and softies. That went well (almost never tested anything) so I decided I wanted to try sps (I knew it would tank much more effort) got a few frags and it didn’t go so well bad batch of salt, Dino’s and then after them I got cyano. I’m still in it as I know I can overcome it all and one day have a super gorgeous mixed reef tank!

Some people just aren’t cut out for it. Heck I even went out and bought a $150 microscope to just look at things in the tank for fun! I love it and I especially love the hurdles I have to go through.

 

[renzema]

I think the game has changed over the decades.

When I started it was hacked together shop lights with special bulbs, skimmers were horribly inefficient, the idea of a fuge was cutting edge, a lot of the information was very difficult to parse together and conflicting. My first few years were just learning to read the inhabitants because there wasn't online information. I was one of the first in the world to breed specific clownfish and it was a lot of trial and error. You just had to be REALLY dedicated to produce amazing tanks and there was a very small tight nit group who were achieving it.

Now a days. If someone wants to go straight to SPS high tech tank, it is doable. The hobby has advanced so much in the last decade that I think the difficulty has been brought down to a level the average person can achieve a pretty awesome tank.

I do think this has come at a cost because people jump in get a lot of high end corals and then loose interest for a bit and everything dies. Then they jump back in and head to the fish store.

Yes it does take a special madness but it is doable now. 20+ years ago you had to be crazy dedication to have success with specific corals/fish.

 

[MarshallB]

I always liked the comparison of keeping a reef tank to the space station. We are trying to keep an ecosystem that is just surrounded by death.

It's hard, there is a lot to learn, its a huge time and money investment. and can be riddled with failure.

In the end, with enough patience and a little luck, the juice is 100% worth the squeeze. My tank is still relatively new. 1 inch frags are now 2 inches, but i can picture what its going to look like once matured. I'm just in too deep not to see it through.

 

[Nano sapiens]

To a large extent, reef keeping can be as simple or as complex as one cares to make it.

On the one end of the spectrum one can have a very nice and healthy aquarium with just mushrooms, zoanthids and soft coral. Easy maintenance, not too picky about parameters and basic maintenance.

On the other end is something like what you have an SPS (Acropora) dominated system that requires a much finer attention to detail and stability.

And then there's everything in between...

Most pests are either easily prevented or not too difficult to deal with, but granted a few are very invasive and persistent.

Severe cyano and algae issues are typically due to a system not being mature (more severe/longer duration when only dry rock is used vs. true live rock) or self-inflicted by the aquarist (too much food, drug treatments killing beneficial bacteria, not enough flow, etc., etc.).

The size of a system can also be a big factor regarding perceived difficulty with pros and cons going both ways.

Cost incurred defintiely has some relationship to the size of the system and type of organisms kept, but it also tends to be inversely proportional to ones level of experience and knowledge. Many of the best and most respected reef keepers run some rather simple systems with amazing results.

Finally, there is validity to the statement that certain personality types will tend to stay engaged in this hobby for the long term, while other types will not. But that's also true of other hobbies...

 

[bpbonds]

Yes madness! But the challenge of keeping live Marine animals in your home is so appealing its worth the frustration, headache, money, and confusion with new and old technology. I truly think you can make it as easy or as hard as you choose depending on the type of fish, corals you decide to keep.

 

[flyingscampi]

I also own a boat.

I rest my case, m'lud.

 

[The Opinionated Reefer]

I can see that a softy/LPS tank would be much easier to maintain and look after. I guess a lot of the stress is self-inflicted in my case as I am trying to keep the hardest tank in the hobby and have been relatively successful at it but every time I see an acro with stn or something I get really ticked off about it.

 

[Zionas]

There’s surely beautiful SPS but you can have a tank that’s beautiful with just softies and LPS. I like to see it as: It’s what you make of it. Not everyone will or can go for an SPS dominant tank and succeed with it, it requires a delicate balance of light, nutrients (or lack of), and other factors. I’m not going for a tank like that any time soon and maybe I never will.

To be honest I don’t even get the appeal of having all the colorful, rainbow colored corals and frags (many expensive) in a tank and by far prefer a natural, flowing look. I love some LPS like the fleshy varieties, Euphyllia, Candy Canes and Bubble Corals.

I’m honestly more of a fish guy over a coral guy.

So I think you really don’t need to go for an SPS dominant tank to have a setup you can enjoy. Maybe tone it down a bit, and perhaps things will get better for you and your mind.

There’s really no other hobby quite like this.

How about we invite some of the guys here who keep little to no SPS, and let them show you their setups.

Feeding a fleshy LPS coral, or seeing the waviness of Euphyllia or even GSP for that matter is FAR more satisfying than a bunch of Acros.

OrionN’s tank has very little SPS, maybe even none, but the combination of LPS, softies, and most of all, his fish collection is amazing.

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

Q: “Is reef keeping just madness?”
A: “Yes.”

(Next question, please.) Ahahahahaha.

This pretty much covers it, Yeah.

 

[Nano sapiens]

I can see that a softy/LPS tank would be much easier to maintain and look after. I guess a lot of the stress is self-inflicted in my case as I am trying to keep the hardest tank in the hobby and have been relatively successful at it but every time I see an acro with stn or something I get really ticked off about it.

Yeah, it's certainly a let-down when SPS perish, especially when all parameters are 'spot-on' and there is no apparent reason for the demise. Only consolation perhaps is that it happens in nature, too.

Speaking of difficulty, if you really want to stress then a full-blown small polyped NPS (non-photosynthetic) system is IMO the most challenging (relatively few have succeded in keep a successful one going for an extended period of time).

 

[Sharkbait19]

Haha, no doubt that reefing is madness! There is literally no rhyme or reason to it! One moment, your tank looks wonderful, the next, your expensive torch coral has erupted into brown jelly. But, it’s all part of the fun!

 

[NoahLikesFish]

I have been thinking about this a lot recently and if you really think about it, reef keeping is just plain madness. It is an extremely difficult hobby in fact harder than any other pet-related hobby by a wide margin. I know there are different levels of reef keeping with softies being the easiest then LPS and SPS with Acropora dominant tanks being the hardest by far. But the reality is if you are not a highly intelligent, highly conscientious, and diligent person you'll really struggle. The type of person who is able to spend weeks and months trawling through forums and blogs researching and collating information and is able to interpret this information that has come from many different sources into workable solutions to problems while at the same time able to grasp the subtleties and finesse involved in managing a reef tank. Your average extroverted social media-using person is not this.

Of the people who actually do manage to get to grips with the hobby many of them quit because they realize that it is much more costly and time-consuming than they had initially thought. The level of care, dedication, and perfectionism involved is just not worth it to them. I mean you could have something like a Lake Malawi cichlid tank for far less money and hassle and it will look almost as nice in your home.

The hobby for most is a never-ending stream of problems stemming from not managing water params properly to fish and coral parasites, diseases, and general pests. We don't understand coral pests, diseases, stressors, or life cycle in any depth & until the coral reefs have ridiculous money thrown behind in-depth research we never will.

I have this goal of creating a stunning successful SPS-dominated tank and for a large part, I have achieved that goal. But I find the constant stream of issues from Cyano to STN to AEFW and basically anything tank-related that detracts from the goal extremely stressful and annoying to point of thinking this is just madness. Especially when you count up how much money all this costs.

i think this hobby is quite simple. just get leathers and montipora and it will look exactly the same imo

 

[N.Sreefer]

Yes it is but so is life!

 

[jfoahs04]

I have been thinking about this a lot recently and if you really think about it, reef keeping is just plain madness. It is an extremely difficult hobby in fact harder than any other pet-related hobby by a wide margin.

I don't necessarily agree. It has levels of difficulty, and the "madness" component comes into play usually when someone has bitten off more than they can chew. After several reefs, I can say for certain that I am not the type that's ever going to have a 350g SPS/Acro tank with $5k collector fish. I don't have the patience for the coral, and the risk of incidents leading to fish mortality and/or requiring the tank to be shut down/reset is too great to justify the cost. Plus, I'm very content with relatively easy to care for corals and fairly common, hardy fish with interesting behavior traits.

I think there may be less margin for error in reefing (especially with SPS), but I have a hard time calling it "harder" than any other pet-related hobby. My father raised and trained pointers and retrievers. The level of commitment required to be successful easily rivaled that of reef keeping. Losing fish and coral is hard, but losing dogs was harder even if it happened far more infrequently. My fiancee comes from a family of equestrians which is infinitely more expensive, requires insane commitment (either hire staff, or spend multiple hours per day in the barn), and comes with a seemingly endless list of hurdles. Horses are incredible animals, but extremely fragile in so many ways and they can turn from healthy to near-death pretty quickly. If you're truly passionate about any of these, though, it's worth the effort and even the losses.

Of the people who actually do manage to get to grips with the hobby many of them quit because they realize that it is much more costly and time-consuming than they had initially thought. The level of care, dedication, and perfectionism involved is just not worth it to them. I mean you could have something like a Lake Malawi cichlid tank for far less money and hassle and it will look almost as nice in your home....

Again, I think a lot of this comes with biting off more than one can chew. Knowing what you're able to invest in terms of time and money is essential to having success in the hobby. I'd love to have a giant SPS tank. But I don't have the time to commit to making it happen and I'm unwilling to hire anyone to help. So it's not happening. I love reefing, but I also love traveling and spending time away from home. I build my reefs accordingly to allow me to be hands-off for a period of time. My livestock is all hardy and relatively low maintenance, and the tanks are equipped to be self-sustaining for up to a week or two. I build smaller tanks which are a lot less expensive to stock and run. I've run into issues in reefing, but the margin of error in my systems has generally allowed me to bounce back.

I think the person who would find cichlids as stimulating as reefing should never have been in the hobby to begin with. For many of us, the fish are only a piece of the whole. I love my fish (and cichlids are fun - I had some in my first ever tank), but most of us reefers press our noses to the glass and look for the tiny little things happening with the coral, in the rocks, in the sand bed, etc. Freshwater is no substitute for that.

I have this goal of creating a stunning successful SPS-dominated tank and for a large part, I have achieved that goal. But I find the constant stream of issues from Cyano to STN to AEFW and basically anything tank-related that detracts from the goal extremely stressful and annoying to point of thinking this is just madness. Especially when you count up how much money all this costs.

It sounds almost like this is a reactionary response. I don't disagree that it's frustrating to deal with this stuff, but it comes with the territory and should be expected by anyone looking to get into reefing. It's like buying a horse thinking that it's all going to be sunset rides along the beach when the reality is that the vast majority of time is going to be spent feeding, grooming, cleaning stalls, paying vet bills, farrier fees, buying food, hay, shavings, dealing with colic, laminitis, allergies, worms, or just having a horse that's easily spooked. Not to mention, it's prohibitively expensive to most. But like reefing, there's a dedicated subset of people who knew all this getting into the hobby and did it anyway (and actually enjoy some of the dirtier work). Whether it's reefing or equestrian (or something else), you could call the people who know the risks but partake anyway "mad." But I'm more surprised at the people who in 2021 have access to a library of instant information at their finger tips and still manage to be surprised at how expensive, time consuming, and sometimes frustrating this hobby can be.

 

[James_O]

If you truly love what you do, it’s not a chore. Some people get into this hobby because they just want to try it out. Me on the other hand? I have a passion for keeping fish and coral. This makes it part of my life, not a chore.

reefkeeping is madness when we select tanks too big to control.

I completely agree with this. This is exactly why I started with a 29g tank, so I still have some room to work with, but it’s not too big.

 

[brandon429]

Plus with a 29 gallon it’s small enough to disassembly clean as a worst case scenario


invasion takeover is most of the reason folks quit and get overwhelmed


all procedural rules for reefkeeping come from large tank rules where disassembly cleaning isn’t practical so it doesn’t exist as a training option. What does exist is water only reactions, nothing direct to target, using test kits that range wildly in readings when compared to digital kits, retail purchases of dosers and back seat wait and hope reefing. Oh and a sandbed that’s never cleaned, cleaning is bad




but we can easily beat with disassembly cleaning in a 29 dinos, green hair algae, cyano, chrysophytes, invasive caulerpa, aiptasia, valonia, diatoms, ulva and dictyota


thats where we take apart the reef, kill the target, and reassemble the tank as a cheat new build that saves all the rocks and corals and fish…waiting months for hopeful water only actions to pan out wasn’t the only way and in fact it’s the worst way to train someone to reef. new reefers arrive there after years of resolved, purposeful direct control reefing. Can’t start on hands off cruise control, only the lucky and the masterful pull that off.


res publica needs to know how to rip clean by day 2 of any decent reef tank procedural training and then by year three if you’re good, the reef will self run much better. At a minimum this saves countless nano reefs from willing invasion takeover


its impractical for large tankers, but at least half the reefing world now has a practical control option. If you own a nano reef and want to be uninvaded, you can be by 5 pm today. An owner of an invaded large tank will nearly always toil with it until late October at minimum and if it’s dinos, they’re on the hook till March of 22.