New tank. How do my numbers look?

[btmedic04]

Hello all. This is my second time in saltwater, but my first time testing all of my main elements and I am wondering how my numbers look. Main goal is a mixed reef with LPS, SPS and some zoas. I know my phosphates are high and am also wondering if it is ok to start running GFO without risking creating the perfect storm for dinos. Current stocking is 2 trochus snails. I will be purchasing my first fish and a few more members of the cuc this coming weekend. Tank is a nuvo 20 with ~13 lbs of rock and 90g of marinepure gems. Thanks!

PH 8.2
Calcium 420 ppm
Alkalinity 7.8 dKH
Magnesium 1400 ppm
Phosphate 0.68
Nitrate 10 ppm

 

[Brew12]

Hello all. This is my second time in saltwater, but my first time testing all of my main elements and I am wondering how my numbers look. Main goal is a mixed reef with LPS, SPS and some zoas. I know my phosphates are high and am also wondering if it is ok to start running GFO without risking creating the perfect storm for dinos. Current stocking is 2 trochus snails. I will be purchasing my first fish and a few more members of the cuc this coming weekend. Tank is a nuvo 20 with ~13 lbs of rock and 90g of marinepure gems. Thanks!

PH 8.2
Calcium 420 ppm
Alkalinity 7.8 dKH
Magnesium 1400 ppm
Phosphate 0.68
Nitrate 10 ppm

I would say your phosphates look high, so running a little GFO would be good. Start slow and work your way up on how much you run.

Otherwise, I think it looks great.

 

[ndrwater]

A little elevated on the phosphate, but otherwise great numbers!!

 

[btmedic04]

Awesome! Thanks fellas! I have BRS high capacity GFO, so I will start off with 2 tbsp. of it in my minimax reactor and ill test it this Friday to see where its at before adding livestock

 

[SPR1968]

It all looks very good apart from the raised phosphate levels so as already said, add GFO and ‘slowly’ drop the levels and a good target is around 0.03ppm and as your quiet a lot higher, just add small amounts so you don’t upset any corals.

 

[NickC]

Looks good to me. I wouldn’t run any GFO just because you don’t like the number, and definitely not before your stocking is done and tank has settled in. If you have algae issues down the road when the last fish had been in awhile, and you attribute the algae to phosphate, then consider GFO. Just my opinion of course.

I try not to fix problems that don’t exist. Usually I cause new ones when I do.

 

[btmedic04]

Looks good to me. I wouldn’t run any GFO just because you don’t like the number, and definitely not before your stocking is done and tank has settled in. If you have algae issues down the road when the last fish had been in awhile, and you attribute the algae to phosphate, then consider GFO. Just my opinion of course.

I try not to fix problems that don’t exist. Usually I cause new ones when I do.

I agree, tinkering when we don't need to is a good way to get yourself in trouble. I just want to lower it a bit before I start adding corals and a lot of this stems from my first go at saltwater. I had a softie tank that was overrun with green and brown hair algae and I'm already starting to see it pop up. I just figured i'd lower it down to 0.1, remove the gfo then add corals and see what it does. Do you think I should also test my ro/di water that I've been getting from my LFS? I'll be ordering a ro/di unit this weekend as well. my last one was destroyed by my ex's cat who loved to pee on my stuff :mad:. It's been 3 years and I still cant get the smell out of the canisters and other parts that haven't rusted

 

[NickC]

I agree, tinkering when we don't need to is a good way to get yourself in trouble. I just want to lower it a bit before I start adding corals and a lot of this stems from my first go at saltwater. I had a softie tank that was overrun with green and brown hair algae and I'm already starting to see it pop up. I just figured i'd lower it down to 0.1, remove the gfo then add corals and see what it does. Do you think I should also test my ro/di water that I've been getting from my LFS? I'll be ordering a ro/di unit this weekend as well. my last one was destroyed by my ex's cat who loved to pee on my stuff :mad:. It's been 3 years and I still cant get the smell out of the canisters and other parts that haven't rusted

Hahaha I am not a cat person at all, dogs and coral for me please! Testing your r/o water is a great idea.

If you want to drop your phosphate with GFO now, then by all means go ahead. If it were me I’d give the tank plenty of time afterward to stabilize before adding livestock however. I get the feeling this tank hasn’t been set up for very long at all, and in the beginning numbers go up and down left and right etc. Just take it slow whatever you decide to do.

 

[btmedic04]

Hahaha I am not a cat person at all, dogs and coral for me please! Testing your r/o water is a great idea.

If you want to drop your phosphate with GFO now, then by all means go ahead. If it were me I’d give the tank plenty of time afterward to stabilize before adding livestock however. I get the feeling this tank hasn’t been set up for very long at all, and in the beginning numbers go up and down left and right etc. Just take it slow whatever you decide to do.

For sure! It's been running for 3 weeks now but the cycle is complete. I didnt believe DR Tim's one and only would work that fast, but after 16 days into the cycle it was processing 2ppm of ammonia into nitrate in 24 hours. I did my water change Friday night, then added my two trochus snails Saturday. I'll test phosphates on my ro water tomorrow when I get home from work and then test my tank water as well. I was planning on getting a royal gramma or clownfish and a couple more snails or hermits for my cuc this weekend.

 

[NickC]

For sure! It's been running for 3 weeks now but the cycle is complete. I didnt believe DR Tim's one and only would work that fast, but after 16 days into the cycle it was processing 2ppm of ammonia into nitrate in 24 hours. I did my water change Friday night, then added my two trochus snails Saturday. I'll test phosphates on my ro water tomorrow when I get home from work and then test my tank water as well. I was planning on getting a royal gramma or clownfish and a couple more snails or hermits for my cuc this weekend.

Again this is just my opinion, so take it for what it’s worth (next to nothing), but hearing that I’d be pumping the brakes on the GFO. I might grab a fish soon, but your tank has a long way to go to get leveled out. Nitrate and po4 have a weird relationship, and your tank is really young.

Just remember the word “slow”. Good luck, sounds like your off to a good start and are really paying attention to the tank.

 

[Brew12]

Looks good to me. I wouldn’t run any GFO just because you don’t like the number, and definitely not before your stocking is done and tank has settled in. If you have algae issues down the road when the last fish had been in awhile, and you attribute the algae to phosphate, then consider GFO. Just my opinion of course.

I try not to fix problems that don’t exist. Usually I cause new ones when I do.

You raise some great points and ones I normally do worry about. If this were a 2 month old tank with more live stock I would be hesitant to run GFO. My thinking is that this is lowest risk time to run GFO. There is no coral in the system to be killed by removing too much PO4. Fish and inverts are rarely sensitive to a PO4 deficiency. For a new tank to have started with this much PO4 it almost had to have been bound in the rock. It would have been ideal to soak this rock and run GFO in the curing container to remove the PO4 prior to use. Unfortunately, it is too late for this.
As I'm sure you are aware, but the OP may not be, PO4 can be bound in rock and creates an equilibrium with the water. If you have PO4 at 0.2ppm and do a 50% water change, you will have 0.1ppm PO4 for a short period of time. Since the concentration of PO4 is now higher in the rock than in the water the PO4 will be released into the water and cause it to climb. This is where I feel most people get in trouble with GFO. It takes substantially more GFO to lower PO4 since you have to remove it from the water and the rock. Once the amount of PO4 in the water and the rock is where you want it, you need much less GFO to maintain it there since you are only removing what is added but not consumed. In my mind, this is the danger zone where you can quickly blow through your goal and strip all the PO4 which causes issues with dino's and will kill coral (I know from experience). My feeling is that I would like to OP to get closer to his target PO4 prior to adding sensitive livestock.

 

[SPR1968]

+1 I completely agree with this ^

 

[btmedic04]

You raise some great points and ones I normally do worry about. If this were a 2 month old tank with more live stock I would be hesitant to run GFO. My thinking is that this is lowest risk time to run GFO. There is no coral in the system to be killed by removing too much PO4. Fish and inverts are rarely sensitive to a PO4 deficiency. For a new tank to have started with this much PO4 it almost had to have been bound in the rock. It would have been ideal to soak this rock and run GFO in the curing container to remove the PO4 prior to use. Unfortunately, it is too late for this.
As I'm sure you are aware, but the OP may not be, PO4 can be bound in rock and creates an equilibrium with the water. If you have PO4 at 0.2ppm and do a 50% water change, you will have 0.1ppm PO4 for a short period of time. Since the concentration of PO4 is now higher in the rock than in the water the PO4 will be released into the water and cause it to climb. This is where I feel most people get in trouble with GFO. It takes substantially more GFO to lower PO4 since you have to remove it from the water and the rock. Once the amount of PO4 in the water and the rock is where you want it, you need much less GFO to maintain it there since you are only removing what is added but not consumed. In my mind, this is the danger zone where you can quickly blow through your goal and strip all the PO4 which causes issues with dino's and will kill coral (I know from experience). My feeling is that I would like to OP to get closer to his target PO4 prior to adding sensitive livestock.

That was my thinking to a T. The thing I wasnt sure about was would it strip all my po4 and open the door for dinos. I think you are correct with phosphates being bound up in the rock because I did a 10 gallon water change out of a total actual volume of 14 gallons 3 days prior to testing (nitrates were 40+ from the ammonium chloride I dosed.) I'll test tank phosphates and ro phosphates tonight when I get home from work and report back. Currently running 2 tbsp of GFO

 

[NickC]

You raise some great points and ones I normally do worry about. If this were a 2 month old tank with more live stock I would be hesitant to run GFO. My thinking is that this is lowest risk time to run GFO. There is no coral in the system to be killed by removing too much PO4. Fish and inverts are rarely sensitive to a PO4 deficiency. For a new tank to have started with this much PO4 it almost had to have been bound in the rock. It would have been ideal to soak this rock and run GFO in the curing container to remove the PO4 prior to use. Unfortunately, it is too late for this.
As I'm sure you are aware, but the OP may not be, PO4 can be bound in rock and creates an equilibrium with the water. If you have PO4 at 0.2ppm and do a 50% water change, you will have 0.1ppm PO4 for a short period of time. Since the concentration of PO4 is now higher in the rock than in the water the PO4 will be released into the water and cause it to climb. This is where I feel most people get in trouble with GFO. It takes substantially more GFO to lower PO4 since you have to remove it from the water and the rock. Once the amount of PO4 in the water and the rock is where you want it, you need much less GFO to maintain it there since you are only removing what is added but not consumed. In my mind, this is the danger zone where you can quickly blow through your goal and strip all the PO4 which causes issues with dino's and will kill coral (I know from experience). My feeling is that I would like to OP to get closer to his target PO4 prior to adding sensitive livestock.

This is great advice, and you articulated my point much better than I did. The op seemed dead set on adding livestock in a couple of days, and I was trying to help him avoid issues that could come with that and GFO in the new tank.

With livestock comes nitrate, fish food brings po4 and nitrate. Adding fish over time brings more and more, and it takes a while for everything to balance out so you truly know what your levels are.

With that being said, I guess my advice would be two options.

Option one- remove po4 with GFO or whatever other method you choose, and get your level where you like it before adding any livestock (this will not be completed by the weekend like when you’ve said you want to start adding fish)

Option two- start adding fish very slowly, while on a consistent water change schedule. Once fish are no longer being added, and your feeding and water changes have been consistent, give it some time to stabilize and THEN form a plan of attack if you have a problem with po4.

 

[Oshengems]

Looks good to me. I wouldn’t run any GFO just because you don’t like the number, and definitely not before your stocking is done and tank has settled in. If you have algae issues down the road when the last fish had been in awhile, and you attribute the algae to phosphate, then consider GFO. Just my opinion of course.

I try not to fix problems that don’t exist. Usually I cause new ones when I do.

What he said if this is how your tank naturally is staying number wise don’t fix anything yet you on the money, yes phosphate could be a lil lower but I wouldn’t change anything yet, can we see your tank? Are you comfortable with the way it looks ?

 

[btmedic04]

Hey folks, So I tested phosphates again and decided to do the low range test, high range test and test the ro/di water. Here were the results

low range (17ml of tank water) ~0
high range (1ml tank water 16ml ro water) ~0.68
ro water (17ml ro water) ~0.04/~0.68 not sure if this is considered low range or high range

If my phosphate was higher than the readings on a red sea phosphate pro low range test, would the color be pegged at the maximum or would it read 0? either way it looks like my LFS water has phosphates in it, or the food safe 5 gallon buckets are leaching it.

Judging by the hair algae beginning to form on the rock work and sand there's obviously been some phosphates in there. If indeed my phosphates are reading 0, should I do a water change since I know my ro water has phosphates in it or should I just sit tight until I add livestock? As far as how it looks, I do have some spots of hair algae forming on the rock work and in a spot or two on the sand. Im just hoping that its still there because my trochus snails haven't found it yet lol. GFO removed for the time being and I will be going with Nicks option 2 and wait and see method.

 

[Brew12]

Nicks option 2 and wait and see method

Wise choice! Sounds like you may have a test kit issue. Will your LFS test the water for you?

 

[btmedic04]

Wise choice! Sounds like you may have a test kit issue. Will your LFS test the water for you?

I'll swing by and ask them since they're 2 miles up the road. If they won't, I'll ask the other store that's 20 minutes away lol

 

[NickC]

Hey folks, So I tested phosphates again and decided to do the low range test, high range test and test the ro/di water. Here were the results

low range (17ml of tank water) ~0
high range (1ml tank water 16ml ro water) ~0.68
ro water (17ml ro water) ~0.04/~0.68 not sure if this is considered low range or high range

If my phosphate was higher than the readings on a red sea phosphate pro low range test, would the color be pegged at the maximum or would it read 0? either way it looks like my LFS water has phosphates in it, or the food safe 5 gallon buckets are leaching it.

Judging by the hair algae beginning to form on the rock work and sand there's obviously been some phosphates in there. If indeed my phosphates are reading 0, should I do a water change since I know my ro water has phosphates in it or should I just sit tight until I add livestock? As far as how it looks, I do have some spots of hair algae forming on the rock work and in a spot or two on the sand. Im just hoping that its still there because my trochus snails haven't found it yet lol. GFO removed for the time being and I will be going with Nicks option 2 and wait and see method.

I think that is a smart plan. A lot of times in this hobby we encounter things that simply need time and water changes. When that doesn’t work, a more aggressive approach is sometimes necessary.

 

[btmedic04]

This is one of the little tufts of algae I have growing currently. Should I take it over to the algae forum or am I being paranoid?