Palytoxin

[torchreefer]

I kind of wonder how many cases of suspected palytoxin poisoning are actually just psychosomatic symptoms from an anxiety attack. Kinda like cops with fentanyl. Though at least with palytoxin there are a lot of genuine symptomatic overlaps between anxiety attacks and palytoxin poisoning, except fever I guess.

I would agree. I think anxiety starts the process. Especially if you experience for days

 

[VintageReefer]

Don't forget mechanical agitation like waterfalls, splashing, and skimmer...

Hah! We disagree again!

I am still correct! Those methods do not make a liquid an aerosol! That would be inhaling a liquid, similar to drowning, and I think it goes without saying not to inhale your tank water, and if someone did by mistake, they would be aware they snorted up some saltwater

Blue light rules #1

 

[BeanAnimal]

What is defined as sick in your prior experience? Is it possible it’s coincidental

Yep - I Just imagine it - Munchausen due to palythoa being in my tank.

Silly question.. silly answer :face-with-rolling-eyes:

To make a liquid an aerosol it typically would need to be baked, boiled or vaporized in some way

Was that mean to be rhetorical?

"vaporized on some way" - or "aerosolized" was exactly the point.

You are typically more level headed than this. Has your account been taken over by your neighbor? :grimacing-face:
I think you and others may be conflating the process with boiling or heat -- nothing could be further from the truth.

Surface agitation can (and does) create tiny droplets (aerosol) around the tank. Splashing (of any kind) does as well. So surface movement, water flowing over the overflow, down the standpipes, bubbles in the sump, the skimmer, etc. Those bubble pop, right?

Evaporation - many compounds can be transported in this process. Is palytoxin one of them? That I do not know.

But palytoxin is a an extremely potent substance that does not require large quantities to cause harm, and it’s possible for small amounts to become airborne through any of these mechanisms.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Hah! We disagree again!

I am still correct! Those methods do not make a liquid an aerosol! That would be inhaling a liquid, similar to drowning, and I think it goes without saying not to inhale your tank water, and if someone did by mistake, they would be aware they snorted up some saltwater

Blue light rules #1

I am sorry - but you way off base here.

 

[Reefering1]

Hah! We disagree again!

I am still correct! Those methods do not make a liquid an aerosol! That would be inhaling a liquid, similar to drowning, and I think it goes without saying not to inhale your tank water, and if someone did by mistake, they would be aware they snorted up some saltwater

Blue light rules #1

Ha, Maybe another time!
So. ., is the water not aeresolized by the surf on a beach?

 

[BeanAnimal]

I kind of wonder how many cases of suspected palytoxin poisoning are actually just psychosomatic symptoms from an anxiety attack. Kinda like cops with fentanyl. Though at least with palytoxin there are a lot of genuine symptomatic overlaps between anxiety attacks and palytoxin poisoning, except fever I guess.

I suggest doing some actual research instead of assuming that many cases are some kind of misplaced panic.

How many actual cases of mild to moderate sickness are NOT reported to a doctor or others and mistaken as something else? How many severe cases are not recognized by the attending Dr. because the source is not known and not tested for?

 

[Reefering1]

they would be aware they snorted up some saltwater

And we have had members "accidentally" snort Hanna reagents.... so, you never know

 

[timmyrules]

This thread seems to be getting a bit heated…needless to say op, if you have palys, just take precautions, use common sense, and be careful.

 

[BeanAnimal]

And we have had members "accidentally" snort Hanna reagents.... so, you never know

I guess that beats experimentally...

 

[Reefering1]

Blue light almost hides poor maintenance.

Lol. Fixed it for you.
You'll come around.

 

[Reefering1]

This thread seems to be getting a bit heated…needless to say op, if you have palys, just take precautions, use common sense, and be careful.

Not yet. Everybody barely shared their opinions, let alone respond.

 

[VintageReefer]

I keep 3 palythoa colonies in my tank including a 10” round grandis colony amd
I am not concerned in the least. I work in my tank bare handed, and give my hands a quick rinse when I’m done

Grandis

Palys 2

Palys 3

I lifted paly colony 3 (above ^ ) a few weeks ago, removed it from tank. Redid rock work and put it back. Zero issues

 

[Reefering1]

Evidence of said mechanical aerosolization...(zoom in on yellow circle)

 

[VintageReefer]

Lol. Fixed it for you.
Poorly planned tanks need maintenance

There we go, guess you forgot, my tank is virtually maintenance free! I have nothing to hide, my tank is cleaner than tanks 1/4 it’s age with 5x the maintenance!

 

[vetteguy53081]

Palytoxins often are a result of mishandling. Most aquarium-related cases occur as a result of skin exposure after prolonged handling through cuts on hands or inhalation of coral dust, steam vapors or water droplets and aerosols while cleaning, separating, growing/propagating, collecting, transporting mechanically removing or eradicating over-growing corals by pouring boiling water on live rock as well as cleaning home marine aquariums.

Some symptoms of Pox and zoa poisoning are:

• Flu-like symptoms – Chills, Fever, Headaches, Cough, Sore Throat, Chest Pains, Muscle Aches
• Rash, Itching, Numbness in Affected Area
• Trouble Breathing, Shortness of Breath, Runny Nose, Wheezing
• Dizziness, Blurred Vision, Fatigue, Irregular Heart Beat
• Possible Foul Smell or Bitter/Metallic Taste in Mouth

 

[Reefering1]

There we go, guess you forgot, my tank is virtually maintenance free! I have nothing to hide, my tank is cleaner than tanks 1/4 it’s age with 5x the maintenance!

Sure, but the other 95% of blue lighters are hiding something. The other 5% just reeeallly like "avatar". :p

 

[VintageReefer]

Evidence of said mechanical aerosolization...(zoom in on yellow circle)

Are you reefering1 to salt creep? Which would be from splashes and spills, then evaporation?

A non issue. Nobody is working around their tank long enough to breath in evaporation. You would need to contain yourself in a hood around the tank and stay there for hours as you irritate and slice palythoa

 

[VintageReefer]

Sure, but the other 95% of blue lighters are hiding something. The other 5% just reeeallly like "avatar". :p

I am not my brothers keeper

 

[VintageReefer]

Honestly here’s the risk. What Vette guy said

And since most people aren’t cooking paly rocks in an oven or boiling pot, the real risk is from…fragging or attempting to scrape them off rocks, causing skin exposure, then subconsciously rubbing your eye, handling food, or having an open cut or scrape

 

[Reefering1]

Are you reefering1 to salt creep? Which would be from splashes and spills, then evaporation?

A non issue. Nobody is working around their tank long enough to breath in evaporation. You would need to contain yourself in a hood around the tank and stay there for hours as you irritate and slice palythoa

I don't disagree, with that, but the point is that it is aeresolized..