Nitrates and Phosphates - Water Change %

  • Thread starter Thread starter taki123
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So some of my parameters are getting better now here’s the latest:

Alk - 11
Calcium - 480
Mag - 1230
Nitrate - 53
Phosphate - 2.2

My nitrates went from 101 down to 44 and then back up to 53ppm over last two days. Not sure why they are creeping up so quickly.

I’ve been carbon dosing for 2 months. I’m using a DIY NOPOX (60% Vinegar 40% Vodka) dosing 10ml on my 350L water.

Any idea what to do to keep my nitrates going down instead of up again? Should I change to Elimi NP rather than DIY carbon?

I do not think the nitrate is as concerning as the phosphate.
 
I do not think the nitrate is as concerning as the phosphate.
My phosphate is going down and I’m not so concerned about that at the minute. I’m confident that will keep going down. I’m using Rowaphos in a reactor to sort that.

But how do I control my nitrates? I did regular water changes to get it down and it just goes up my 10ppm daily. I’m hardly feeding any less I’d starve my fish and I’ve got a fleece filter and skimmer running too!
 
My phosphate is going down and I’m not so concerned about that at the minute. I’m confident that will keep going down. I’m using Rowaphos in a reactor to sort that.

But how do I control my nitrates? I did regular water changes to get it down and it just goes up my 10ppm daily. I’m hardly feeding any less I’d starve my fish and I’ve got a fleece filter and skimmer running too!

You are presently at the borderline of acceptable nitrate, IMO, and would not agonize over it, but if you want it lower, I'd use more organic carbon. Too much worry about high nutrients often has bad outcomes, IMO.

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/randy’s-thoughts-on-nutrient-target-ranges.1087/
4. What targets seem reasonable? Of course, that depends on all the other factors at play, such as types of corals, availability of ammonia, particulate foods, etc. However, for a mature mixed reef, this would be how I personally would run it:
  • Let nitrate float between 5 ppm and 50 ppm. I’d use gentle export in this range, such as growing macroalgae.
  • Above 50 ppm, I’d begin to focus more on reducing it, by organic carbon dosing, turf or macroalgae, etc.
  • Below 5 ppm, I’d begin to dose ammonia or feed more. The target level might drop lower if dosing ammonia, just like the heavy in/heavy out scenario where nitrate may not be as needed.
  • Let phosphate float between about 0.06 ppm and 0.3 ppm. This range is higher than I’ve recommended in the past. I’d use gentle export in this range, such as growing macroalgae.
  • Above about 0.3 ppm, I’d begin to focus more on reducing it, by turf or macroalgae, or a binder such as GFO or lanthanum (has its own risks to tangs). If a binder: GO SLOW. Turf and macroalgae will typically be slow enough.
  • Below 0.06 ppm, I’d begin to dose sodium phosphate or feed more to get the level up.
 
You are presently at the borderline of acceptable nitrate, IMO, and would not agonize over it, but if you want it lower, I'd use more organic carbon. Too much worry about high nutrients often has bad outcomes, IMO.

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/randy’s-thoughts-on-nutrient-target-ranges.1087/
4. What targets seem reasonable? Of course, that depends on all the other factors at play, such as types of corals, availability of ammonia, particulate foods, etc. However, for a mature mixed reef, this would be how I personally would run it:
  • Let nitrate float between 5 ppm and 50 ppm. I’d use gentle export in this range, such as growing macroalgae.
  • Above 50 ppm, I’d begin to focus more on reducing it, by organic carbon dosing, turf or macroalgae, etc.
  • Below 5 ppm, I’d begin to dose ammonia or feed more. The target level might drop lower if dosing ammonia, just like the heavy in/heavy out scenario where nitrate may not be as needed.
  • Let phosphate float between about 0.06 ppm and 0.3 ppm. This range is higher than I’ve recommended in the past. I’d use gentle export in this range, such as growing macroalgae.
  • Above about 0.3 ppm, I’d begin to focus more on reducing it, by turf or macroalgae, or a binder such as GFO or lanthanum (has its own risks to tangs). If a binder: GO SLOW. Turf and macroalgae will typically be slow enough.
  • Below 0.06 ppm, I’d begin to dose sodium phosphate or feed more to get the level up.
I’m only concerned because the nitrates are going up by 10ppm daily. Gone up 20ppm in 2 days to 53ppm.

I’m already carbon dosing 10ml of DIY NOPOX (60% vinegar 40% vodka) in 350ml water. Do you think I can increase this amount? Thought maybe that’s the max level I should go to.

Or should I consider using Elimi NP or Redsea Nopox?
 
I’m only concerned because the nitrates are going up by 10ppm daily. Gone up 20ppm in 2 days to 53ppm.

I’m already carbon dosing 10ml of DIY NOPOX (60% vinegar 40% vodka) in 350ml water. Do you think I can increase this amount? Thought maybe that’s the max level I should go to.

Or should I consider using Elimi NP or Redsea Nopox?

I don't have any reason to think those are better organic carbon sources for lowering nitrate.

A 10 ppm per day rise is a lot. I'd see if that value holds up. It's the difference between two numbers that have errors associated with measurement.

Increasing it seems fine.
 
I don't have any reason to think those are better organic carbon sources for lowering nitrate.

A 10 ppm per day rise is a lot. I'd see if that value holds up. It's the difference between two numbers that have errors associated with measurement.

Increasing it seems fine.
So good news is my nitrates started going down when I increased my dose to 12ml of my DIY Nopox

It’s decreasing by 5ppm daily atm so it’s come down from 53 to 34 in 4 days so far

If carbon dosing has started reducing nitrates finally then at what point do you reduce the dosing amount? And how much to reduce by etc?
 
So good news is my nitrates started going down when I increased my dose to 12ml of my DIY Nopox

It’s decreasing by 5ppm daily atm so it’s come down from 53 to 34 in 4 days so far

If carbon dosing has started reducing nitrates finally then at what point do you reduce the dosing amount? And how much to reduce by etc?

What is your target nitrate level?
 
In that case, I'd keep up the dose and assuming it continues to fall, drop the dose to half when you hit 15 -20 ppm.
 
In that case, I'd keep up the dose and assuming it continues to fall, drop the dose to half when you hit 15 -20 ppm.
So I have a problem! My nitrates starting going up again slightly but at the same time realised I have Cyano in my tank! Probably caused by the vodka?

What should I do?

Will the Cyano go away itself if I stop the vodka and nutrients improve?
 
So I have a problem! My nitrates starting going up again slightly but at the same time realised I have Cyano in my tank! Probably caused by the vodka?

What should I do?

Will the Cyano go away itself if I stop the vodka and nutrients improve?

Nitrate is what?

Organic carbon dosing can boost cyano, and I'd consider switching to vinegar, or stopping entirely.

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/randy’s-thoughts-on-nutrient-target-ranges.1087/
  • 4. What targets seem reasonable? Of course, that depends on all the other factors at play, such as types of corals, availability of ammonia, particulate foods, etc. However, for a mature mixed reef, this would be how I personally would run it:
    • Let nitrate float between 5 ppm and 50 ppm. I’d use gentle export in this range, such as growing macroalgae.
    • Above 50 ppm, I’d begin to focus more on reducing it, by organic carbon dosing, turf or macroalgae, etc.
    • Below 5 ppm, I’d begin to dose ammonia or feed more. The target level might drop lower if dosing ammonia, just like the heavy in/heavy out scenario where nitrate may not be as needed.
    • Let phosphate float between about 0.06 ppm and 0.3 ppm. This range is higher than I’ve recommended in the past. I’d use gentle export in this range, such as growing macroalgae.
    • Above about 0.3 ppm, I’d begin to focus more on reducing it, by turf or macroalgae, or a binder such as GFO or lanthanum (has its own risks to tangs). If a binder: GO SLOW. Turf and macroalgae will typically be slow enough.
    • Below 0.06 ppm, I’d begin to dose sodium phosphate or feed more to get the level up.
 
After catching up on this thread, I was wondering when the macroalgae was going to come up. I HIGHLY suggest a macroalgae like Randy has mentioned a couple of times. If you have a refugium, run some chaeto. If not, purchase an HOB one or get some "in tank" macroalgae.
 
So I have a problem! My nitrates starting going up again slightly but at the same time realised I have Cyano in my tank! Probably caused by the vodka?

What should I do?

Will the Cyano go away itself if I stop the vodka and nutrients improve?
Did your Phos bottom out?
 
Nitrate is what?

Organic carbon dosing can boost cyano, and I'd consider switching to vinegar, or stopping entirely.

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/randy’s-thoughts-on-nutrient-target-ranges.1087/
  • 4. What targets seem reasonable? Of course, that depends on all the other factors at play, such as types of corals, availability of ammonia, particulate foods, etc. However, for a mature mixed reef, this would be how I personally would run it:
    • Let nitrate float between 5 ppm and 50 ppm. I’d use gentle export in this range, such as growing macroalgae.
    • Above 50 ppm, I’d begin to focus more on reducing it, by organic carbon dosing, turf or macroalgae, etc.
    • Below 5 ppm, I’d begin to dose ammonia or feed more. The target level might drop lower if dosing ammonia, just like the heavy in/heavy out scenario where nitrate may not be as needed.
    • Let phosphate float between about 0.06 ppm and 0.3 ppm. This range is higher than I’ve recommended in the past. I’d use gentle export in this range, such as growing macroalgae.
    • Above about 0.3 ppm, I’d begin to focus more on reducing it, by turf or macroalgae, or a binder such as GFO or lanthanum (has its own risks to tangs). If a binder: GO SLOW. Turf and macroalgae will typically be slow enough.
    • Below 0.06 ppm, I’d begin to dose sodium phosphate or feed more to get the level up.
Thanks! So my nitrates are now at 30.6ppm.
Can I just stop immediately or slowly keep reducing?
After catching up on this thread, I was wondering when the macroalgae was going to come up. I HIGHLY suggest a macroalgae like Randy has mentioned a couple of times. If you have a refugium, run some chaeto. If not, purchase an HOB one or get some "in tank" macroalgae.
I’ve thought about this just 2 concerns around it.
1. I have a lack of space in my sump so not sure how to get around this
2. The hassle of constantly having to remove macroalgae as it grows etc.

I work a lot so ideally I want something more self sufficient . That’s why I was hoping carbon dosing would work

Did your Phos bottom out?
No they were at 0.75ppm yesterday night when I last measured
 
I’ve thought about this just 2 concerns around it.
1. I have a lack of space in my sump so not sure how to get around this
2. The hassle of constantly having to remove macroalgae as it grows etc.

I work a lot so ideally I want something more self sufficient . That’s why I was hoping carbon dosing would work
Lack of space could be an issue. Even if you have a little bit of space with a grow light, it will make a world of difference. As far as being low maintenance, it really is. You're not going to be removing or harvesting every day or every week. All you really have to do is just keep an eye on it and when it gets too big, pull some out.
 
Thanks! So my nitrates are now at 30.6ppm.
Can I just stop immediately or slowly keep reducing?

I'd just stop dead if cyano is substantial.
 
Lack of space could be an issue. Even if you have a little bit of space with a grow light, it will make a world of difference. As far as being low maintenance, it really is. You're not going to be removing or harvesting every day or every week. All you really have to do is just keep an eye on it and when it gets too big, pull some out.
Ok sounds good! What do you suggest is a nice cheap way of getting started. Like what kind of container could I use to avoid the chaeto flowing out into my return pump or so?

Also, would it be fine to have it put in the sumo section after the skimmer?
 
Ok sounds good! What do you suggest is a nice cheap way of getting started. Like what kind of container could I use to avoid the chaeto flowing out into my return pump or so?

Also, would it be fine to have it put in the sumo section after the skimmer?
Yes it is. I would wrap your return pump with filter floss to avoid that if you don't have a separate section in your sump. Or and HOB fuge.
 

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