New Skimmer go big or not

Zachhll · Mar 23, 2017

I am setting my tank back up. I have an 80 gallon tank. I have Vertex 130 right now. I am looking for a larger tank in the 180 gallon size. The vertex is under sized for my current tank for the bioload I run. I have been looking at the Reef Octopus Elite 150INT or the Elite 200INT. My question will the 200 be too big for my current setup and begin to overskim? I plan to have a medium to high bioload.

redfishbluefish · Mar 23, 2017

With the research that has been done on skimmers, in my mind's eye, there is no such thing as over skimming. If I remember the papers, a skimmer at best removes 30 percent of the stuff it could remove. Also realize that the way skimmer manufacturers determine tank size is how much they charge for their skimmer, and to verify, they throw a dart at a dart board.

gcarroll · Mar 23, 2017

I think an 8" skimmer is appropriate for a 180g so I would recommend the the RO Elite 200INT of the ones you have narrowed it down to. IMO, i would keep the current skimmer until you are ready to upgrade. You never know what new products will be introduced between now and then.

427HISS · Mar 23, 2017

I don't recall the artical I read, but you can oversize a skimmer per gallons.

One problem is not enough dwell time. The better quality skimmers have been tested to have a min to max to tank size.
If you push a lot of water through the skimmer, the bubbles don't have time to break down the crap, .....and create the nasty foam.

Most of the high end manufactures will tell you the same thing. If you feel better, go one size up to what's recommend.

So yes, you can go too big.

skim · Mar 23, 2017

Yes you can over skim but not in the most think. If you take that 200 and put it on your system that you have now, what will most likely happen is it will skim and produce foam as normal and then it will just stop producing foam at one point as it has nothing it can remove. Now this can last sometimes for a week and then you would see it would start once again, foam and the process starts over and repeats itself. The skimmer does not produce a consistent foam, some say no big deal. IMO I believe it is, as the organics bounce up and down at much greater rates than if it was a consistent foam. The Organics would spike and fall, so let's just use a very basic sort of example. Say you have a base number ( FICTIONAL ) that a skimmer keeps your tank happy and the skimmer behaves it a consistent manner, of say 25 ppm. Now you get a larger unit that is well oversized and now it starts to work, for a day or two then it just stops producing, levels have drop to say 5 ppm, threshold point. Now the Organics have to build up in your system before it will start again, but now yes it will start to foam at 25 ppm but organics are on the rise and it can't stop at 25 ppm because the Organics have built up and the skimmer does react to the increase but it does take time for it to remove, the levels increase to a max say 150 ppm ( at this point most start posting and saying it's the best skimmer it is foaming like a beast ) before they start to fall back down until it bottoms out again at 5 ppm ( at this point you see postings saying skimmer sucks and just stopped and I have to adjust all the time and then it will overflow and I am sick of adjusting it it sucks, I need a new skimmer any ideas on a good skimmer ). Now take that Elite 200 and put it on the 180 and say it's happy holding around 25 ppm, you feed and organics go up and say rise to 50 ppm and brings it down back to around the base but not below. It is now producing a consistent foam. Now in Reefing one of the most important things is being consistent with water parameters and I believe going with the seesaw method can cause more problems then solve. The point I am trying to make is Skimmers are much more efficient now than they were when that double or triple the size or double the skimmers rule was suggested, this goes back to the Air Driven units, you may see some of them for sale today for Nano tanks. I believe Lees and Reef Octopus still sell then and I sure some others. IMO you want to look for a skimmer that the manufacture has rated your system somewhere in the middle. Example your future 180 ( don't forget you need to base it on tank Volume once everything is in it and the sump, so potentially your 180 may end up with total volume of 120 after Rock work and substrate ect. ) Skimmer rated 75 gal Heavy and Mid 150 and 200 light is a better choice than 150 Heavy 225 Mid and 300 Light. Like it was stated before a max of 30 to 35% is what they can remove. GAC will remove much greater amounts anywhere from 60 to 90%, another reason to think do I need a large skimmer. Like many people say " I added Carbon and now my skimmer has stopped or almost stopped working."
Just my 2 cents and maybe something to think about.

Yoda0311 · Mar 23, 2017

Zachhll said:
I am setting my tank back up. I have an 80 gallon tank. I have Vertex 130 right now. I am looking for a larger tank in the 180 gallon size. The vertex is under sized for my current tank for the bioload I run. I have been looking at the Reef Octopus Elite 150INT or the Elite 200INT. My question will the 200 be too big for my current setup and begin to overskim? I plan to have a medium to high bioload.

I have an SRO 5000 with bubble blaster pump on my 120 with 30 breeder sump and I have no problem with "overskiming". I have no problem with Acros and most LPS ( the only thing I can't keep alive and happy is euphyllia) no clue why. Lol

mtraylor · Mar 23, 2017

Well it all depends on your bioload to determine how much skimming & what kind of water quality you need for your ecosystem. I run the Elite 220 on my 255 reef that is predominant SPS and I love the skimmer. Its silky smooth and consistent. Not to mention you can dial it in with the dc controllable pump. Oh and its dead quite.

I recommend you go with the 200 Elite and don't look back.

Enjoy the skimmer. Its one of the most important investments in a good reef IMO.

Xclusive Reef · Apr 25, 2017

also look at the NYOS QUANTUM 160 Protein Skimmer. I heard they are great skimmers and quiet. I am also in the same boat looking for a skimmer for a 90 gal with the goal to upgrade in 2-3 years to a 225 gal tank.

4FordFamily · Apr 25, 2017

redfishbluefish said:
With the research that has been done on skimmers, in my mind's eye, there is no such thing as over skimming. If I remember the papers, a skimmer at best removes 30 percent of the stuff it could remove. Also realize that the way skimmer manufacturers determine tank size is how much they charge for their skimmer, and to verify, they throw a dart at a dart board.

X2. Go big or go home!

SethOF · Apr 25, 2017

redfishbluefish said:
With the research that has been done on skimmers, in my mind's eye, there is no such thing as over skimming. If I remember the papers, a skimmer at best removes 30 percent of the stuff it could remove. Also realize that the way skimmer manufacturers determine tank size is how much they charge for their skimmer, and to verify, they throw a dart at a dart board.

The question then is, what exactly goes into determining an appropriate size skimmer?

Whether it is external or internal?
The size of the column?
The height of the column?
The width of the neck?
The output of the pump?
The size of the collector cup?
The width of the base?
The sizes of the tubes?
The operating height?
How many inches of fish, or how many pounds of fish, or what types of inhabitants?
How much you feed, or what you feed?
What else is being used to export waste?

Does the total volume of water really count ?

Zachhll · May 16, 2017

So I figured I would update everyone. I ended up buying the Elite 150INT. As i am not sure when i will have my new tank installed and stocked to the level needed for the bigger one. Here is a picture of the skimmate for 36 hours out of this sucker. 100% happy with this skimmer.

Greaps · May 16, 2017

I think skimmers have little to do with water volume and more to do with bioload, but since this is hard to quantify I understand why companies market them by tank gallons.

A question I'v have is what why is a skimmer that's to small (not taken to an extreme)cause problems? Wouldn't the constant access to recirculating water make the protein's continually available for skimming so long as the collection cup is emptied often or diverted into a larger container. I would assume an oversized skimmer could more aggressively(quickly) pull skimmate and that may be great for certain applications, but a slower pull be might be better for tanks and reefers who have to little nutrients. ( I found myself needing to dose nitrate). I suppose having a skimmer to small may overtime lead to an an accumulation of nutrients if the export is not keeping up. Prolly answered my own question. It really is a hard question to get the right skimmer size.

Maybe a better way of asking is I have xyz fish and feed xyz amount of food daily, what skimmer is appropriately sized?

mtraylor · May 16, 2017

Great choice. My 220 has been running well.

hart24601 · May 18, 2017

As others have said you really can't "overskim" a tank – that is remove too many compounds (trace minerals and such) from a system. However you can sure put a skimmer that is too large on a system. I have done it before. You would think a huge skimmer would pull DOC out faster, but it seems to be the opposite (at lower DOC levels). When the neck size is really large you need a certain level of DOC to produce a stable foam head. That is why skimmer size is quite bioload dependent.

When you 1st get a new huge skimmer it generally works great until the DOC drops below what is needed to fill that huge neck with stable bubbles. The foam dies, most people adjust the skimmer to raise the foam back up, and when DOC hit the level needed… boom, overflowing cup. Exactly what happened to me until I realized what was going on. So I ended up having a skimmer that would skim 1 day a week and then appear to do nothing the other days until I got a larger system and more fish.

So running a grossly oversized skimmer (neck mostly) will result in DOC remaining in the system longer as they build up before it can be skimmed. Now most skimmers in the hobby have just silly ratings – so the advice of buying oversized has persisted because manufactures put just silly tank ratings on them. I really look at 1. Air flow, 2. Neck size and 3. Water flow - to make apples to apples comparison between skimmers as the ratings are silly.

To the OP congrats on a nice skimmer! You clearly made a good choice!