Multiple of same species lionfish

[drmantistoboggan]

I make it complicated because I try to give you as much info as I can to help you have success. Keeping lions long term is a difficult proposition, they have an extremely high mortality rate.

A zebra and a fuzzy can live happily in a 80G. The 2 I just got from the same supplier were listed as large, and they are the perfect size. I would stick with one each as I explained about the male angst. Why many will say there is no problem is because most have never kept kept long enough to get to maturity. That;s true for many species, juvi's are alot different than adults in temperament. I had male fuzzies and male zebra's tussle, but as I explained, not as vehemently as 2 male fuzzies or 2 male zebra's going after each other. If you get to a point and you feel confident with your lion care, you could add a fu manchu to the mix as your third. They are a bit more challenging to keep. If you keep them long enough to be mature and full grown, zebra's and fuzzies will get to 7", that's alot of fish in a 80g.

Hey lion king, had another question for you. Could I keep an eel with these guys in an 80 gallon? My tank is a breeder tank so it’s shallow and I don’t have a lid. I saw you responding on a lot of eel related questions. How badly do eels jump? I kinda didn’t consider it because I thought I’d have to have a lid

 

[lion king]

Hey lion king, had another question for you. Could I keep an eel with these guys in an 80 gallon? My tank is a breeder tank so it’s shallow and I don’t have a lid. I saw you responding on a lot of eel related questions. How badly do eels jump? I kinda didn’t consider it because I thought I’d have to have a lid

#1 cause of death of a captive eel is carpet surfing. Any one keeping an eel without a cover is very irresponsible. While I'm not a big fan of eels with lions, keeping proper with tank size; pebble tooths, ribbons, and the dwarf Hawaiians are safe to kept with lions as long as sized properly. An 80g could be ok for a snowflake or dwarf hawaiian. You do need to have a lid though.

 

[drmantistoboggan]

#1 cause of death of a captive eel is carpet surfing. Any one keeping an eel without a cover is very irresponsible. While I'm not a big fan of eels with lions, keeping proper with tank size; pebble tooths, ribbons, and the dwarf Hawaiians are safe to kept with lions as long as sized properly. An 80g could be ok for a snowflake or dwarf hawaiian. You do need to have a lid though.

So if I bought a tight fitting lid, a snowflake would be possible. Why are you against them with lions?

 

[PicassoClown04]

So if I bought a tight fitting lid, a snowflake would be possible. Why are you against them with lions?

Probably because eels will eat lions. I am a certified lion fish hunter for scuba diving. If my lion bucket gets full I just find the nearest eel and give them some of the smaller ones that aren’t very good for human consumption just cause they’re too small. I’ve had morays take ones that were 7”+ with no issue. I would keep my eels away from my lion fish just with this experience. Also, eels are known for escaping even a lidded tank because they just push the lid up and slither out. The lid should either be literally locked or very heavily weighted to prevent this imo.

 

[drmantistoboggan]

Probably because eels will eat lions. I am a certified lion fish hunter for scuba diving. If my lion bucket gets full I just find the nearest eel and give them some of the smaller ones that aren’t very good for human consumption just cause they’re too small. I’ve had morays take ones that were 7”+ with no issue. I would keep my eels away from my lion fish just with this experience. Also, eels are known for escaping even a lidded tank because they just push the lid up and slither out. The lid should either be literally locked or very heavily weighted to prevent this imo.

Yea I’ll pass on this one. Thank you for the insight and information.

 

[lion king]

So if I bought a tight fitting lid, a snowflake would be possible. Why are you against them with lions?

Because too many people have put them together without understanding all of the consequences. Lions are somewhat sedentary and slow moving, so they can easily be prey for eels. As I mentioned earlier, fish are different as juveniles compared to mature adults. Mature fang tooth eels, even smaller ones, will rip up lions and it never(I mean Never) ends well. People will also put larger mature pebble tooths with small or even itty bitty lions, and that ends badly too. If raised from a juvenile or young adult, most pebble tooths will not hunt down fish. A small pebble tooth likely will not attack a larger lion, even by accident. Same with ribbons and the dwarf hawaiin, their mouths are too small to threaten a properly sized lion.

 

[drmantistoboggan]

Because too many people have put them together without understanding all of the consequences. Lions are somewhat sedentary and slow moving, so they can easily be prey for eels. As I mentioned earlier, fish are different as juveniles compared to mature adults. Mature fang tooth eels, even smaller ones, will rip up lions and it never(I mean Never) ends well. People will also put larger mature pebble tooths with small or even itty bitty lions, and that ends badly too. If raised from a juvenile or young adult, most pebble tooths will not hunt down fish. A small pebble tooth likely will not attack a larger lion, even by accident. Same with ribbons and the dwarf hawaiin, their mouths are too small to threaten a properly sized lion.

Hey lion king. Liveaquaria got some Russell’s in. How do you feel about a Russell’s and a dwarf zebra? Or should I stick to a dwarf zebra and a fuzzy dwarf?

 

[drmantistoboggan]

Hey lion king. Liveaquaria got some Russell’s in. How do you feel about a Russell’s and a dwarf zebra? Or should I stick to a dwarf zebra and a fuzzy dwarf?

@lion king Am I running a bigger risk with the Russell’s of it eating something in my tank? The Russell’s look more like volitans to me, and I like that. I also don’t know if a Russell’s can get along with a dwarf zebra. Liveaquaria states they’re aggressive to other lionfish

 

[lion king]

@lion king Am I running a bigger risk with the Russell’s of it eating something in my tank? The Russell’s look more like volitans to me, and I like that. I also don’t know if a Russell’s can get along with a dwarf zebra. Liveaquaria states they’re aggressive to other lionfish

Russell's are pretty much a variation of volitan, maybe a little more slender in body type but still reaches a foot. I still see lfs list russells as volitans. I'm not sure why they are sometimes recommended to a smaller tank than the volitan, These are actually more suited for a minimum 120g, a 6 foot 125g even better.

 

[drmantistoboggan]

Russell's are pretty much a variation of volitan, maybe a little more slender in body type but still reaches a foot. I still see lfs list russells as volitans. I'm not sure why they are sometimes recommended to a smaller tank than the volitan, These are actually more suited for a minimum 120g, a 6 foot 125g even better.

I had read some of your posts that they’re much easier to get eating frozen. Do they grow as fast a volitans? These are their medium sized ones so should be about 3 to 4 inches. I want what’s best for the animal so if it’s possible to keep one in a 4 ft 80 gallon for a year or two until I upgrade, that would be preferred.

 

[lion king]

I had read some of your posts that they’re much easier to get eating frozen. Do they grow as fast a volitans? These are their medium sized ones so should be about 3 to 4 inches. I want what’s best for the animal so if it’s possible to keep one in a 4 ft 80 gallon for a year or two until I upgrade, that would be preferred.

The russells and volitans will take to dead food much easier, I've never known any given time not take a variety of dead foods. Same holds true, they will not live long on a krill and silversides only diet, they need fatty fish, shell on shrimp, among other offerings of seafood items. Preferably fresh when possible or at least small quantities fresh frozen by you. Growth rates are subjective, but they do usually grow pretty quickly to 7" or so. They will be more sedentary in smaller tanks.

 

[drmantistoboggan]

What about compatibility as far as with dwarfs? Do they bother lions outside their species assuming you get them about the same size?

The russells and volitans will take to dead food much easier, I've never known any given time not take a variety of dead foods. Same holds true, they will not live long on a krill and silversides only diet, they need fatty fish, shell on shrimp, among other offerings of seafood items. Preferably fresh when possible or at least small quantities fresh frozen by you. Growth rates are subjective, but they do usually grow pretty quickly to 7" or so. They will be more sedentary in smaller tanks.

 

[lion king]

What about compatibility as far as with dwarfs? Do they bother lions outside their species assuming you get them about the same size?

I wouldn't be concerned about one with dwarfs.

 

[drmantistoboggan]

Thank you! I may give the Russell’s a shot with the drawf knowing the tank would need to be upgraded in the near future.

 

[drmantistoboggan]

I wouldn't be concerned about one with dwarfs.

Think you’re ultimately right. They do get too big for my tank. I did more research on the Russell’s and the consensus seems that they should be ok in anywhere from 55-70 but then I saw a picture of a full grown one, that seems like way too much fish. My tank is also a shallow reef and the main display is 4ft but closer to 60 gallons in the display while the sump has the other 20 gallons. That fish would have very little vertical movement space and would eat most of my other small inhabitants or would prevent swimming space due to their fins. Think I bought the Russell’s in haste, getting excited over having an easier experience and more volitan looking fish.
I am going to call live aquaria tomorrow, chance the order for the Russell’s and instead just stick with my order for the fuzzy dwarf and dwarf zebra (I places two orders to prevent anything from selling out and figured I’d cancel one once I settled on it).

 

[drmantistoboggan]

I wouldn't be concerned about one with dwarfs.

They came in! Looking good. Going to try to feed soon

 

[drmantistoboggan]

One more question, how are they usually after acclimation? Dwarf fuzzy is all over the tank, up and down the glass and won’t sit still. The zebra dwarf found a cave, went to it and is just sitting. I will say, the zebras fins were a bit tattered and have some holes/breaks in them. I tried feeding some frozen food, no response from either. Will try again tomorrow. If can’t get either to eat frozen I’ll be stopping by my lfs to pick up ghost shrimp and guppies

 

[sam2110]

One of the most incredible tanks I've ever seen is a lion fish only tank, i wish I had a photo. The tank was in sea life, around 4ft round by about 7ft tall. It must have had 15 -20 full grown lions in there, it was amazing.

 

[drmantistoboggan]

@lion king sorry for all the posts. Will this split in his fin grow back? Sorry about the blue lights as well

 

[lion king]

The fins will grow back, do not add any remedy. Pristine water conditions and a good diet and they will grow back. Each fish is different after acclimation, some disorientation is normal but he should settle down soon, but extreme agitation and hyperactivity is not good. Feeding live for a few feedings and allowing to settle in and fatten up would be the best course.