Neptune SKY LED

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

Don't forget the $15 "shimz":

SKY Diffused Shimz

SKY Diffused Shimz allow for on-the-fly tweaks to the shimmer produced by your SKY light without the need for any programming or adjustments to light settings. Out of the box, the SKY has four openings in the diffuser where white LEDs can shine through undiffused. With typical surface water...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

And $35 hanging kit:

SKY Hanging Kit

The Neptune Systems sleek black Hanging Kit matches the aesthetics of the SKY LED, and utilizes the universal four-point mounting system to suspend your SKY light at virtually any height above your aquarium. This gives you greater freedom in mounting your light to get the optimal balance of...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

Edit: maybe they'll offer more than a 1 year warranty for another couple-three hundred dollars?

 

[Jon's Reef]

That's hysterical

Yep, the stuff that your sources came up with and you reposted as evidence is hilarious.

The best light for a specific tank will depend on tank size, aquascape, corals kept, preference of the owner. Sometimes the G5 may be better, sometimes the Kessil, other times a Straton and other times a SKY.

The common theme is that there is a group who has some sort of a grudge against Neptune. That does not mean that those who call out your made up stuff are loyalists. It just means that you are intentionally spreading false claims. So if the mixing panel theory was wrong, the same “known to fail coating” is used on vortechs for years and the heat sink design was thoroughly tested… why should anyone believe anything else you say?

Are you going to make another post about how Jake Adams was questioning if <400 nm light even makes it through the diffuser? Hmmm maybe look at all the spectral graphs already available clearly showing that is another false claim.

 

[rtparty]

Right from EcoTech and Neptune. I’m using the SPS coverage that Neptune listed for the SKY.

Man, they love to push the marketing limits. All of them too. It is sad to see

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

The common theme is that there is a group who has some sort of a grudge against Neptune.

Because as someone who owns and ran an Aqua Control Jr., i have watched Neptune transform from a company that marketed little and accurately, catered to reefers on a budget without proprietary products, at a reasonable price, into an overprice plastic hype factory. The sky is a good example.

Let me know when Neptune posts a par and spread comparison with the G5...

 

[areefer01]

Let me know when Neptune posts a par and spread comparison with the G5...

I was going to ask has anyone seen ATI, or Philips, or any other light manufacture produce PAR graphs of their light vs another brand? Usually someone will test and do this or BRS, etc.

Also will go out on a limb here and say I think anyone who is testing new kits, especially panel vs panel, needs to move on past the 2 x 2 cube. Just my personal opinion and how this constraint limits these kits.

Hope all is well.

 

[bcarl77]

In my opinion, it seems like the greatest pro of the Sky is the reduction in shadowing. However I still want to see a shadow test with a G5XR 30. I would tend to agree that from a PAR distribution standpoint the G5 XR30 has the edge. I also believe from a light mixing standpoint, once you diffuse the XR30 this appears to be close as well.

 

[SeeFu]

the data is pretty straight forward. g5xr30 has better par distribution. but from a pure physics point of view, the sky should be better at reducing shadows.

so do you want to pay $900 for better par distribution or shadow reduction.

All the other issues about cost and build quality and etc arn't to relevant to me. They are both built w/ plastic and both have some form of controllability built into them. Both can get to AB+.


from what i can see though, ecotech has been fairly quiet about their launch whereas neptune has gone on a marketing blitz to push their product. But it's also been several yrs since the ecotech launch so i could just be forgetting what was done for their product on the marketing side.

 

[chemisfun11]

Im enjoying the bantering back and forth between Sky and Radion Owners. I have 2 Radion Xr30 G5 pros on my RSR425XL. Thinking about purchasing a Sky and putting it next to the Radion. Seems the only the way I will figure this debate out. Will need my friend @chemisfun11 to make a light shade for the Sky. Can I make an honest judgment if I use the same mounts on each?

Unfortunately, I am still waiting for my LFS to get the Sky back in the store to test and tweak my prototype. In the meantime I have been printing a lot of light spill shades for the Radion XR30 and XR15. The Radions are by far the most requested light spill shade to date, but I expect Neptune loyal reefers to request light spill shades as they become more available. I am here to try and help solve some of those issues with my 3D printer. Happy reefing all!

 

[Jon's Reef]

Here is a compilation of ~200W lights from the BRS light series over the 24" cube. This is the SPS recommended settings. Of course it would be nice to have it over a 36" tank, but at least this is a fairly consistent data set.

The color settings are in 50 par increments and consistent across all pictures. The key is in the first pic.

CC Gen 2 data is likely biased by the color setting that was used for that test.

For the XR15 data, The 3 left and 3 right data points for the 48" tank were used. Not perfect, but gives a rough idea.

Interesting to see the consistent shape of the light fields for the Radions and somewhat the Kessils. My thought is that the lens design relies heavily on the light being reflected back into the tank by the glass. This is why the front corners appear hot. The back corners are a bit dimmer due to the black back not reflecting back into the tank as efficiently.

Overall, similar performance across the board (AP9X being the exception). The effect of coral and aquascape remains to be seen. My guess would be if the top 6" of the tank is empty, the performance would be similar for lens and panel styles. Once corals or auqascape get into the top 6", you are likely to see not only shadowing in the corals, but also direct light being blocked from reflecting off of the glass.

Of note for the SKY specifically, I believe reduction in glass reflection effects is directly related to the mixer tech as mentioned in the patent. ( https://patents.google.com/patent/US20180027779A1 )

(Bigger pics to make it easier to read)

 

[oreo54]

Painted backs quench par..a physics oddity due to light transversing different media.
If it was black paper with an air gap it wouldn't occur.
Not sure what happens with say painted white though. Then who paints it white?

More on a different subject:
Light travels from glass to air. Angle of refraction is greater than angle of incidence. All light waves, which hit the surface beyond this critical angle, are effectively trapped. The critical angle for most glass is about 42°.

 

[Jon's Reef]

The critical angle for most glass is about 42°.

The quote mentions for the water to glass interface this value is 63 deg (Section 0004). Section 0056 describes how the light guide specifically works in relation to this.

 

[oreo54]

The quote mentions for the water to glass interface this value is 63 deg (Section 0004). Section 0056 describes how the light guide specifically works in relation to this.

Thanks.. BTW: Has to use the "Wayback Machine" to find the orig. article regarding light loss:

Equipment Review: Getting the Most from Your T-5 Lights: A Look at Reflectors and More

It is imperative that you use reflectors with T-5 bulbs, and individual reflectors do a better job of sending light into a tank than a single reflector. Bulb temperature and even an aquarium's background has a measurable effect on lighting performance.

web.archive.org

1) If you have a wall of live rock from the bottom almost to the top of your tank, then don't worry about the background too much. Most of the reflection takes place several inches from the top of the tank. 2) If you have considerable areas of glass exposed at the back of the tank, unobstructed by rocks, use a taped on plastic background instead of paint. Or, try putting your tank close to a wall and just paint the wall behind it blue/black. Again, this can result in the back of the tank being as much as 30% brighter than if it was painted. 3) Always keep your glass clean to promote better reflection regardless of backgrounds, which includes scraping away coralline algae. 4) Don't paint the front of your tank

 

[Terence]

Because as someone who owns and ran an Aqua Control Jr., i have watched Neptune transform from a company that marketed little and accurately, catered to reefers on a budget without proprietary products, at a reasonable price, into an overprice plastic hype factory. The sky is a good example.

Let me know when Neptune posts a par and spread comparison with the G5...

The Aquacontroller/Apex, adjusted for inflation or otherwise, has never been been cheaper. Check out the price of the original AquaController in FAMA magazine back in 1996. $300 and it did not include probes or an 8-outlet energy bar. Today you can get the ApexEL for $499. Then there is the cost of LED lighting - the price for performance ratio, and cost adjusted for inflation has never been better for the Radion. Check out BRS posting just recently their front page of their site in 2013 where it shows the Radion, generation 1, for $899.

It is possible we will show some XR30 G5 data but we would rather some third party do it. And, as Jon said above, the best test is when there is actually rock and corals in the tank as you can see the difference in real life that the technology brings forward - those at the reef shows this year could see it for sure. The light mixing panel utilized does make a real-world difference - it is not hype - and it really shows itself off in tanks like jon's in this thread, and my SPS loaded 425g with four SKY over it.

I like the overall debate - and personal prefernces always matter. But let's stick to the facts as much as possible and not speculation.

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

The Aquacontroller/Apex, adjusted for inflation or otherwise, has never been been cheaper. Check out the price of the original AquaController in FAMA magazine back in 1996. $300 and it did not include probes or an 8-outlet energy bar. Today you can get the ApexEL for $499. Then there is the cost of LED lighting - the price for performance ratio, and cost adjusted for inflation has never been better for the Radion. Check out BRS posting just recently their front page of their site in 2013 where it shows the Radion, generation 1, for $899.

It is possible we will show some XR30 G5 data but we would rather some third party do it. And, as Jon said above, the best test is when there is actually rock and corals in the tank as you can see the difference in real life that the technology brings forward - those at the reef shows this year could see it for sure. The light mixing panel utilized does make a real-world difference - it is not hype - and it really shows itself off in tanks like jon's in this thread, and my SPS loaded 425g with four SKY over it.

I like the overall debate - and personal prefernces always matter. But let's stick to the facts as much as possible and not speculation.

Where you are losing me is that the Aqua Controller Jr. was nearly brand new technology, from a company getting going, and it was much value added over existing products. That's why i bought it. I would not pay that much now, however, for those features. It's kinda like microwaves-- expensive at first because newer technology and people find value and buy--then later dirt cheap because the technology does not change--just bells and whistles and people will not pay the extra.

You're statement above is actually proving my point. The ApexEL has more features (and bells and whistles!) and the price, adjusted for inflation as you said, has come down! That's the way it should be.

My beef with Neptune as to the Sky, on the other hand, is LEDs have been around for well over a decade, and quoting Tullio from Reefbrite (who has worked for Phillips), the technology of LEDs itself has not changed for all that time....

Yet the price GOES UP as Neptune makes unsupportable marketing statements such as that the Sky is "revolutionary".

The Sky is not "revolutionary."

It does not replace multiple G5's. It faired no better on the BRS spread test than the G5 and did worse, so i don't know where hyped statements like "it beat the BRS test" stem from. It is panel LED and fine one at that--that's all; it is not the best performing or constructed out there however.

My beef is that the combination of misleading advertising and infomercials and purposely not releasing details of the product--before it's released yet taking preorders--caused people to buy thinking they were getting something that they were not....

"Revolutionary"--at a minimum---requires core technology change or advancement such as converting from maxi-jet to propeller pumps . The sky just use other people's LEDs in a plastic panel with fans. The best i can say for substantially better than others--by all reviews--is the software. But your software has been around for years. Again, not revolutionary.

With do respect, i think you overhyped and overpriced the Sky. You enlisted many people to praise it before it was released, none of them suspiciously had ANY criticism, and you kept details close to vest while charging a super premium price. None of that makes me want to buy your products. Just be transparent and let your products sell themselves without all the hype please.

EDIT: And i should be your target customer; i have been in this hobby for over two decades, i have unlimited spending potential and simply buy the best products (and tons of them) with price-to-value a secondary thought. I have in fact spent many times more in this hobby than the total of many new hobbyists combined; hooking me is more profitable for companies like Neptune than getting sales from many new hobbiests that don't stay in the hobby. Yet, somehow, if you are willing to take constructive criticism, Neptune has lost me because i don't see the price-to-value and i am utterly turned off by the marketing hype. I do not think i am alone.

 

[Jon's Reef]

the technology of LEDs itself has not changed for all that time

Another great example of taking something out of context. Like any microelectronic, the basic design is similar but the ability for LEDs to be dialed in has changed substantially. For example, the quality of and variety of substrates has changed dramatically. Not that long ago Si was the only reliable economic substrate, but R&D into SiC has resulted in huge advances in the quality of its substrates. This has been the foundation not only for LEDs, but also solid state power converters (ex GaN based devices). This has resulted in LED with a larger variety of wavelengths, higher emission, cooler running, engineered emission FWHM and a large diversity of emission profiles. The basic premise is the same in terms of band gap engineering, but the tech has grown leaps and bounds.

It faired no better on the BRS spread test than the G5 and did worse

Another false statement. See my above compilation. Any difference between the G5 and Sky in terms of the 200-350 test is within error bars. Beyond the test criteria there is also something very intriguing on the 12” and 18” data slices in terms of light field uniformity.

misleading advertising and infomercials and purposely not releasing details of the product--before it's released yet taking preorders--caused people to buy thinking they were getting something that they were not....

I appreciate whatever info a vendor is willing to share before releasing, fully knowing it will showcase the product. That is called marketing. That being said, no one forces anyone to put money down. If you want to see a company who put out a pre-order way too soon… ask how those ion director preorder customers are doing. I placed an order for 1 light the day it opened, and exactly has promised it was in my hands in a week (I think less than a week). Installed it… did what I wanted and bam ordered another. This is how a product release works… no matter if it is a reef light or an iPhone.

The sky just use other people's LEDs in a plastic panel with fans.

How do you think LEDs are made? Yes they are made by other companies because it is a very complex process going down to atomic scale uniformity. You don’t just buy an LED easy bake oven and pop out LEDs, takes decades of experience and billions to do it.

But your software has been around for years. Again, not revolutionary.

I am aware of no other led solution, much less reef product who’s install was as simple and straightforward. Yes, Neptune was already at the top with their tasks (Ex the Trident install task with embedded videos), but this was a new level of install software.

none of them suspiciously had ANY criticism, and you kept details close to vest while charging a super premium price.

You are upset because people are happy with the product. Post release every one of those people has continued to say that their impression was true. I am much more skeptical of the people who you have linked with criticism because they have willfully and knowingly spread false information and started rumors. What is their agenda? Simple it has gotten them views.

The price is not super premium. It is in line with other 200W lights. In fact here are the prices of the lights in the above table:
Sky 870
Radion XR30 890
A500x 870 (w/ WiFi controller)
AP9X 870
2x XR15 920
CC G2 930 (w/ controller)
Orphek ~1100 (new upgrade announced, no price yet)

It is great to hear your opinions, but you continue to spread misinformation and present speculation as fact.

 

[blaxsun]

 

[PeterC99]

Unfortunately, I am still waiting for my LFS to get the Sky back in the store to test and tweak my prototype. In the meantime I have been printing a lot of light spill shades for the Radion XR30 and XR15. The Radions are by far the most requested light spill shade to date, but I expect Neptune loyal reefers to request light spill shades as they become more available. I am here to try and help solve some of those issues with my 3D printer. Happy reefing all!

Saw the Sky at my LFS yesterday. Definitely needs a light shade. Tremendous amount of light spill.

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

Another great example of taking something out of context. Like any microelectronic, the basic design is similar but the ability for LEDs to be dialed in has changed substantially. For example, the quality of and variety of substrates has changed dramatically. Not that long ago Si was the only reliable economic substrate, but R&D into SiC has resulted in huge advances in the quality of its substrates. This has been the foundation not only for LEDs, but also solid state power converters (ex GaN based devices). This has resulted in LED with a larger variety of wavelengths, higher emission, cooler running, engineered emission FWHM and a large diversity of emission profiles. The basic premise is the same in terms of band gap engineering, but the tech has grown leaps and bounds.



Another false statement. See my above compilation. Any difference between the G5 and Sky in terms of the 200-350 test is within error bars. Beyond the test criteria there is also something very intriguing on the 12” and 18” data slices in terms of light field uniformity.



I appreciate whatever info a vendor is willing to share before releasing, fully knowing it will showcase the product. That is called marketing. That being said, no one forces anyone to put money down. If you want to see a company who put out a pre-order way too soon… ask how those ion director preorder customers are doing. I placed an order for 1 light the day it opened, and exactly has promised it was in my hands in a week (I think less than a week). Installed it… did what I wanted and bam ordered another. This is how a product release works… no matter if it is a reef light or an iPhone.



How do you think LEDs are made? Yes they are made by other companies because it is a very complex process going down to atomic scale uniformity. You don’t just buy an LED easy bake oven and pop out LEDs, takes decades of experience and billions to do it.



I am aware of no other led solution, much less reef product who’s install was as simple and straightforward. Yes, Neptune was already at the top with their tasks (Ex the Trident install task with embedded videos), but this was a new level of install software.




You are upset because people are happy with the product. Post release every one of those people has continued to say that their impression was true. I am much more skeptical of the people who you have linked with criticism because they have willfully and knowingly spread false information and started rumors. What is their agenda? Simple it has gotten them views.

The price is not super premium. It is in line with other 200W lights. In fact here are the prices of the lights in the above table:
Sky 870
Radion XR30 890
A500x 870 (w/ WiFi controller)
AP9X 870
2x XR15 920
CC G2 930 (w/ controller)
Orphek ~1100 (new upgrade announced, no price yet)

It is great to hear your opinions, but you continue to spread misinformation and present speculation as fact.

There is nothing revolutionary about Sky's. Neptune basically assembled other people's technology, not as bad as say as the $300.00 Neptune Dose with hot glue holding on Neptune LED logos and wires to a plastic housing with $65 dosers available on Ali Express--and not as bad a Jabeo ripping off other's technology outright and rebranding it--but it's the same type of thing with the Sky to the degree a premium price is NOT warranted.

In other words, Neptune came to game late, road on other's coattails as to technology, previous mistakes not to make, and design. Neptune could have the priced the Sky accordingly; the Sky's R & D was massively cut down by other manufacturer's years of work on improving the application of LEDs. But instead of providing a nice light at a nice price (which truly would have been revolutionary and possible got people like me to join band wagon!) Neptune engaged in a--LOOK AT ME IM REVOLUTARY WHEN I AM ACTUALLY NOT--hype machine and marketing blitz. They made false statements and attached a premium price to a product that is not special and for which is Johnny Come Late to the game, offering nothing new but maybe nicer software.

What i am saying is that Kessil, Orphek, Phillips, and Ecotech have developed LED lights for far longer and have done far more in terms of advancing LED application than Neptune. I do not agree the with the price of those units. They all should be cheaper. This small industry is in a bit of cahoots with each other on that point. That said, those other fixtures offer better control of spectrum (Sky's only allow control of four spectrums), often more spectrum (e.g., Orphek) longevity in construction (e.g., Phillips), a track record (e.g., Radions), and/or greater utility/flexibility in application (Kessils X500's, for example, can be mounted at many different heights and in tight applications--a feature that boarders on actually being revolutionary because you can literally ceiling mount them=--changing the way people design their entire aquarium setup) than the Sky.

Moreover, you're purposely avoiding my entire point--Neptune's marketing is not just "marketing." It is obnoxious hyped up infomercials with more than a dusting false and misleading statements and omissions. Three sky's don't replace five G5's. The Sky did not "beat the BRS test." Neither the Sky's design, construction, nor performance is "revolutionary." Terrance's statement that he'd rather let third parties compare the G5 to the Sky--while literally performing a comparison on the G4's--is a weaselly admission that the Sky either cannot compete with the G5 or was not designed to and thus should have a lower price.

I am happy for people that buy the Sky and find added value in the hype. But i want to be clear that is what they are buying.... Hype. And i don't buy hype. I'll pay for a brand name and the reliability that comes with that--but i won't buy hype.

I find hype and marketing as to the Sky obnoxious and a utter and complete turn off. The Sky was total missed opportunity for Neptune to offer something truly different--a nice light a light price....Companies late to the game on a product line up, benefiting from other's previous R & D and learning from other's mistakes, often make and offer products for less money to buy market share--even if profits are less. Neptune made the opposite decision, kept profits high on the Sky, and used hype and misleading marketing to hook customers instead of hooking them with a nice light at a fair price. That's my opinion.

 

[chemisfun11]

Saw the Sky at my LFS yesterday. Definitely needs a light shade. Tremendous amount of light spill.

I hope to help those Sky owners with light spill as I have with many Radion owners. I hope to have a shade available for the Sky in the coming weeks. Stay tuned

 

[Jon's Reef]

Neptune basically assembled other people's technology, not as bad as say as the $300.00 Neptune Dose

The large differentiator of the DOS is the integration aspect. AWC and automated dosing adjustment. The price point again being inline with similar dosers. If you want to use Ali Express and Jaebo for dosing, good luck.

In other words, Neptune came to game late, road on other's coattails as to technology, previous mistakes not to make, and design. Neptune could have the priced the Sky accordingly; the Sky's R & D was massively cut down by other manufacturer's years of work on improving the application of LEDs. But instead of providing a nice light at a nice price (which truly would have been revolutionary and possible got people like me to join band wagon!) Neptune engaged in a--LOOK AT ME IM REVOLUTARY WHEN I AM ACTUALLY NOT--hype machine and marketing blitz. They made false statements and attached a premium price to a product that is not special and for which is Johnny Come Late to the game, offering nothing new but maybe nicer software.

This is often referred to as "standing on the shoulders of giants". When creating a commercial product, this is how it is done. The people who invent the core tech often lack either the resources or user base knowledge to create a full solution that appeals to the masses.

Panel LED's have been the revolution. Point or puck style lights suffer from uniformity when the aquascape is added and corals grow. This facilitates the addition of hybrid solutions with either T5 or LED bars. This is the current state of the industry.

As is often the case in paradigm shifts, there are early products which pave the road. Often these suffer from issues that hold it back from mass adoption. In this case, weight and integration are the major limiting factors. So let's look at the weight issue for large format LED panels:
SKY: over 4 lbs (~4.2-4.5)
CC G2: 15 lbs
Orphek: 16.7 lbs
Straton: 9.4 lbs

Another issue, the price of these larger fixtures is often higher than other solutions:
SKY: 870
CC G2: 930 (Formerly 1030)
Orphek: 1100
Straton: 1100

Terence gave a nice description of his experience/ how the development was kicked off. Saw a new tech at a show... but noticed it was not suited to the masses. Licensed the tech and elevated it from a feature to a full solution. That feature being that unlike the straton and orphek, this light uses the mixing panel. Not lenses... not just a diffuser. But a specially engineered mixing panel to provide both direct and indirect illumination.

The SKY is the first panel style light designed not for the few, but for the many. Tesla was not the first electric car and iPhone was not the first touchscreen phone. Rather they were the first full solutions to combine the core technology with user interfaces and formate that appealed to the larger market.

I do not agree the with the price of those units. They all should be cheaper.

It is worth what someone is willing to pay. The current state of the industry is that a 200W fixture goes for $800-$1000.

That said, those other fixtures offer better control of spectrum (Sky's only allow control of four spectrums), often more spectrum (e.g., Orphek) longevity in construction (e.g., Phillips), a track record (e.g., Radions), and/or greater utility/flexibility in application (Kessils X500's, for example, can be mounted at many different heights and in tight applications--a feature that boarders on actually being revolutionary because you can literally ceiling mount them=--changing the way people design their entire aquarium setup) than the Sky.

You are cherry picking features and overestimating benefits for the general home reefer.

More channels: Orphek has 4. Kessil has 1 white to blue, 3 supplemental (=4), CC G2 has 1 channel, Radion has 9 (+moonlight). SKY is at 4 plus the moonlight (which technically has 2)

Orphek expanded spectrum: The benefits of the expanded spectrum is up for debate. It may help, it may hurt.

Philips and longevity of construction: It is a commercial lighting fixture. There is no evidence to say that it will last longer in a home reef tank application.

Radions track record: Applies more to the G1-4. G5 was a large deviation which shows in the cracked cases and poor fan performance.

Kessil flexibility: Yep, just make sure you have extra lights to cover the shading.

Moreover, you're purposely avoiding my entire point--Neptune's marketing is not just "marketing." It is obnoxious hyped up infomercials with more than a dusting false and misleading statements and omissions. Three sky's don't replace five G5's. The Sky did not "beat the BRS test." Neither the Sky's design, construction, nor performance is "revolutionary."

Nope, it is marketing. You find it obnoxious, others find it informative. No one forces you to watch it... it is on YouTube... just don't turn it on. You have yet to provide the non-opinion derived false claims. A 6 ft tank can be lit by 3 SKY or 3 G5, but in many cases people are using 5 G5 to overcome shadowing and uniformity which the SKY will cover with 3. You will also find reefers adding supplemental bar lights to their G5's to overcome the shadowing.

Terrance's statement that he'd rather let third parties compare the G5 to the Sky--while literally performing a comparison on the G4's--is a weaselly admission that the Sky either cannot compete with the G5 or was not designed to and thus should have a lower price.

Neptune has done more to disprove these made up allegations than any other vendor. Even if they did the test, you would be questioning it. I have provided the data sets above from BRS. You can see that the G5 and SKY shows similar performance by the test criteria, but in the 12 and 18" levels you can see the increased uniformity in the SKY compared to every other light.

I am happy for people that buy the Sky and find added value in the hype. But i want to be clear that is what they are buying.... Hype. And i don't buy hype. I'll pay for a brand name and the reliability that comes with that--but i won't buy hype.

Having bought it and run it for a month now, I bought it for the value of the solution. I am very happy with it. No loud fans, even coverage and the color is great.

Here is my 1 month pics: Aug 5 (nem in front) to Sept 6 (nem on top)

The only problem I am now having is that some of the corals are growing so large that they are stinging neighbors.

I find hype and marketing as to the Sky obnoxious and a utter and complete turn off. The Sky was total missed opportunity for Neptune to offer something truly different--a nice light a light price....Companies late to the game on a product line up, benefiting from other's previous R & D and learning from other's mistakes, often make and offer products for less money to buy market share--even if profits are less. Neptune made the opposite decision, kept profits high on the Sky, and used hype and misleading marketing to hook customers instead of hooking them with a nice light at a fair price. That's my opinion.

I respect your opinion. But the comments about the profit margin are not based on facts. The light is a well built complete solution. Making something simple takes a lot of engineering. They found a really amazing tech in the marketplace, then combined it with their own designs and engineering to create a complete solution that brings the panel light form to the masses.

I will end on what I have said all along. This is a great light. If you prefer the Radion or Kessil looks, those are great too. With a Radion you will get more of the T5 Blue Plus Green-Blue color and a par MONSTER (in a good way), with the Kessil you are going to get that awesome shimmer and ability to light specific tank areas. The Sky gives uniform illumination and more of the Royal Blue/ violet look. Unlike previous panel lights, the SKY was designed for the home reefer at a better price point, full integration and a form factor that is easier to integrate into a wider variety of setups (due to the weight). With any of these lights you are going to be successful. We are very fortunate that in such a select hobby we have so many people working hard to bring a wide variety of choices.