Looking for advice relating to pod culturing

[nim6us]

I'm trying to start culturing pods and I think my first effort has failed. I added two small shot pouchs of pods to a 3/4 gallon container. I drilled two holes in the top for gas exchange and an airline tube attached to a bubbler. I dosed small amounts of phyto and would wait for the water to go clear, then dose some more.

Everything seemed to be working and stable for about a month, then the water turned dark green, and there's very little pod actvity as most appear dead.

Two questions:

A) What happened and how can I avoid it again?

B) Can I pour this in my DT? Seems like a soup of reefy goodness for my tank inhabitants.

 

[sunken3]

if your water turned dark green, is it possible your Phyto took off.. (you grew phyto faster than the pods could eat it). ...then eventually killing the pods. the the water culture crash and turn yellow/brown after?

 

[nim6us]

@sunken3

Thanks for confirming, that's kinda what I had thought. This just happened a few days ago so it's still the same color as in the picture, greenish-yellow-ish.

That's why I was curious if I could dump it in my DT. Seems like I failed to culture pods, but I did grow phyto.

Also any thoughts on how to avoid it in the future, did I just dose too much phyto too fast?

 

[sunken3]

i can grow phyto pretty well.. pods have always been tougher (in a tank setup with rocks and such its pretty easy, but in a bare container I have trouble too). but yes, I would say you likely added too much phyto.

my experience with phyto is it goes from light green to dark green ... then crashes (presumably when the phyto has reached critical mass for the container). it will then begin to lighten (greenish to yellowish brown ... almost back to water (with sludge on the bottom of the container). it can crash before this if conditions are bad, but this is what I have seen in my experience when I am too lazy to harvest.

I would say if it is mostly green, you can still add to your tank (no different than what you buy at the LFS in a bottle). but I beleive too much into a tank all at once can cause other issues...

 

[nim6us]

@sunken3

Thanks for all the great info, that's just what I was after!

 

[sunken3]

on a side note, I dont use a diffuser in my phyto or pods culture.. I have read they do better with the bigger bubbles.. fast for the phyto, very slow for the pods.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

at one month, were you checking the pod population? I usually can harvest around 3-4 weeks. Ammonia builds up slowly over time from dead pods, dead phyto, etc... so you can't let it go too long.

And also, you remembered to top off the freshwater right?

 

[nim6us]

@LordofCinder

I rounded up, I think I was actually at 3 weeks. Maybe I just missed it. I marked the level but I never did need to top up the water. Maybe it was the ammonia. I think I’ve got a spare Seachem badge floating around somewhere on my next culture I’ll put it in there. Thanks!

 

[Anthony Scholfield]

I'm trying to start culturing pods and I think my first effort has failed. I added two small shot pouchs of pods to a 3/4 gallon container. I drilled two holes in the top for gas exchange and an airline tube attached to a bubbler. I dosed small amounts of phyto and would wait for the water to go clear, then dose some more.

Everything seemed to be working and stable for about a month, then the water turned dark green, and there's very little pod actvity as most appear dead.

Two questions:

A) What happened and how can I avoid it again?

B) Can I pour this in my DT? Seems like a soup of reefy goodness for my tank inhabitants.

Its likely they did not do well from the water being left so long. I change water and harvest weekly. I only feed phyto once at the very beginning too.

i use a 3L glass jar. About 2.5L is fresh saltwater mixed to 1.020 and .5L is phyto. I also include something like filter floss for the pods to hide and breed in. I use rigid airline with an air pump to provide some turnover. Also, the tube should go to about the bottom of your container. This keeps the water from getting stagnent. The air is controlled with a valve to reduce the flow. About 5 bubbles per second. I also use a light on a dimmer. Remember your not trying to culture phyto so the light doesnt need to be full power. I set the light on a timer for 16hrs.

Every 7 days i harvest and split the pods. I have had this going for about 3-4 months and always yield large amounts.

I would not add any of the crashed culture to your tank. It crashed for a reason. You may be adding something you dont want to your display.

If you have instagram i have posted about my phyto and pod journey there. @doubleadeejay

 

[nim6us]

@Anthony Scholfield

Fanstatic information! This is the part of R2R I love. People with real actionable expierence give feedback on how to improve in the hobby. The information in the post is like gold dust to me. ;Bookworm

 

[Anthony Scholfield]

@Anthony Scholfield

Fanstatic information! This is the part of R2R I love. People with real actionable expierence give feedback on how to improve in the hobby. The information in the post is like gold dust to me. ;Bookworm

You are very welcome! Its my pleasure and i hope you find success in culturing those pods!

 

[sunken3]

Its likely they did not do well from the water being left so long. I change water and harvest weekly. I only feed phyto once at the very beginning too.

i use a 3L glass jar. About 2.5L is fresh saltwater mixed to 1.020 and .5L is phyto. I also include something like filter floss for the pods to hide and breed in. I use rigid airline with an air pump to provide some turnover. Also, the tube should go to about the bottom of your container. This keeps the water from getting stagnent. The air is controlled with a valve to reduce the flow. About 5 bubbles per second. I also use a light on a dimmer. Remember your not trying to culture phyto so the light doesnt need to be full power. I set the light on a timer for 16hrs.

Every 7 days i harvest and split the pods. I have had this going for about 3-4 months and always yield large amounts.

I would not add any of the crashed culture to your tank. It crashed for a reason. You may be adding something you dont want to your display.

If you have instagram i have posted about my phyto and pod journey there. @doubleadeejay

in your opinion, would it be easier or harder to culture pods in a 10g tank than a 3L jar? I was thinking of doing that so I could scoop them with a net, but not sure if there are some pitfalls I should consider.

 

[Anthony Scholfield]

in your opinion, would it be easier or harder to culture pods in a 10g tank than a 3L jar? I was thinking of doing that so I could scoop them with a net, but not sure if there are some pitfalls I should consider.

That’s a good question. I don’t think either would be harder or easier. I think making sure the water doesn’t get stagnant is important.

Im pretty sure my friend @Rob.bucek has his pods in a small tank. I’ll message him and he can give his thoughts.

 

[nim6us]

@Anthony Scholfield
Great idea about adding the filter floss in with the culture. I've started a new culture and can see them really taking up residence in there! However regarding harvesting; do you simply sieve out the pods in the water and leave that filter floss as a long term habitat?

 

[fryman]

Looks like I'm late to the party but here's my advice anyway. Not really sure what type of copepods you are growing, or whether you feed live or preserved phyto. These factors make a big difference.

I recommend sieving the culture weekly, cleaning the culture vessel and adding fresh water and feed. In my experince, a robust tigriopus culture can persist for months in the same water with no food added before density eventually dropping. Other types of copepods however do not last nearly so long. Tigs are easiest and you can just keep adding food and they seem to survive somehow without waste buildup killing them. There's a post on the forum where a guy just leaves the culture outside in a tub indefinately, adds spirolina powder as feed and grows tons of tig pods with basically no maintenence. Tisbe and apocyclops ime are much more sensitive to their waste building up. At any rate I think the best practice for inside culture is cleaning weekly but the outside method seems very appealing.

There's a very big difference between feeding live vs dead phyto. If feeding preserved phyto, you need to add small amounts every day. The water should go clear and if you overdo it you can get an ammonia spike and kill the culture.

Live phyto is totally different ime. I just fill the pod culture vessel with 100% live phyto (mix of nanno, tetraselmis, and isochrysis), wait a week and then harvest using a 250um sieve. Over the week pods eat the phyto and since I have live phyto in the culture ammonia is never a problem. I don't think you can overfeed using live phyto this way. The phyto doesn't crash as quickly either. I think the pods' waste feeds the phyto but I'm not really sure. If I go much longer than a week, either the water goes clear (pods eat all the phyto) or turns yellow (like a culture crash, prob. runs out of nutrients).

My copepod cultures:

 

[Anthony Scholfield]

@Anthony Scholfield
Great idea about adding the filter floss in with the culture. I've started a new culture and can see them really taking up residence in there! However regarding harvesting; do you simply sieve out the pods in the water and leave that filter floss as a long term habitat?

Hey nim6us,

Glad to hear things may be going better this round! Always remember failing is an opportunity to learn and grow which leads to success!

When I harvest my pods I pull the “hotel” and swish it around in a beaker of fresh saltwater. I pour that through a sieve. I then add some more fresh saltwater in the beaker to hold the “hotel” until I sieve out the rest of the water from the container. Once I refill the container I put the “hotel” back in. The water the “hotel” was sitting in then goes through the sieve too.

Depending on how long you are going to culture pods you may need to change the “hotel” from time to time as it will build up with some detritus.

Also, when harvesting remember to keep enough pods to keep the culture going. My first culture I didn’t harvest anything for my tanks. I just sieved out the pods, changed water, added more live phyto and put the pods back in. This was to get a more robust population before I started taking some for the tanks.

I’m on the same page as @fryman above. He makes some good points about the pods you are trying to culture. I did not take that into consideration when answering you before. I’m culturing tigriopus pods.

Feeding live vs dead phyto is also a good point. I culture phyto so I always feed live and never have considered using dead. Live will always be better!

I like to set it and forget it until the week is over and I harvest. I believe the less messing you do with it the less problems you will have. If the culture goes clear before the week I do not add more phyto. It’s my understanding that there is still food for them even though our eyes my not see it. I did play with how much phyto I add at the beginning to have it last the week though.

Also if the phyto turns a bit yellow I do not worry, I’m not trying to culture phyto. It’s my experience the pods still feed and reproduce.

 

[nim6us]

Fantastic stuff guys thank you so much for sharing your expereince!

 

[kilnakorr]

Looks like I'm late to the party but here's my advice anyway. Not really sure what type of copepods you are growing, or whether you feed live or preserved phyto. These factors make a big difference.

I recommend sieving the culture weekly, cleaning the culture vessel and adding fresh water and feed. In my experince, a robust tigriopus culture can persist for months in the same water with no food added before density eventually dropping. Other types of copepods however do not last nearly so long. Tigs are easiest and you can just keep adding food and they seem to survive somehow without waste buildup killing them. There's a post on the forum where a guy just leaves the culture outside in a tub indefinately, adds spirolina powder as feed and grows tons of tig pods with basically no maintenence. Tisbe and apocyclops ime are much more sensitive to their waste building up. At any rate I think the best practice for inside culture is cleaning weekly but the outside method seems very appealing.

There's a very big difference between feeding live vs dead phyto. If feeding preserved phyto, you need to add small amounts every day. The water should go clear and if you overdo it you can get an ammonia spike and kill the culture.

Live phyto is totally different ime. I just fill the pod culture vessel with 100% live phyto (mix of nanno, tetraselmis, and isochrysis), wait a week and then harvest using a 250um sieve. Over the week pods eat the phyto and since I have live phyto in the culture ammonia is never a problem. I don't think you can overfeed using live phyto this way. The phyto doesn't crash as quickly either. I think the pods' waste feeds the phyto but I'm not really sure. If I go much longer than a week, either the water goes clear (pods eat all the phyto) or turns yellow (like a culture crash, prob. runs out of nutrients).

My copepod cultures:

Crazy good looking culture!
I think I need to add way more phyto.

Can you do a quick video of the bubble rate you are using?

 

[fryman]

Crazy good looking culture!
I think I need to add way more phyto.

Can you do a quick video of the bubble rate you are using?

It's as low as I can make it, so maybe a bubble or two per second. I've had it higher but I think it can decrease pod reproduction rates if there's too much turbulence.

I'm not even sure injecting air is necessary. I had an air line get disconnected for at least a few days once and the pods seemed fine.

 

[kilnakorr]

It's as low as I can make it, so maybe a bubble or two per second. I've had it higher but I think it can decrease pod reproduction rates if there's too much turbulence.

I'm not even sure injecting air is necessary. I had an air line get disconnected for at least a few days once and the pods seemed fine.

How do you get the phyto to stay suspended with susch low/no flow?
Without flow I'd expect it to go to the bottom pretty fast.