NEW Kessil Light - 10 Years?!?!

pelphrey · Sep 4, 2018

Justfebreezeit said:
I hear you. But at 100 dollars for the current controller, plus 3 link cables at 20 bucks (60 bucks total), plus the new wifi module to add to the controller. Probably around 100 but i'll say 50 for arguments sake. That's another 210 dollars to get your lights to function like any other modern LED.

On a bigger tank I could see this strategy making a lot of sense,but on a smaller tank 1 or 2 maybe even 3 lights that extra 200 bucks is half the price of a whole light.

It just seems like with current level technology having a built in wifi module to each unit would cost much less to us and to them.

But they pay people to come up with this stuff so I must be wrong.

You wouldn’t need the new controller if you decided to use WiFi and an app to control the lights. Not sure how it will Work controlling multiple lights. May be cost effective to use a pink cable unless the WiFi adapter is reasonably priced.

Justfebreezeit · Sep 4, 2018

pelphrey said:
You wouldn’t need the new controller if you decided to use WiFi and an app to control the lights. Not sure how it will Work controlling multiple lights. May be cost effective to use a pink cable unless the WiFi adapter is reasonably priced.

How i'm interpreting their visuals and explanations so far is that the controller is required (the wifi hooks to the controller itself). I'll go back and see if I misunderstood. If that's the case then It makes more sense.

Edit: Ok so I watched the video again and I see the dongle hooks to the Light itself. That makes much more sense. Still looks like a link cable is needed unless you want to buy a wifi for every light like you said.

Either way I can see the logic behind it now. I thought the controller was required either way.

eb_reef · Sep 4, 2018

Justfebreezeit said:
How i'm interpreting their visuals and explanations so far is that the controller is required (the wifi hooks to the controller itself). I'll go back and see if I misunderstood. If that's the case then It makes more sense.

Edit: Ok so I watched the video again and I see the dongle hooks to the Light itself. That makes much more sense. Still looks like a link cable is needed unless you want to buy a wifi for every light like you said.

Either way I can see the logic behind it now. I thought the controller was required either way.

I think that using the USB type C cable is a good idea too. They maybe able to drive two lights off one power supply since type C can transmit power and data. Type C cables are getting cheaper everyday as more and more devices start to support it.

AcanthurusRex · Sep 4, 2018

Not interested in depending on Kessil to support their products. They could have spent some money support us AP700 owners. But they didn't.
It would take a hefty USB C cable to supply current to a bank of these lights. The AP700 are 48VDC and almost 4 amps at max rated power.

14 foot reef · Sep 4, 2018

i might have qty - 9 Kessil A360's for sale !!!!!!

Kyl · Sep 4, 2018

AcanthurusRex said:
Not interested in depending on Kessil to support their products. They could have spent some money support us AP700 owners. But they didn't.
It would take a hefty USB C cable to supply current to a bank of these lights. The AP700 are 48VDC and almost 4 amps at max rated power.

Seems like an odd mix of new (USB-C/wifi) plus old (physical connection). To the people citing wifi addition BOM costs, it's like $2-3 at scale. Could go even lower with bluetooth on the fixtures and create a BT <> wifi / network bridge module for those that want non-app control.

I hope we can get someone to have a good technical chat with them for those of us that can't attend, and not have it be just another marketing blurb with half promises on the floor of MACNA like what happened the last time they rolled out a premiere fixture. Coming soon / future release in that case meant 6-11 months for the phone apps.

I guess we'll all know in a couple more days. Their social media guys can't be happy right now heh.

Confuse · Sep 4, 2018

siggy said:
Hemispherical lens will give a better spread but that vent is going to suck up a lot of salt, lets hope the interior walls are all heat sinks.

That's what everyone said when the Radion came out and the fan was sucking in air from the bottom....and it never ended up happening.

siggy · Sep 5, 2018

Confuse said:
That's what everyone said when the Radion

siggy said:
lets hope the interior walls are all heat sinks.

Maybe I should have added "like the Radions"

wdavid · Sep 5, 2018

Scorpius said:
Those controller cords I'm sure will be proprietary that only you will sell.

It says USB-C no? Should be able to grab them fairly cheap on amazon if all they are doing is communication between the lights.

oreo54 · Sep 5, 2018

wdavid said:
It says USB-C no? Should be able to grab them fairly cheap on amazon if all they are doing is communication between the lights.

MAY not be that simple..

"SB-C 3.1 cables are considered full-featured USB-C cables. They are electronically marked cables that contain a chip with an ID function based on the configuration channel and vendor-defined messages (VDM) from the USB Power Delivery 2.0 specification. Cable length should be ≤ 2 m for gen. 1 or ≤ 1 m for gen. 2.[11] Electronic ID chip provides information about product/vendor, cable connectors, USB signalling protocol (2.0, gen. 1, gen. 2), passive/active construction, use of VCONN power, available VBUS current, latency, RX/TX directionality, SOP controller mode, and hardware/firmware version .[5]........."

Montiman · Sep 5, 2018

I think one underestimated feature of Kessil lights is the fact that they don’t have WiFi or individual color control. The people on this forum are Reef geeks so we want those things but I believe there is a large segment of the population who don’t.

When I was working at an LFS I was selling AI and Echotech lights and hated them. They worked at the store but I had at least half of my customers come back and say I now have tons of algae, my corals all bleached, I can’t connect to my lights, my lights are turning on in the middle of the night. I could fix all of these things but it was a lot of work and people got angry because they spent so much on a light I recommended and they weren’t happy with it. I walked into my local distributor to pick up for the shop and complained about my experience when they told me, “Try this it works” it was an original A150. Since then Kessil was king for me. When I used AI and Echotech the lights worked very well but to someone who knew nothing they couldn’t mess up with Kessil.

Coral lab has helped people with radions but there is still something about giving someone an A360 and knowing that they can tune it to any color and any intensity and everything will be fine. There is something to selling someone a light with a preprogrammed spectral controller that they simply plug in when they get home. There is also something to just using the light on a timer if the user has an extremely low tolerance for technology.

The new 360X looks like it will have all of the benefits of the old light with optional WiFi and individual color control for people like us. This is a huge win for Kessil in my book. If I were still at the store I could carry one light that would appeal to pretty much any customer.

siggy · Sep 5, 2018

Montiman said:
The new 360X looks like it will have all of the benefits of the old light with optional WiFi and individual color control for people like us. This is a huge win for Kessil in my book. If I were still at the store I could carry one light that would appeal to pretty much any customer.

Well Said!.....and with a Hybrid a Killer system...I might be parting with my 360w's

CMatlosz · Sep 6, 2018

No 0-10v support for apex?

cjd · Sep 6, 2018

CMatlosz said:
No 0-10v support for apex?

Look at the bottom right on the new controller 0-10v indicator ???

hart24601 · Sep 6, 2018

I saw the announcement of a new light and I was bummed as I bought a 360NE recently, however looking more closely I, at this point, am disappointed with the new model. The upside is that I don’t regret buying the older tech light!

I want to say that I have plenty of kessils, 2 a160 and a360N over a 34g, H380, H80, 3 a160 tuna sun over a 180 FW and 2 a160 over a 120 FW. So 10 lights total. What they do they do well, blend spectrum and the shimmer is amazing on planted tank where shading isn’t a big deal. On my 34 I wanted a clam tank so again shading isn’t a big deal and I just hate color separation. It’s funny I have so many as I wouldn’t call myself a kessil fan exactly. I run them all on timers and I pay a premium to have minimal lights over my systems so they look clean, even more of a premium if one considers the lack of features and light like the AI prime vs the 160 (and power). Also I miss moonlights.

Anyway the smaller height is cool, but I would have kept a longer light to have built in WIFI. From the description sounds like will need dongles and a controller? I don’t even have mine now on the spectral controller because who needs all those cables and controller, things are packed enough. I really hoped they followed the other major players and did an app so could control an entire tank of 360s without any more cords – what is the point of shrinking the light and making it clean then having to add a bunch back on it? Yes you can run them on timers still like I do, but when so much better technology has been out there for so long it’s hard to pay an increased price, plus the dongles, plus the controller for a lack of features just for good blending.

Which brings me to my next issue, which is the colored LEDs they have now. It seems like jumping on board with other lights adding these, but then they don’t with features that really matter above. I support adding more violet totally, but reds and greens? I don’t see the value of adding those and still having white LEDs, it seems better to have a mix of cool and warm whites since they are continuous spectrum or used colored LEDS and blend them so don’t use white leds at all.

It is interesting that for so many years they touted the kessil logic and how playing with colors is a bad thing for hobbyists, and turning the knob for color is the better way to go. I would have like to see them keep that concept, not include R/G but warm whites and have each fixture have WIFI.

saltwaterpicaso · Sep 6, 2018

once you buy the light buy the wifi dongle then you already know Neptune is going have you buy a new controller to control it your at the point of a stock ecotech radion. they better have there pricing on point for all of it idk it just seems like a huge money grab on kessils end its 2018 end Chinese leds have all these features built in now its kinda sad. but like others have stated we will still buy them

cjd · Sep 6, 2018

Confuse · Sep 6, 2018

saltwaterpicaso said:
once you buy the light buy the wifi dongle then you already know Neptune is going have you buy a new controller to control it your at the point of a stock ecotech radion. they better have there pricing on point for all of it idk it just seems like a huge money grab on kessils end its 2018 end Chinese leds have all these features built in now its kinda sad. but like others have stated we will still buy them

I agree. I feel the only reason for not integrating wireless controllability by default is due to trying to maximize profit by creating dependence on a small proprietary ecosystem. This type of controllability should be standard on every light, nowadays.

It's kind of like my Sonos speaker...I can link it to my Alexa wirelessly to listen to music and other stuff, but I can't link it my FireTV stick to watch/listen movies with it. Instead, I have to buy their $400 amp/receiver in order to connect my TV with the ecosystem so I can hear it through my speakers. A total strategic limitation imposed by the developer and an attempt at a money grab.