New tank Question. When should i start dosing?

[terraincognita]

That was the ultimate plan for sure. I figure a few test frags after the holidays to see where we are. tank will be almost 4 months after the holidays.

Bro if you're cycled and you got lights, go grab the test corals now?

You got fish in there?

Why wait?

You can very readily add softies to a 4 month tank

they're like $15-20 in most LFS

 

[southerntnreefer]

Bro if you're cycled and you got lights, go grab the test corals now?

You got fish in there?

Why wait?

You can very readily add softies to a 4 month tank

they're like $15-20 in most LFS

Not my first tank, but my first tank where i intend to dose. I had decent luck in my old 90, ( photos of it in my build thread for this one) Im mostly waiting for the money at this point. I have a pair of clowns ive had for over a month. just about a month and a half. Lights have been on for about 2 weeks. I delayed lights to be able to cycle it for a while to try to reduce some "uglies" Ive always used a head of hammer or frogspawn, and a head or 2 of duncan as a barometer of where the tank is. thats the plan too. I need to order my next fish off the master fish list, and i usually get a gift card to my lfs for christmas somehow, so i figure that is what ill use for test coral. Im still being picky of what goes in, as its only a 72 gallon show, so space becomes issue eventually, so i want the most color possible,

 

[terraincognita]

Not my first tank, but my first tank where i intend to dose. I had decent luck in my old 90, ( photos of it in my build thread for this one) Im mostly waiting for the money at this point. I have a pair of clowns ive had for over a month. just about a month and a half. Lights have been on for about 2 weeks. I delayed lights to be able to cycle it for a while to try to reduce some "uglies" Ive always used a head of hammer or frogspawn, and a head or 2 of duncan as a barometer of where the tank is. thats the plan too. I need to order my next fish off the master fish list, and i usually get a gift card to my lfs for christmas somehow, so i figure that is what ill use for test coral. Im still being picky of what goes in, as its only a 72 gallon show, so space becomes issue eventually, so i want the most color possible,

Nice start up plan.

However, Hammers and frogspawn are stupid expensive right now . You're going to drop minimally like $60 per head rn.... Sorry. Maybe you can find a steal.

 

[southerntnreefer]

Nice start up plan.

However, Hammers and frogspawn are stupid expensive right now . You're going to drop minimally like $60 per head rn.... Sorry. Maybe you can find a steal.

Ive got a 13 heads of hammer, and a small frag of frogspawn in my wifes 32 bio cube. its been up for almost 3 years, and they were in my 90 for years too. grew one of those colonies from a 1 head frag not knowing what the heck i was doing learning LOL. Plus we have a good reef club, so i know i can find a deal. The end game will most likely be acans, open brains, and scolys on sandbed, with a center of a maxima clam. Then i want all kinds of good color and flowing coral up above. A few SPS for height etc. The tank took a year to get running from arrival of tank, to getting wet, and now to finally stocking. Im clearly in no hurry LOL

 

[terraincognita]

Ive got a 13 heads of hammer, and a small frag of frogspawn in my wifes 32 bio cube. its been up for almost 3 years, and they were in my 90 for years too. grew one of those colonies from a 1 head frag not knowing what the heck i was doing learning LOL. Plus we have a good reef club, so i know i can find a deal. The end game will most likely be acans, open brains, and scolys on sandbed, with a center of a maxima clam. Then i want all kinds of good color and flowing coral up above. A few SPS for height etc. The tank took a year to get running from arrival of tank, to getting wet, and now to finally stocking. Im clearly in no hurry LOL

You got this!

You'll figure out dosing without a problem man.

Just try to get your testing super consistent. (as in exactly how you test each time down to the drop) and you'll figure out the dosing super easy.

 

[southerntnreefer]

You got this!

You'll figure out dosing without a problem man.

Just try to get your testing super consistent. (as in exactly how you test each time down to the drop) and you'll figure out the dosing super easy.

I have an Alk Hanna, Salifert Mag, which doesnt usually stray far in any of my tanks, and Use Red Sea for CAL. I figure ill start testing Alk weekly with my weekly maintence. ( change carbon, check cheato in reactor, clean glass in and out) this way i develop a starting point before i add coral in, vs when i take it out.

Current light schedule is BRS reccomended spectrum on a set of Hydra 32s. I run a half hour ramp up, half hour ramp down, and a 9 hour full power.

 

[terraincognita]

One tip someone told me one time was focus on ALk.

Alk won't drop without calc and mag dropping also, and with Cal and Mag to be more focused on a "range".

By adjusting Alk specifically with a 2 part you will get your cal and mag balanced since they're all together.

also easier to adjust alk from 9 to 9.5 than calc from 400 to 420

 

[southerntnreefer]

One tip someone told me one time was focus on ALk.

Alk won't drop without calc and mag dropping also, and with Cal and Mag to be more focused on a "range".

By adjusting Alk specifically with a 2 part you will get your cal and mag balanced since they're all together.

also easier to adjust alk from 9 to 9.5 than calc from 400 to 420

Yes thats what ive read. And if you cant balance either, check your Mag, as its likely out of whack and kind of is the building block and balancer of both Alk and CAL. I had high alk isues like 12+ with reef crystals so i started this time with purple bucket IO for better results. My acans hated hated hated it.

 

[92Miata]

You want to start maintaining alkalinity immediately. Coraline needs it (and coraline is a vital reef organism) and it affects pH - and pH swinging around more than necessary just makes things more difficult for everything.

The early parts of the nitrogen cycle consume Alkalinity (and the nitrate->gas/tissue/etc releases it, but new tanks don't really have that going on yet) - so you often see alkalinity drops early on even without corals. I had to start dosing to maintain alkalinity in the first month and was up to a steady 10ml of each part (.2dkh) daily by about 6 weeks. The 40 at 6 months is now doing 50ml a day (a bit over 1 dkh)


So start testing - and dose 2 part manually as needed. When that "as needed" becomes relatively consistent - then start firing up the doser.


(also - don't let anyone tell you that you don't need to dose with just LPS - healthy LPS eat up plenty of calcium/alkalinity)

 

[southerntnreefer]

You want to start maintaining alkalinity immediately. Coraline needs it (and coraline is a vital reef organism) and it affects pH - and pH swinging around more than necessary just makes things more difficult for everything.

The early parts of the nitrogen cycle consume Alkalinity (and the nitrate->gas/tissue/etc releases it, but new tanks don't really have that going on yet) - so you often see alkalinity drops early on even without corals. I had to start dosing to maintain alkalinity in the first month and was up to a steady 10ml of each part (.2dkh) daily by about 6 weeks. The 40 at 6 months is now doing 50ml a day (a bit over 1 dkh)


So start testing - and dose 2 part manually as needed. When that "as needed" becomes relatively consistent - then start firing up the doser.


(also - don't let anyone tell you that you don't need to dose with just LPS - healthy LPS eat up plenty of calcium/alkalinity)

So you would reccomend me picking up reef fusion now, and such? I plan to test my ALk this weekend with my normal maint. see where i am then, and then what? test again in a week to see what the alk swing is without corals?

 

[Brandon3152134]

80 gallons total with display and sump. Jebao 4 head doser on hand, and a 3 part container ready to go. Im looking at Reef Fusion from Seachem for 2 part with trace dosing. Looking to get a few test frags after christmas. Running Standard Instant oceean for a lower alk mix than RC. WHen would you say id need to configure this doser? I dont mind doing it from day one, im just trying to figure out what i need to do. SHould i get the 3 or 4 test frags im after, test alk, call, mag phos during my weekly maint, then test alk each day for a week, and then dial it in? Etc?

Thoughts?

I'm 11 months into the current reef I have and just started adding small amounts of kalk it takes a good amount of stony corals to eat up your alk and cal. Most will be replenished with water changes.

 

[terraincognita]

So you would reccomend me picking up reef fusion now, and such? I plan to test my ALk this weekend with my normal maint. see where i am then, and then what? test again in a week to see what the alk swing is without corals?

While monitoring it is super important for long term success.

Popping in corals and doing your first test and dosing after 1 week isn't going to be a problem either. Nothing will happen overnight including complete depletion of the elements in your water (Maybe with a booming SPS reef sure but not for a few frags)

You'll get back from your coral and tank the time and detail you put into it. @92Miata gave great info.

The main thing I'm trying to impart is to not worry TOO much about dosing until you feel like you have you head wrapped around it properly.

Overdosing, or incorrect dosing is just as harmful as not dosing at all.

If you keep your parameters stable and at a consistent level and good level for reef health including coralline from the second you start your tank, you'll ultimate have the best success. It's not to late to start now either, but his main point is stability is king, and there are many other things in your water that consume Alk besides SPS he is right.

You shouldn't see huge flucutations in any elements within 1-2 days though of just a few LPS and Softies frags. but they will consume it for sure.

since you have an existing tank, with coral (You have a biocube yeah?) I'd suggest if you want to not do WC's, start your plan with this tank and try to get more knowledgeable about dosing on it.

Start with daily testing now, no WC's. Over the next 2 weeks you'll see a difference in the Alk, Cal and Mag. I wouldn't dose for the first 2 weeks, this will give you some time to see how much the tank is consuming on a daily or every other day basis.

After 2 weeks start dosing every day or every other day along with testing, see if you can get the parameters stable after a couple months of toying around and learning about dosing.

You should be able to get it pretty easily.

More or less

ALK, CAL, MAG goes down dose to adjust, if it goes too high (higher than it was on original test) you've dosed too much. There's a lag on this as well after dosing, so just test once a day.

Don't be alarmed if it stays exactly the same everyday. If you are dosing and doing tests and see no difference in numbers after 4 days. It means you've magically hit the nail on the head and you're dosing the right amount. I'd say it's unlikely for this to happen but could happen for sure.

You will get all your answers just doing something like this rather than trying to read about it everywhere.

There's a lot of information about dosing and the best thing you can do for yourself is browse the sticky threads in reef chemistry forum if you want to read more.

however, It's all a gradient scale. Don't try to overwhelm yourself all at once.

Once you have dialed in dosing you can drop testing to once a week or once a month. Up to you. At that point its more of a monitor.
----

also I'd use ATI instead of SeaChem to start btw. I don't like Seachem in general but just my own feelings. Both good beginner 2 part dosers.

There's no "perfect parameters" but rather ranges. (I only say this because the opinions differ so much on ideal numbers)

Do more study on Alk and the benefits of it in reefing etc, and decide for yourself what you want your alk, cal and mag to be at stably, get it to there and then work to keep it at that constantly, you'll be fine.

 

[southerntnreefer]

While monitoring it is super important for long term success.

Popping in corals and doing your first test and dosing after 1 week isn't going to be a problem either. Nothing will happen overnight including complete depletion of the elements in your water (Maybe with a booming SPS reef sure but not for a few frags)

You'll get back from your coral and tank the time and detail you put into it. @92Miata gave great info.

The main thing I'm trying to impart is to not worry TOO much about dosing until you feel like you have you head wrapped around it properly.

Overdosing, or incorrect dosing is just as harmful as not dosing at all.

If you keep your parameters stable and at a consistent level and good level for reef health including coralline from the second you start your tank, you'll ultimate have the best success. It's not to late to start now either, but his main point is stability is king, and there are many other things in your water that consume Alk besides SPS he is right.

You shouldn't see huge flucutations in any elements within 1-2 days though of just a few LPS and Softies frags. but they will consume it for sure.

since you have an existing tank, with coral (You have a biocube yeah?) I'd suggest if you want to not do WC's, start your plan with this tank and try to get more knowledgeable about dosing on it.

Start with daily testing now, no WC's. Over the next 2 weeks you'll see a difference in the Alk, Cal and Mag. I wouldn't dose for the first 2 weeks, this will give you some time to see how much the tank is consuming on a daily or every other day basis.

After 2 weeks start dosing every day or every other day along with testing, see if you can get the parameters stable after a couple months of toying around and learning about dosing.

You should be able to get it pretty easily.

More or less

ALK, CAL, MAG goes down dose to adjust, if it goes too high (higher than it was on original test) you've dosed too much. There's a lag on this as well after dosing, so just test once a day.

You will get all your answers just doing something like this rather than trying to read about it everywhere.

There's a lot of information about dosing and the best thing you can do for yourself is browse the sticky threads in reef chemistry forum if you want to read more.

however, It's all a gradient scale. Don't try to overwhelm yourself all at once.

Once you have dialed in dosing you can drop testing to once a week or once a month. Up to you. At that point its more of a monitor.
----

also I'd use ATI instead of SeaChem to start btw. I don't like Seachem in general but just my own feelings. Both good beginner 2 part dosers.

There's no "perfect parameters" but rather ranges. (I only say this because the opinions differ so much on ideal numbers)

Do more study on Alk and the benefits of it in reefing etc, and decide for yourself what you want your alk, cal and mag to be at stably, get it to there and then work to keep it at that constantly, you'll be fine.

Makes sense. I never dosed in my last tank, and it did well.

This time around i want to do it right, and ive never dosed, so im looking for a long time plan so to speak. I picked seachem as i can get it locally in a pinch, and had a good amount of trace in it. I will start daily alk testing for sure, and then get me some stuff on hand when i make it to LFS this weekend. i rather start maintaining it via dosing if i can. Would you recommend hand dosing it per what they say in the calculator over my dosing pump at first?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Im really not chasing the SPS train to say. Im more into LPS, Clams, and such. I do want choice SPS, but mostly LPS, meats, acans, euphellia etc. I just dont know when to throw some reef fusion in my containers and program the pumps etc.

I told you: when alkalinity gets low.

 

[terraincognita]

Makes sense. I never dosed in my last tank, and it did well.

This time around i want to do it right, and ive never dosed, so im looking for a long time plan so to speak. I picked seachem as i can get it locally in a pinch, and had a good amount of trace in it. I will start daily alk testing for sure, and then get me some stuff on hand when i make it to LFS this weekend. i rather start maintaining it via dosing if i can. Would you recommend hand dosing it per what they say in the calculator over my dosing pump at first?

Up to you

Benefits of auto dosing is just it saves a LOT of time. Especially if you're dosing daily (Which is the best option) also you can spread out your daily doses automatically into smaller doses.

However it's again hard to say without already knowing how much your tank is consuming.

If you're tank is consuming 10ml worth a day of 2 part, you could set up your auto doser, but it's kind of over kill.

pretty easy to come up and dose 10ml of a 2 part. Also you'll be dosing exactly 10ML every time (Or at least as good as your eyes can let you)

With auto dosers every dose IMO will be a fraction off of the last dose, and you never get an "Exact dose" it'll be fractions of ML's off every time because of the system of how they work.

However it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things if you're dosing 50+ML a day.

In my 45 I'm dosing 35ML a day right now (70ML total of a 2 part). So I use an auto doser and spread it out over 5 doses. Because I don't like dosing 70ML at once.

Just options on what you prefer.

But thinking about it a little more, to start off Id suggest hand dosing yes until you figure out exactly how much.

Not sure how much time you've spent programming auto dosers. But It'd be a pain to adjust it daily .....

 

[southerntnreefer]

I think ill test it to see where it is before adding anything,. Make sure were in a good range to start and then monitor weekly to see if there is much consumption. Then ill go from there. Seachem has a calculator to tell me what i need to get back to where i need etc. What ill likely need help with is how to tell the dosing pump to do it. I know alk is best at night for PH boost. ( PH is running from 8.12 and 8.35 currently via apex,) Does that sound like a proper plan?

 

[southerntnreefer]

Up to you

Benefits of auto dosing is just it saves a LOT of time. Especially if you're dosing daily (Which is the best option) also you can spread out your daily doses automatically into smaller doses.

However it's again hard to say without already knowing how much your tank is consuming.

If you're tank is consuming 10ml worth a day of 2 part, you could set up your auto doser, but it's kind of over kill.

pretty easy to come up and dose 10ml of a 2 part. Also you'll be dosing exactly 10ML every time (Or at least as good as your eyes can let you)

With auto dosers every dose IMO will be a fraction off of the last dose, and you never get an "Exact dose" it'll be fractions of ML's off every time because of the system of how they work.

However it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things if you're dosing 50+ML a day.

In my 45 I'm dosing 35ML a day right now (70ML total of a 2 part). So I use an auto doser and spread it out over 5 doses. Because I don't like dosing 70ML at once.

Just options on what you prefer.

But thinking about it a little more, to start off Id suggest hand dosing yes until you figure out exactly how much.

Not sure how much time you've spent programming auto dosers. But It'd be a pain to adjust it daily .....

Ive never done it before, and its not a DOS, so it will likely be a bit more of a pita. I have some droppers i use to dose phyto each day that are 3 ML. so i can use those to hand dose 2 part as well as needed until i have a big enough draw i guess.

 

[RC Corals]

80 gallons total with display and sump. Jebao 4 head doser on hand, and a 3 part container ready to go. Im looking at Reef Fusion from Seachem for 2 part with trace dosing. Looking to get a few test frags after christmas. Running Standard Instant oceean for a lower alk mix than RC. WHen would you say id need to configure this doser? I dont mind doing it from day one, im just trying to figure out what i need to do. SHould i get the 3 or 4 test frags im after, test alk, call, mag phos during my weekly maint, then test alk each day for a week, and then dial it in? Etc?

Thoughts?

The answer to any reef related question starting with "When Should I"... usually should be answered with...

Not until the tank actually needs it. Proactive dosing, adding equipment, etc etc etc only masks and confuses the real cause of problems that may come up.

Notice something different or wrong and diagnose the issue and fix it.

 

[southerntnreefer]

The answer to any reef related question starting with "When Should I"... usually should be answered with...

Not until the tank actually needs it. Proactive dosing, adding equipment, etc etc etc only masks and confuses the real cause of problems that may come up.

Notice something different or wrong and diagnose the issue and fix it.

Makes sense. Just thinking long term. I also think ill need to make an appointment to drop all my money with you after Christmas for sure!

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Makes sense. Just thinking long term. I also think ill need to make an appointment to drop all my money with you after Christmas for sure!

When you want a test sps, let me know. I have a ton in the frag tank. You are 30 minutes from me lol. I would give you a few test frags lol. Just basic stags and such, but good for testing the waters.