JF Homewrecker - Is it worth it?

[bubbaque]

I don't buy into the theory you can't make your money back or even profit. Even if you buy a frag now for $400 and sell a few frag in a year for $250-300, then you made your money plus some and any time you you sell a frag in the future, even at a cheaper rate your making money.

I have seen you say you can buy a WD in your area for $50 but I yet to ever see a frag for that price. Even if someone is selling them for that price there is a few small amount for that price but the over all market is not that cheap. The average cost is still $100-200.

My local fish stores are WWC, top shelf aquatics and living reef and you could not walk in there with a $100 bill and walk out with a WD.

 

[jda]

Come to Denver. I can take you around. Each market has it's share of overstock. When I was in KC, it was GSP for free... everywhere. People pay for it here... not much, but they pay. Not everybody will ship. Just know that a year ago people made fun of me for posting this same type of thing about Fox Flame.

For each person who thinks that they can get their money back, there are many other that do not. Plan on not making anything and be happy if you do. The only stuff that sells for consistent money, or goes up in value, are the old school stuff that is hard to keep... and Bounces and Jawbreakers.

 

[jda]

BTW - this desire to recoup costs is where the booger-sized frags come from. I have no venom for this, but lots of people like to make fun of people selling boogers and posting a picture of a "mother" colony the size of a finger nail. This is to try and get some money back. This is what a lot of people have to do that get into the game late and need to sell something before the market drops. It is smart money-wise... but it can kill both the frag and the coral and is kinda-risky.

 

[izzyishh]

Im a DFW local and have WWC Bounce for trade lets talk

 

[Tallison]

BTW - you will not make any money on this... maybe, but probably not. If you wanted to, you should have been in at the beginning. The market quickly saturates with these corals since 1). they are easy to grow and 2). the people who will pay high dollar for a trick-coral are real, but a small percentage of the market. ...so the people who want them and will pay get them quickly/first and then the price drops.

There are people around me selling WD for $50 for 1/2 frags. ...the local market is saturated with the clientele that want this coral... they all have it.

Not looking to make money as I have a job and dont really want to get into the world of propagating corals. Just something that I can grow into a colony and sell a few frags of to recoup my money. You hit the nail on the head, I run 2 radion XR 15s at 65% in 150

 

[Tallison]

Im a DFW local and have WWC Bounce for trade lets talk

pm'd

 

[AquamanE]

the only way I can express it to someone that hasn't seen one is that it is one of the only corals that is as color-saturated in person as it is photo-saturated online under actinic lighting.

I agree. HW- Spectacular coral under almost all lighting, unlike WD. HW is a gem. WD is nothing but an average coral unless you do the over exagerated blue lights.

Cant wait till HW is at a lower price.

 

[Tallison]

Welp. Looks like I'm pulling the trigger on a JF Homewrecker from Cherry Corals that'll be here Saturday. I'll do my best to document its arrival and progression on here

 

[29bonsaireef]

Shoulda done a little more research. There's plenty of mariculture acros coming in that look identical, if not the same wild strain as HW. If you weren't looking to make money off the coral or worried about the name. You can buy these (colonies) for a fraction of the cost of a frag. Might take a little time to color up, but a 1/4" frag will also take time to grow.

 

[hatfielj]

Acros? What kind of lights do you have? Do you need no-tricks-awesome color, or do you want to black-light them like a WWC or Vivid colony?

If no-tricks, then look to the old-school classics that everybody loves. True GARF Bonsai is a fan-favorite in my house. Red Devil nasuta. Christmas Mirabilis is a beautiful red/green. Palmers Blue Millepora. A good Rose/Pink millepora with some electric sheen (some have them and some do not).

If you are LED and like the WWC and Vivid look, then home wrecker is for you. Confetti. WD, like you have.

It is too bad that you cannot do smoothies - this makes me think that you might have LEDs... if so you are not alone... while not impossible to do smoothies with LEDs, many, many struggle.

Lol, someone is being a bit passive aggressive calling everything "trick-corals"

The problem with calling these "trick-corals" is that you are assuming that it's easy to get these colors to show just by using some special tricks you are referring to. If that were the case, everyone would be able to do it. The truth is getting these corals to show their amazing color is not as easy as it seems. Yes, many of them require the use of blue lighting to see, but that's not a trick. That's just because these are natural UV pigments being produced by the coral for the algae that live in its tissue and the only way to see the UV spectrum is to use certain blue lighting. However, it's not just a matter of using a certain type of light. The corals have to be very happy and healthy to display their best colors. That requires real knowledge and skill. That's not a trick either.

You may not be a fan of WWC, Vivid or whoever it is you're against, but it's not fair to go around calling them "tricksters." I challenge you to post a pic of a coral you've grown that looks as good as one of theirs.

With that being said, I'm not a fan of the crazy high prices either. I would never pay $1300 for a 1/2 nub of a frag (https://worldwidecorals.com/wwc-budgie-smuggler-acropora-10149.html), but if someone else is willing to do it I'm not going to judge them for it. For some people 1300 bucks is a drop in the bucket and if they want to pay it, let them pay it. And WWC is a business, trying to make a profit. I can't blame them for selling stuff at prices people are willing to pay for. I just patiently wait for prices to come down on the pieces I like. I got a frag of Home Wrecker for 300. That's a price I'm willing to pay to have a coral I like now. Sure, in another 2-3 years it might be down a lot more in price, but by then I'll have a big colony to enjoy in my own tank.

 

[hatfielj]

Shoulda done a little more research. There's plenty of mariculture acros coming in that look identical, if not the same wild strain as HW. If you weren't looking to make money off the coral or worried about the name. You can buy these (colonies) for a fraction of the cost of a frag. Might take a little time to color up, but a 1/4" frag will also take time to grow.

I call BS on this post.

Link? Where are you seeing these maricultured colonies that look identical to HW? Jfox got his on a diving trip from a wild colony. Yes there are lot's of maricultured colonies of Acropora Tenuis, but good luck finding one that displays the same color as HW. You would have to buy a lot of colonies and have a large enough system to quarantine and care for them for quite some time before you'd get lucky enough to find something as spectacular as HW or many of the other highly sought after corals on the market. The costs and risks of doing so are far greater than just buying a frag of an already established piece from a vendor. You'd spend thousands of dollars on many, many drab corals before you'd ever find one close to HW or others. Let the vendors who already have an established business take that risk and when they find a gem, buy a frag of it and enjoy.

 

[Jamie7907]

I’ve seen several mariculture colonies that look close but until they’ve been in captivity for awhile it’s hard to say if they will be identical. From what I’ve seen you aren’t allowed to take wild acropora colonies from Indonesia, not even JF. The cites I saw this year allowed only 3 wild colonies to be taken for all of Indonesia. A lot of Indonesia sellers offer home wrecker and wd lookalikes as mariculture pieces for $15-$25 and I can buy a lot of those before I get to $300 or more for a 1/4” nub. I have both hw and wd in my system and neither are anything special in anything but blue light, that goes both ways though corals like pm and obt are blah in blue light but phenomenal in white light. Beauty is always in the eye of the beholder. And I don’t think people should blindly support vendors that are paying between 15-25 for colonies only to turn around and sell you a 1/4” nub of a photoshopped piece for $600. JFox is one of my favorite vendors and one that I can say I never felt burned after buying from him not like a lot of the other vendors.

 

[jda]

I am not being passive aggressive... I am directly flat out saying that they use photos of oversaturated pics and under light that is not capable of growing them full time. They will flat-out admit that they edit the pics. Do you really know what you are talking about with UV and lighting? You cannot see UV spectrum. There is no true UV in RB lighting or even in the Radions that they use - their UV is more true violet with just a small touch of real UV. The best source of UV is a Metal Halide and some T5s. You cannot see this anyway... and if you could, it would get used up below 400nm and get seen as violet or maybe a violet/blue as they are spit back out.... none of the reds, most blues, yellows or greens in the trick photos have anything to do with UV and are 200nm, or more away from the UV spectrum. I think that they term that you are looking for is fluoresce.

Passive aggressive is more like the posts that you see that are in the vein of: "I got a X frag from a high-end sponsor who will not be named who showed me a photo and the coral never looked like this in the two years that I owned it."

I did not call them "tricksters." You did. They don't pretend to be anything else. They admit that they take photos under different lights than you grow the coral under. They admit that they doctor them. They are just trick photos, not dishonest about it. Would it make you fell better if I called them Illusionists? They have a market. The cater to it. Not everybody is into what they do. When people as for suggestions, they usually want the trick-light corals to show their non-hobby friends with blacklight or get the easier color out of, or they want stuff that looks good under any light. Not asking is not helping, IMO. I have no venom for either... just trying to help somebody by figuring out what they are after.

I do post photos of stuff that will look good in any system, under any lights for any person and need no tricks, RB-only or anything else. ...stuff that I have imported. I have already met your challenge... for about a decade. There are pics and threads out there... recently too. I do not need anybody to tell me what they requirements, risks and costs are for wild corals. I know it quite well.

You can get coral sea (Aussie), Fijian and Indo wild acropora. You need to know where the best stuff comes from where and each species is different. If you are into wild tenius trying to get the next Illusionist hot acro, then Aussie or Fiji is probably the best bet. There are collectors that will send you nothing but Tenius if you ask, pay a bit more and wait for then to collect them for you. Most Mari stuff is the same time and again... I would doubt that HW is mari... seems more like wild.

 

[Tallison]

idk how this has devolved into people going nuts over what I spend my money on but I guess I was asking for it on the title. Like I said I was given a great deal on it which I wont go into here but I wanted to ask the SPS community who has handled high end corals if it was worth it. I have yet to see any pictures of people posting wild colonies that look even remotely close to a HW

 

[Falcon53]

must be why jason runs all blues all day long. looks stunning in blue light tho

He runs daylight bulbs a couple hours in the middle of the photoperiod.

 

[SneakyTortuga]

He runs daylight bulbs a couple hours in the middle of the photoperiod.

Does he? I thought I heard he only ran atinic and all blues. My mistake

 

[Falcon53]

Does he? I thought I heard he only ran atinic and all blues. My mistake

You might be right. When I met him a couple years ago, this is what he told me. But his most recent video on You Tube he seems to indicate differently (I just re-watched it)...so it might depend on the tank he is running. But Worldwide certainly does run whites for ~4 hours a day and they have fantastic coloration as well.

I personally follow the WWC method.

 

[29bonsaireef]

I call BS on this post.

Link? Where are you seeing these maricultured colonies that look identical to HW? Jfox got his on a diving trip from a wild colony. Yes there are lot's of maricultured colonies of Acropora Tenuis, but good luck finding one that displays the same color as HW. You would have to buy a lot of colonies and have a large enough system to quarantine and care for them for quite some time before you'd get lucky enough to find something as spectacular as HW or many of the other highly sought after corals on the market. The costs and risks of doing so are far greater than just buying a frag of an already established piece from a vendor. You'd spend thousands of dollars on many, many drab corals before you'd ever find one close to HW or others. Let the vendors who already have an established business take that risk and when they find a gem, buy a frag of it and enjoy.

You have to know what to look for. A wild/mariculture HW tenuis (lookalike) will appear different then a tank grown. Also a full colony looks much different then a frag or small mini colony. what most people are used to seeing is frags or small 2x2" mini colony. Im guessing there is no one that has a legit full colony of aquaculture HW? And if there is they would know it is not the most attractive coral at full size (lots of green). There is a store in Central FL that gets in some really nice mari stuff. I rarely go there because its a bit of a drive from me, and I don't usually shop at LFS for corals. I've seen HW lookalikes in there every time I go in. Remember, your systems needs to be top-notch to fully color up these wild colonies. Jason was able to do that and was rewarded, but he surely wasn't the first with this coral. There are many hobbyist in Asia, Indo, etc.. that have identical tenuis, but they do not call them HW just a colorful wild/mari. Like @Jamie7907 said there are Indo sellers who offer these colonies for cheap. HW and WD are not one off wild tenuis. There is a strain from Indo region that look like these and they are farmed there.

Not trying to start an argument. Just giving out helpful info to those that truly enjoy the colors/appearance of these tenuis, but don't have the cash for a 1/4" nub. There are a few hobbyists/sellers who are selling hardy, healthy aquaculture SPS, but imo much of the high-end market is a scam nowadays.

 

[mrtian97]

I agree, it’s difficult to get them color up and it’s easy to have the color disappears. My sps grows well like the Red Dragon, pink lemonade, all different stylos. But I have difficulty to get my red planet, rommel milli to color up. They grow but color faded from the day I put the frag into my tank

 

[ReefAddict16]

I feel like it’s worth it. Though I’d probably wait until it gets into the $100-$200 range