NO3 Vs Acropora

[Garf]

the algae on the right looks healthier

Does, doesn’t it, that’s the 60 NO3, 1+ PO4. Honestly I think the other one is just producing more carotenoids, but only a guess.

 

[Reefahholic]

Why can’t this be achieved in the home aquarium?

I have a picture of a Vivid Confetti in a young dry rock tank that was suffering from low nutrients. Here’s how the coral tolerated.

 

[Reefahholic]

Does, doesn’t it, that’s the 60 NO3, 1+ PO4. Honestly I think the other one is just producing more carotenoids, but only a guess.

Could be. I don’t know enough about it. Very interesting and does kinda support higher NO3 makes colors darker. Or maybe it’s the PO4 in this case. Maybe both.

 

[Garf]

Could be. I don’t know enough about it. Very interesting and does kinda support higher NO3 makes colors darker. Or maybe it’s the PO4 in this case. Maybe both.

Low flow probably initiated the browning in the algae. I have no idea if there is a correlation with corals browning. I know some folks say it’s high nutrient, some say it low nutrient, some low light, well you get the drift. I have lots of flow.

 

[Garf]

I have a picture of a Vivid Confetti in a young dry rock tank that was suffering from low nutrients. Here’s how the coral tolerated.

Is that green boring algae in the skeleton? I thought that was indicative of high nutrient systems. Perhaps after living life in a nutrient soup then being transplanted into a watery desert, it decided enough was enough, and gave up the ghost.

 

[Reefahholic]

Low flow probably initiated the browning in the algae. I have no idea if there is a correlation with corals browning. I know some folks say it’s high nutrient, some say it low nutrient, some low light, well you get the drift. I have lots of flow.

For sure I’ve browned all my corals a while back in higher nutrients (PO4 more specifically). I was jumping by .05-.08 PO4 daily and I think the bigger swings did it. I believe I was up at like .46 ppm. NO3 was 18.4 ppm. Tank looked fantastic. I’m near positive that it was the higher PO4 level that made the tank look the way it did. Corals looked like crap, but had I gone slowly up to that level then maybe they would have held their colors. The tank was just too unstable at that time, and was trying to saturate after about a full year of binding PO4. There was zero algae on the glass or anywhere for several days compared to what it had been in the months prior at lower levels. The water was absolutely crystal clear the whole time at those higher levels. Although it does support Dr. Balling’s claims about lower NO3 levels. That ratio was under a 50:1. I’m not completely convinced yet, but I do think that maybe we could be over doing it a little on the nitrogen end. I had 14K Halides at the time of this pic, but I think they were off. The corals had browned pretty significantly, but it didn’t take them long to bounce back.

 

[Reefahholic]

Is that green boring algae in the skeleton? I thought that was indicative of high nutrient systems. Perhaps after living life in a nutrient soup then being transplanted into a watery desert, it decided enough was enough, and gave up the ghost.

No, here’s what’s funny about this pic and I’m glad you noticed that.

I was dosing PO4 to try and keep it above .03 ppm, but also feeding heavy and dosing Spirulina powder frantically. I could see the tissue was dry and knew what was coming. Sadly I wasn’t fast enough. The green that you see in the skeleton was from all the Spirulina power I was pumping into the corals try to save them. :-) As you can see in the data…despite my efforts it wasn’t enough to increase the levels. At that point I didn’t have my GHL online and TSP just wasn’t bioavailable enough to sustain that coral. Surprisingly, even in these horrible conditions I only lost two corals during that time because I did get my pump online shortly after that and also changed to a better Phosphate source that was a game changer. The other coral that I lost was a beautiful DR Smurfette Millie. Here’s the mother colony below. Sadly I didn’t have a backup. I will get another one later.

 

[djf91]

I have a picture of a Vivid Confetti in a young dry rock tank that was suffering from low nutrients. Here’s how the coral tolerated.

That’s not surprising in a young, dry rock started tank.

 

[Reefahholic]

I have always used urea because it is a non-toxic form of ammonia. There seem to be some other reduced nitrogen compounds, some amino acids, that give an even better effect, at least in combination.

Any guidance on a recommended product and starting dose per 100/G total volume. I’d like to try it to see how the corals react. Is it harder to dose than NaNO3?

 

[Reefahholic]

@Hans-Werner this was a good stream about Nitrogen and Phosphorus levels and ratios.

Go to 39:00

https://www.youtube.com/live/2M6T9XpofgE?feature=share

 

[Dr. Jim]

x

 

[Pod_01]

Maybe useful,
March 15/23

April1/23

The numbers have been hovering at these levels for past 4 months. The tank is actually recovering, by accident it was turned into fresh water tank.

Here is sample of how bad some SPS got and some made:

Tank is still in recovery and who knows where the nutrients values end up. I don’t try to control them. Corals look happy at the moment so I do nothing.

 

[Reefahholic]

Maybe useful,
March 15/23

April1/23

The numbers have been hovering at these levels for past 4 months. The tank is actually recovering, by accident it was turned into fresh water tank.

Here is sample of how bad some SPS got and some made:

Tank is still in recovery and who knows where the nutrients values end up. I don’t try to control them. Corals look happy at the moment so I do nothing.

Very useful indeed. I’m taking mine down a bit now to play around for a while. Thank you for the data!

 

[AJsReef]

Anecdotal now as I don’t have pictures, I have no doubt I’ve killed more sticks due to low nutrients namely Phosphate than anything else.

Rebooted my tank last year. Since NO3 has been stable at 15-20 and Phosphate .02-.05. Sticks appear much happier. Visual color is beyond what I’ve had previously.

That said, I have a heck of a time keeping PO4 in my system. I’m currently dosing somewhere in the range of .15ppm a day and still flat at .02. I’d like to get up to .08-.1.

 

[Pod_01]

Anecdotal now as I don’t have pictures, I have no doubt I’ve killed more sticks due to low nutrients namely Phosphate than anything else.

Rebooted my tank last year. Since NO3 has been stable at 15-20 and Phosphate .02-.05. Sticks appear much happier. Visual color is beyond what I’ve had previously.

That said, I have a heck of a time keeping PO4 in my system. I’m currently dosing somewhere in the range of .15ppm a day and still flat at .02. I’d like to get up to .8-.1.

Just to add my anecdotal observation. It is not just low Phosphate but low and sinking Phosphate. For example going from it 0.05 to 0.02 has been bad for the sticks, on the other hand going from 0.02 to let say 0.1 has been ok.
Also fluctuating phosphate in the 0.2-0.5 range my sticks seem to tolerate well.

 

[AJsReef]

Just to add my anecdotal observation. It is not just low Phosphate but low and sinking Phosphate. For example going from it 0.05 to 0.02 has been bad for the sticks, on the other hand going from 0.02 to let say 0.1 has been ok.
Also fluctuating phosphate in the 0.2-0.5 range my sticks seem to tolerate well.

Agreed, I’ve dosed pretty heavy in the past to try and increase without I’ll effect.

Sub .02 is generally where I see pale colors and general “unhappiness”.

What’s particularly interesting to me is the influence increased pH has on PO4 levels which I attribute to increased calcification. When I travel my high end pH jumps from 8.35ish to 8.6 and low end stays 8.3+. My PO4 drops significantly when I travel as well, often times I have to increase the dose 2-3x.

See PO4 results for this most recent week. To say it makes me nervous being away is an understatement

 

[Reefahholic]

I have no doubt I’ve killed more sticks due to low nutrients namely Phosphate than anything else.

No doubt. PO4 is IMO in the top two killers of Acro’s. The other being swings.

That said, I have a heck of a time keeping PO4 in my system. I’m currently dosing somewhere in the range of .15ppm a day and still flat at .02. I’d like to get up to .8-.1.

What are you dosing. PM me I can help you with that.

When I travel my high end pH jumps from 8.35ish to 8.6 and low end stays 8.3+. My PO4 drops significantly when I travel as well, often times I have to increase the dose 2-3x.

Not being home breathing out exhaled CO2 and zero tinkering with the tank does wonders. There is something to be said about not touching a tank at all in any way. :-)

 

[Reefahholic]

Well, after going as low as 14:1 over several weeks I observed this system doesn’t like it much. I see better results and less algae at 50:1-100:1

 

[ryshark]

Well, after going as low as 14:1 over several weeks I observed this system doesn’t like it much. I see better results and less algae at 50:1-100:1

It’s funny how much less algae there seems to be at the higher ratio. I’ve experienced the same.

 

[Pod_01]

Well, after going as low as 14:1 over several weeks I observed this system doesn’t like it much. I see better results and less algae at 50:1-100:1

Out of curiosity what algae did show up?
There are so many different types, green powder on panes, other type on back wall, ones on rocks etc….
Just recently I had the green powder show up on glass and it disappeared as quickly. Still scratching my head, I swear I did nothing!!!