Need help on a new torch

[thunderreefer]

Picked up my first Euphyllia torch this past Thursday. Dipped Thursday evening in a mixture of Brightwell’s MediCoral and API Melafix recommended by my LFS and the process they use. Friday, all corals I purchased looked good and fully open by the end of the day. Picture included. Saturday I did a 50% water change, which is what I’ve always done (I have a 20 gallon Frag/quarantine tank with HOB with aqua clear bio max). No skimmer. I have a couple acans that puff up even bigger each time I do my water change, so I’ve stuck with it. ATO for salinity stability, but trying to make this tank as easy as possible to get me through 76 days for QT before adding to my better equipped DT.

I also turned my small pump (Koralia Nano 240 gph) on after the water change on Saturday. Everything looked the same later on Saturday. Sunday the torch didn’t look great mostly retracted with a few polyps sticking out in the morning. By afternoon, evening it was fully retracted. One of my zoas on Sunday had half the polyps closed, the rest open. A few more look open today, but some still closed. Otherwise, everything else looks fine. Acans look puffy. I try not to be overreactive, but I did turn the koralia pump off yesterday as that was the only thing I could think of that was different. I was just going to wait and not do anything else, as I don’t want to keep adding variables that don’t help and just make it harder to pinpoint the problem. I am worried after reading up more on torch issues.

parameters:
Salinity 1.025 (use a Milwaukee digital refractometer)
Nitrate 2ppm (Red Sea test kit)
Phosphate 0 (Hanna ULR)
Alkalinity 7.8 (Hanna)
Temp 77.6

My phosphates are clearly low. I do have NeoPhos but don’t intend to add as I don’t think that is the source of the problem unless someone thinks otherwise. See pictures, does look like brownish stuff on top of the retracted polyps. Reading I may need an iodine dip, such as Tropic Marin Pro-coral Cure or Brighwell’s MediCora or Lugol’s, but need help/recommendations before I start doing stuff I shouldn’t. Once again, this is my first Euphyllia. I did get a hammer at the same time that looks just fine.

 

[thunderreefer]

Accidentally attach my video from Friday instead of a picture. Video just shows the polyp movement for a few seconds.

 

[NewGoby]

Phosphate should never be 0 - but as close to 0 as possible - like 0.03 is fine, and I'm afraid that the torch is as good as dead at this point, they CAN apparantly come back from this state, although I've never seen one do so - I've only heard rumors.

Edit: Maybe someone has experience in reviving torches once they get to this point, but she looks really far gone I'm afraid

 

[thunderreefer]

Phosphate should never be 0 - but as close to 0 as possible - like 0.03 is fine, and I'm afraid that the torch is as good as dead at this point, they CAN apparantly come back from this state, although I've never seen one do so - I've only heard rumors.

Edit: Maybe someone has experience in reviving torches once they get to this point, but she looks really far gone I'm afraid

Thanks for the reply. Do you think the cause is no phosphate? Something else? Could I really lose the coral in a day and a half from 0 phosphate? I do target feed reef roids and Zooplanktos 3x a week.

 

[thunderreefer]

After the last comment that the torch is probably dead, I still decided to try something. Hurried down to the LFS that had one more bottle of Tropic Marin Pro-Coral Cure. Since the stuff on top of the polyps looked brownish, I saw a couple posts suggesting this or another iodine dip. Followed the directions. Used a turkey baster to stir the solution. Brown, kind or stringy snot like stuff started coming off the coral. After 15 minutes, moved to another container with tank water to rinse and now returned back to the tank. Will continue to monitor and try and update this post if it helped. Now that the brown stuff is gone, I can see some color. Polyps look damaged, so I’ll see how it goes. Pics include the solution, solution after 15 minutes stirring with the coral and the coral top view back in the tank.

 

[Hydrored]

Brown Jelly, if it has a scent to it it's dead.

 

[AC1211]

After the last comment that the torch is probably dead, I still decided to try something. Hurried down to the LFS that had one more bottle of Tropic Marin Pro-Coral Cure. Since the stuff on top of the polyps looked brownish, I saw a couple posts suggesting this or another iodine dip. Followed the directions. Used a turkey baster to stir the solution. Brown, kind or stringy snot like stuff started coming off the coral. After 15 minutes, moved to another container with tank water to rinse and now returned back to the tank. Will continue to monitor and try and update this post if it helped. Now that the brown stuff is gone, I can see some color. Polyps look damaged, so I’ll see how it goes. Pics include the solution, solution after 15 minutes stirring with the coral and the coral top view back in the tank.

I would do 2 things raise the phos by feeding the tank. Dip the coral unti improvements otherwise bye bye torch.

 

[ADAM]

If it had a brown slime "jelly" on it, throw it out! If it were 10 heads and 3 had brown jelly, cut and throw away the 3 that are slimed saving the other 7. With BJD "Brown Jelly Disease" the torch flesh was likely damaged somehow allowing the bacteria to take over and kill the torch. Could have been damaged slightly during transport home, handling when moving into the tank, or something during the water change. With the stress of moving from LFS to your tank coupled with possible damage would be an easy case to make for BJD. As you can see in the pic of the recessed flesh the skeleton is sharp underneath the flesh and wouldn't take much for those edges to cut into the flesh.

 

[thunderreefer]

Brown Jelly, if it has a scent to it it's dead.

Thanks for the reply. Problem for me is that there is nothing in my tank that doesn't have a scent to it.

If it had a brown slime "jelly" on it, throw it out! If it were 10 heads and 3 had brown jelly, cut and throw away the 3 that are slimed saving the other 7. With BJD "Brown Jelly Disease" the torch flesh was likely damaged somehow allowing the bacteria to take over and kill the torch. Could have been damaged slightly during transport home, handling when moving into the tank, or something during the water change. With the stress of moving from LFS to your tank coupled with possible damage would be an easy case to make for BJD. As you can see in the pic of the recessed flesh the skeleton is sharp underneath the flesh and wouldn't take much for those edges to cut into the flesh.

Thank you for the reply. Having never seen BJD, I'm just assuming at this point it was and just threw the frag out. Painful. Would the dip have worked if I would have identified it earlier? Trying to learn from this experience. I'm reading that it can spread, so now concerned about everything else in my frag/quarantine tank.

 

[Hydrored]

Thanks for the reply. Problem for me is that there is nothing in my tank that doesn't have a scent to it.

Thank you for the reply. Having never seen BJD, I'm just assuming at this point it was and just threw the frag out. Painful. Would the dip have worked if I would have identified it earlier? Trying to learn from this experience. I'm reading that it can spread, so now concerned about everything else in my frag/quarantine tank.

You will know what I mean, BJD melts heads quick and smells rotten as hell. Nothing in your tank should smell like a fish processing plant dumpster

 

[ADAM]

Thanks for the reply. Problem for me is that there is nothing in my tank that doesn't have a scent to it.

Thank you for the reply. Having never seen BJD, I'm just assuming at this point it was and just threw the frag out. Painful. Would the dip have worked if I would have identified it earlier? Trying to learn from this experience. I'm reading that it can spread, so now concerned about everything else in my frag/quarantine tank.

The BJD would have a noticeable odor, like a rotting odor.
The only Euphyllia I have ever been able to save when I noticed a slight jelly appearance starting was a gold Aussie Torch that I would dip twice a day in 50/50 tank water and Dr Tims RE-Fresh. RE-Fresh is a bacterial additive and not a commonly used pest/cleaner dip. My thought process was that the bacteria in Dr Tims would “overpower” (for lack of better word) the BJD bacteria. The torch pulled thru but in another case later down the road I lost the battle. The Aussie BJD was likely not progressed as far in disease or I just got lucky.

 

[thunderreefer]

You will know what I mean, BJD melts heads quick and smells rotten as hell. Nothing in your tank should smell like a fish processing plant dumpster

I didn't notice, but possibly because I pulled out the frag and put straight into the dip. Guess I thought it was an iodine smell. I smelled after I saw your post and didn't notice anything more than aquarium smell. Possibly because I washed out the brown stuff between the dips. I tossed it out of concern what this could do to my other frags and sounds like any chance of survival was extremely low to 0. Feel like it was a tough lesson. A gold aussie would be a tougher lesson.

 

[Hydrored]

I lost a purple wall hammer and gold torch in two days to BJD all because I didn't know any better on a normal torch. I see brown jelly it's gone. Sorry this happened to you, it's a valuable lesson

 

[NewGoby]

Thanks for the reply. Do you think the cause is no phosphate? Something else? Could I really lose the coral in a day and a half from 0 phosphate? I do target feed reef roids and Zooplanktos 3x a week.

As others have mentioned, it's likely not just 0 phos - although it definetly didn't help - as others have mentioned aswell it likely got damaged, ended up getting infected & then Brown Jelly Disease hit

 

[Travis Warren]

I didn't notice, but possibly because I pulled out the frag and put straight into the dip. Guess I thought it was an iodine smell. I smelled after I saw your post and didn't notice anything more than aquarium smell. Possibly because I washed out the brown stuff between the dips. I tossed it out of concern what this could do to my other frags and sounds like any chance of survival was extremely low to 0. Feel like it was a tough lesson. A gold aussie would be a tougher lesson.

I have lost 2 gold Aussie to brown jelly after being my tank for a month. Next to the gold Aussie was gold Indio and green Indio that are still doing great and putting on new heads. I am done with gold Aussie.

 

[NewGoby]

I have lost 2 gold Aussie to brown jelly after being my tank for a month. Next to the gold Aussie was gold Indio and green Indio that are still doing great and putting on new heads. I am done with gold Aussie.

That's not the first time I've heard that a lot of people struggle keeping gold aussie torches specifically.. :/ I hear more horror stories than them surviving

 

[Wc_aquariums]

Picked up my first Euphyllia torch this past Thursday. Dipped Thursday evening in a mixture of Brightwell’s MediCoral and API Melafix recommended by my LFS and the process they use. Friday, all corals I purchased looked good and fully open by the end of the day. Picture included. Saturday I did a 50% water change, which is what I’ve always done (I have a 20 gallon Frag/quarantine tank with HOB with aqua clear bio max). No skimmer. I have a couple acans that puff up even bigger each time I do my water change, so I’ve stuck with it. ATO for salinity stability, but trying to make this tank as easy as possible to get me through 76 days for QT before adding to my better equipped DT.

I also turned my small pump (Koralia Nano 240 gph) on after the water change on Saturday. Everything looked the same later on Saturday. Sunday the torch didn’t look great mostly retracted with a few polyps sticking out in the morning. By afternoon, evening it was fully retracted. One of my zoas on Sunday had half the polyps closed, the rest open. A few more look open today, but some still closed. Otherwise, everything else looks fine. Acans look puffy. I try not to be overreactive, but I did turn the koralia pump off yesterday as that was the only thing I could think of that was different. I was just going to wait and not do anything else, as I don’t want to keep adding variables that don’t help and just make it harder to pinpoint the problem. I am worried after reading up more on torch issues.

parameters:
Salinity 1.025 (use a Milwaukee digital refractometer)
Nitrate 2ppm (Red Sea test kit)
Phosphate 0 (Hanna ULR)
Alkalinity 7.8 (Hanna)
Temp 77.6

My phosphates are clearly low. I do have NeoPhos but don’t intend to add as I don’t think that is the source of the problem unless someone thinks otherwise. See pictures, does look like brownish stuff on top of the retracted polyps. Reading I may need an iodine dip, such as Tropic Marin Pro-coral Cure or Brighwell’s MediCora or Lugol’s, but need help/recommendations before I start doing stuff I shouldn’t. Once again, this is my first Euphyllia. I did get a hammer at the same time that looks just fine.

Start spraying amino acids and move it differently places until it looks like something might be working. do some water changes to lower nitrate because it pretty high.

 

[Hydrored]

I had an a gold torch in a 20 gallon quarantine for 60 days and I placed it in my display. I have lost one as well to BJD, my theory on it is they need more flow and I do not feed them anymore. So far so good, don’t want to jinx myself.

just waking up-

 

[bacc2bacc]

I have found torches to be one of the most sensitive lps out there.

 

[jordan10]

i bought a 5 headed indo green torch i lost a head a day till there was only one head left and that one head is doing great. i would start to see brown jelly stuff coming out head so i break it off soon as i seen it. only reason why i think i saved the one head. best of luck