mysterious lyretail anthia deaths- thoughts?

[Daniel Waters]

I recently have had two different female lyretail anthias have spasmodic episodes and die during feeding (one two nights ago, one tonight). These are fish that I have had since January, and were completely healthy (best I can tell) up until their death. They were fed multiple times a day (mostly frozen PE mysis) Has anyone else encountered a fish dying suddenly, almost like it had a nervous system breakdown or heart attack? I'm not sure how else to describe it.

I dipped the death anthia in freshwater to inspect for flukes, and there were none that came off the fish. I also inspected the gills and chopped the fish up to inspect for possibly worms (but I'm not sure I would even know if saw them or they are visible- I just always hear about anthias being susceptible to worms). Anyone have any theories? I thought possibly a result of collection using cyanide, but I would have thought that would have affected the fish months ago if that was the case.

My tank is a 72" x 24" x 18". Runs about 150 gallons total water volume. 100+ lbs of live rock and sand, Water changes are 10% each week, and my parameters are always consistently 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, 2.5 ppm nitrate. Calcium 450, Alk 8.0, Magnesium 1300, phosphates 0.01. I run carbon, skimmer, and chaeto macro algae. I have a mixed tank with a few sps but mostly LPS. I have a hippo tang, maroon clown, leopard wrasse, ignitus anthia (2), and had 1 male lyretail and 3 female lyretails up until the death of the two female lyretails. No other fish have shown any issues, and there were / are no aggression issues in the tank. I'd appreciate any theories or thoughts!

 

[Anthony Wood]

Since mysis have just about zero nutritional value I'm going to go ahead and say their diet killed them from a lack of nutrition and vitamins. I have never had any luck with lyrtail, mine with due to aggression though.

If you have more of them your going to have to get them switched over to a good dried food source like pellets. Also whatever you end up feeding them after your read this. Soak one of their feedings of food no more then 2 times a week soaked in Selcon. Selcon will fill in every nutritional or vitamin deficiency in their diet. Also will add exponentially more nutritional value to Frozen mysis. The rest of your fish and corals will greatly benefit from selcon also. Keep selcon to a minimum though because it'll make your phosphate and nitrates rise real quick if you use to much. Too much will also cause cyano. It's like anything else too much of it and you'll get issues. Hopes this helps.

 

[eatbreakfast]

^Actually mysis shrimp are very nutritious particularly the PE variety. Adult brine shrimp are not nutritious, unless enriched, baby brine are quite nutritious.

I don't think the losses are due to any malnutrition.

Spastic episodes do happen, but they are often related to parasites.

Maybe stray voltage

 

[melypr1985]

Maybe stray voltage

I actually helped a friend recently who's clowns were doing this exact same thing. Turned out she had stray voltage in the tank from a faulty powerhead. Probably a good place to start your investigation.

 

[Daniel Waters]

Good suggestions. I did get a multimeter and test this weekend. Voltage was around 7 volts. From what I've read, this isn't significant.

Since my original post, I lost an ignitus anthia for unknown reasons. My leopard wrasse has also gone missing for 4+ days, so I'm assuming she has died. My best guess is a parasite or bacterial infection of some sort, although I can't seem to pinpoint one that is the likely culprit from my readings. The joys of this hobby!

 

[melypr1985]

Hmm.. have you spotted any symptoms that might help us pinpoint a cause? Red patches on the skin, a white dusty appearance, heavy breathing, swimming into the flow of a powerhead, hiding excessively?

 

[Daniel Waters]

Honestly, there haven't been any outward signs such as markings, spots heavy breathing, lethargy, lack of appetite, or any of those types of things. I've kept saltwater fish for 20 years, and I'm familiar with ich and velvet...definitely not those. I just mailed in water for a triton test to be sure there's not some type of heavy metal poisoning or something out of whack.

Assuming I have no more fish deaths and triton results are normal, how long would you suggest before I introduce any new fish again? I was thinking a month?

 

[melypr1985]

Honestly, there haven't been any outward signs such as markings, spots heavy breathing, lethargy, lack of appetite, or any of those types of things. I've kept saltwater fish for 20 years, and I'm familiar with ich and velvet...definitely not those. I just mailed in water for a triton test to be sure there's not some type of heavy metal poisoning or something out of whack.

Assuming I have no more fish deaths and triton results are normal, how long would you suggest before I introduce any new fish again? I was thinking a month?

In this case? I'd go the full 76 days to cover any possibility. Tell us what the triton results are when you get them.

 

[PhilT]

I just lost my female lyretail yesterday. The male is big and active. Not real aggressive with her. My service took out a big piece of decorative coral and replaced it with 30 lbs of caribsea dry rock and about 10 lbs of live rock . He did siphon out a lot of the accumulated dirt from the sand under the piece taken out. Also did about 30% water change.
at nite I was looking for her and finally saw her in a crack of the live rock next to the side glass. She may have already been dead but I didn want to bother her in case it was just stress. But confirmed dead this morning.

do you think the aquascaping work stressed her out and led to her death? She does hide in the rock a lot but usually in the pieces that weren’t moved.

 

[Matt1997]

Test ammonia and do you run a skimmer?

 

[exnisstech]

Stray voltage is a red herring and does not effect tank inhabitants. Jay Hemdal has confirmed this and I also confirmed it when I got shocked and fell off a chair working on a tank. I tested and found 50 volts in the water. All tank inhabitants were fine. I'm not sure why so many people seem to blame stray voltage for mysterious deaths.
As to the anthias are you sure they are not running into the glass? I had one run into the glass once and died instantly.

 

[PhilT]

Test ammonia and do you run a skimmer?

Yes I have a skimmer. I didn’t even think of ammonia, well established tank plus the large water change.

 

[PhilT]

Stray voltage is a red herring and does not effect tank inhabitants. Jay Hemdal has confirmed this and I also confirmed it when I got shocked and fell off a chair working on a tank. I tested and found 50 volts in the water. All tank inhabitants were fine. I'm not sure why so many people seem to blame stray voltage for mysterious deaths.
As to the anthias are you sure they are not running into the glass? I had one run into the glass once and died instantly.

I guess that is a possibility, she did jump out of the tank once last year when I was doing some cleaning.