Marine Betta

[TriggerFinger]

You mentioned in a previous post that SA quit breeding them due to the cost and time it takes for them to grow. Is this SA video recent and they are working on it again??

you also said it takes 6-12months or longer to get them to a sellable size. What size are they around 12 months old?

I’m very excited about this!!

 

[hmmmmm]

Marine Bettas are one of the "older" fish to be tank-bred. The issue is that it takes 6 months to a year or even more to get them to a sellable size which is a lot of commitment and cost. C-Quest, Sustainable Aquatics, ORA, and I think also Sea&Reef all bred them for a time but stopped because they couldn't get the money for them it cost them to raise them.

The Dutch aquarist Herman Wassink was the first to breed them in 1986 or 1987 and published it first in 1988 in the German Aquarium and Terrarium magazine DATZ.
To my knowledge, I was the second to breed them successfully in captivity in 1992.
But I was likely the first to "build" pairs for breeding purposes by picking males and females and putting them together. Wassink just got lucky to find a pair and didn't know which of them was the male and the female.



For some, they are reclusive as singles. I never had that issue (never had a big enough tank to "lose" a fish in). Much has to do with the tank mates and the appropriate rockwork with plenty of caves with large entries. My Marine Bettas usually like to stand in the entry of their cave.

I also noticed that captive-bred and small wild-caught specimen will be more outgoing, even as fully grown adults. Another reason why small individuals should be preferred.



No, they do not form close "mated" pairs like anemonefish, butterflies, angels, gobies, and the like. They usually only come together to spawn and once done, the female is chased out of the male's cave and not allowed back in until the eggs are hatched.
I suspect they form harem groups in the wild.
What you will get with two (or more) is a lot more visibility of the fish and far more interesting behavior.

Would love to own a pair.. not sure if they would happily coexist with the other on my list though, planning on 4 tangs so might get a bit rowdy

I just dont understand how they arent able to make money on breeding them. A clownfish that sells for pennies on the dollar also takes a lot of effort and several months to breed to a size where they can be sold no? So if a merine betta takes lets say 3 times as long, but they sell for a lot more, shouldnt that make it feasable? They want 150 dollars for one on this side of the ocean..

Dont get me wrong, im very interested in breeding fish but have absolutely no experience whatsoever, so im not being helt back by any knowledge ;Headphone The hard part seems to be getting the fry to a size where they will eat food that can be dispensed automatically, after that cheap tank with some modern automation like auto water change, auto feeding, rollermat etc should make it a bit easier?

 

[ThRoewer]

You mentioned in a previous post that SA quit breeding them due to the cost and time it takes for them to grow. Is this SA video recent and they are working on it again??

you also said it takes 6-12months or longer to get them to a sellable size. What size are they around 12 months old?

I’m very excited about this!!

The Sustainable Aquatics video was published on Nov 6, 2012, so almost a decade ago.
The ones in the video should be around 6 months old.

ORA had some in the summer of 2016 and sold a number of them through LiveAquaria/Diver's Den. I ordered one of those but DD didn't manage to ship them properly and the original, as well as the replacement, arrived frozen dead because DD overdid it with the cold packs.

Original (arrived 2016-06-27):

Replacement (arrived 2016-07-07):

Ultimately LiveAquaria/Diver's Den had ORA ship me one directly and that one finally arrived alive (ORA didn't add heat or cold packs which did the trick):

Unfortunately, that one was a few months later killed by the Banggais I had with it...:mad:

All of those were in the 1" to 1.25" range and likely about 6 to 9 months old.

A few months later I snatched up a tiny wild-caught Fine Spotted Marine Betta (Calloplesiops argus) at DD:

... but they bungled the shipping again:

At one year they should be about 1.5" to 2"

 

[ThRoewer]

Would love to own a pair.. not sure if they would happily coexist with the other on my list though, planning on 4 tangs so might get a bit rowdy

With 4 tangs you may need to add at least 3 marine bettas to see at least one regularly...

I just dont understand how they arent able to make money on breeding them. A clownfish that sells for pennies on the dollar also takes a lot of effort and several months to breed to a size where they can be sold no? So if a merine betta takes lets say 3 times as long, but they sell for a lot more, shouldnt that make it feasable? They want 150 dollars for one on this side of the ocean..

There is a much much higher demand in clownfish than in marine bettas. And clownfish breeders make their real money with designer clowns that bring far more than the regular ones. Also, prices for regular clownfish have gone up significantly and nowadays people ask for tank-bred. Stores have also come to realize that they have less disease trouble, losses, and make more money with tank-bred clowns and therefore are willing to pay more for them.

Dont get me wrong, im very interested in breeding fish but have absolutely no experience whatsoever, so im not being helt back by any knowledge ;Headphone The hard part seems to be getting the fry to a size where they will eat food that can be dispensed automatically, after that cheap tank with some modern automation like auto water change, auto feeding, rollermat etc should make it a bit easier?

Growout is actually the part where things get problematic and costly. Back in Germany I was breeding ocellaris, percula, and clarkii like clockwork, between 600 (percula) and 1500 (clarkii) almost every other week. The larva part was easy (brine shrimp and frozen cyclops were all I fed) and after 3 to 4 weeks they went into the grow-out system. The larvae don't really make a mess but thousands and thousands of juveniles do. They eat like bottomless holes and poop accordingly. And then you have to deal with aggression... food, water, salt, power, space,... all that adds up to a tidy sum even if you don't count labor.
If I could have sold settled juveniles after a month, even just for 50 cents each, and had someone else deal with the grow-out I could have made serious money with them...

 

[ThRoewer]

3. day
The eggs have gotten darker.

 

[hmmmmm]

With 4 tangs you may need to add at least 3 marine bettas to see at least one regularly...

Its getting more expensive every day I think ill take the chance with one, ill move him to a different tank if he's not happy. Love the look of them but only if they arent stressed out every second of the day.

There is a much much higher demand in clownfish than in marine bettas.

That makes sense, all the nemo people coming into the lfs, i was one of them at some point ;Happy

The larva part was easy (brine shrimp and frozen cyclops were all I fed) and after 3 to 4 weeks they went into the grow-out system. The larvae don't really make a mess but thousands and thousands of juveniles do. They eat like bottomless holes and poop accordingly. And then you have to deal with aggression... food, water, salt, power, space,... all that adds up to a tidy sum even if you don't count labor.

Im not planning on making any money, ive got a fulltime job i enjoy. Getting even should be doable, a little extra to support the hobby would be nice. Mainly i would like to breed one specific type of ocellaris to create a clown/nem tank with my own breed in the future.

I do have some advantages i think, my family lives close to the sea (15 minutes) and im there every other week, i have a van and a pump so plan on bringing in 1000l every time i make a visit. So free salt and water (might need to add a little salt as the water here is around 1.021sg). Plan on just replacing massive amounts of water, since its free and all ;Happy Space is at a premium but i have a garage and can make a rack somewhere. Just put up some solar panels so i get anywhere from 5 to 10kw a day for free. Only use 2-3kw a day myself so have some room there to heat a few tanks without a massive increase in the power bill. Offcourse there are startup costs in equipment and food, but other then that just a massive amount of time needed..

 

[ThRoewer]

When I was breeding clownfish I had my tanks' salinities between 1.018 to 1.020 on purpose. Not only was it saving me salt (=money) but breeding worked even better that way because the fish could spend the energy they saved on osmoregulation on growth. Fish absolutely don't mind a little less salt in their water.

 

[hmmmmm]

When I was breeding clownfish I had my tanks' salinities between 1.018 to 1.020 on purpose. Not only was it saving me salt (=money) but breeding worked even better that way because the fish could spend the energy they saved on osmoregulation on growth. Fish absolutely don't mind a little less salt in their water.

Even better, good to know, saves on time and salt. Now I just need to find a breeding pair.

 

[TriggerFinger]

3. day
The eggs have gotten darker.

He’s taking his dad duties seriously. Does he ever leave them? I noticed big pieces of shrimp moving around. Are those for him?

 

[Zionas]

@ThRoewer I know you’re German, so I’m sure you’d know a lot better than I do. Here in China I can order Dr. Bassleer’s Bio-Fish Food through importers. Are you familiar with this brand at all? I’m especially interested in their fish eggs that they claim are from Scandinavian fish. The company that makes this kind of food is called Munster Aquatics.
I’d appreciate your insights. Thanks.

 

[ThRoewer]

@ThRoewer I know you’re German, so I’m sure you’d know a lot better than I do. Here in China I can order Dr. Bassleer’s Bio-Fish Food through importers. Are you familiar with this brand at all? I’m especially interested in their fish eggs that they claim are from Scandinavian fish. The company that makes this kind of food is called Munster Aquatics.
I’d appreciate your insights. Thanks.

I only know his book(s) on fish diseases.

 

[ThRoewer]

He’s taking his dad duties seriously. Does he ever leave them? I noticed big pieces of shrimp moving around. Are those for him?

He pretty much stays with the eggs all the time, day and night. So far he didn't go after any of the shrimp I held right in front of his nose but once he came out to snatch up a large piece of flake food floating rather far away on the back of the tank.
The females do go after the shrimp as well as any other food I offer.

 

[Zionas]

I see. Guess I’ll still give their fish eggs a try.

 

[ThRoewer]

Day 4, eggs get darker as the embryos grow:


The Neon Dottyback decided to photobomb the shot a little at the beginning and end.

I finally started building the larvae tank. I modified an old Aqueon 20 Long by adding flow guides and a filter chamber. The screen is still missing in the model:

Hopefully, I get it all done tomorrow.

 

[TriggerFinger]

The dottyback knows something is up, just not sure what ;Joyful how much longer until the eggs are hatching?Are you planning on pulling this batch if you can get your larvae tank ready in time? Thanks for the videos, I enjoy them.

 

[Leslie Tabor]

These are beautiful! I am enjoying learning about them. I have thought about getting one many times, glad I didn't! I need 3!! Lol can't wait to see updates on this! Good luck, please keep sharing!

 

[Marsh980]

These are beautiful! I am enjoying learning about them. I have thought about getting one many times, glad I didn't! I need 3!! Lol can't wait to see updates on this! Good luck, please keep sharing!

I picked mine up today, it’s the one fish my wife really wanted. It’s approx 4”

 

[Leslie Tabor]

I picked mine up today, it’s the one fish my wife really wanted.

Beautiful! I have very limited options where I live and apparently ordering them from DD does not go well!

 

[Marsh980]

Beautiful! I have very limited options where I live and apparently ordering them from DD does not go well!

I’m very fortunate that both my LFS have a great selection of fish and corals. They both had a 4” Marine betta. I also picked up a beautiful 4.5” male blue throat trigger.

 

[ThRoewer]

I picked mine up today, it’s the one fish my wife really wanted. It’s approx 4”

At that size, it's almost certainly a female. Now you just need to find her a guy