Please Help - Slowly receding and unhappy corals

[mikeytrw]

Hi Mike, Sorry you’re going through this. I appreciate some of the varied possible problems and solutions on this post. Thinking outside the box has sometimes produced results. Here’s one that hasn’t been touched on as yet. Do you periodically have home maintenance people: maids, bugs guys, interior home construction, wife, kids, you etc. spraying toxic chemicals around or near the tank? Quick example: A family had a home, a 45 or so gallon tank. Two 7+ years old large Percula clowns. Their new English Sheepdog puppy decided to use the rug in the aquarium room as a toilet. The owners got a cleaning crew in to both clean up the rug and spray the room. The very next day the two clowns were dead. They had a skimmer on their tank which I’m sure accelerated the problem, bringing more toxic air into the tank. Fish and corals are in my experience pretty tough, resilient creatures but in a small confined glass box we have to be careful of the air that they breathe or what lands on the water’s surface. Again consider everything that is being sprayed around your tank. Good luck.

Thanks,

This was a concern from the beginning, and I have honestly racked my brains trying to think of anything that could be a factor. Before I even set up my tank I'd watch every BRS TV beginner video going and one of those talked about how aerosols were a big no no so I made sure to let my wife know in case there was a big wasp or something and she got the fly killer out. But even spray polishes we replaced with tinned wax for this very reason.

 

[mikeytrw]

Sounds good but Dino’s could indicate a less than desireable amount of biodiversity. You might also consider adding some fresh live rock for more biodiversity. I also agree that they seem to be allelopathic to some degree, chemically impacting corals.

Yep you're absolutely correct. I'm really disappointed to have dinos....again....they very much could be what's causing this problem and in fact, I'm thinking seem the most likely cause as I've poked at just about everything else. A big water change and running UV should eliminate most issues, assuming that theres not a contaminant source in the tank somewhere.

I've already ordered the last things needed to deal with both swimming and non swimming dinos (waterglass + Si test kits, and a monster silly sized UV respectively) I just can't set it up till I get back from a work trip on Thursday. But it will be set up, and the dinos will die.

With regards to diversity, that's not an easy problem to solve. I dose AF Life Source Fiji Mud periodically, bought some mature rock from two different LFS (which brough fun pest problems as well lol)

 

[MartinM]

The “joys” of reefing, huh? Let’s hope the Dino problem cause of the corals to bounce back, keep us updated.

 

[mikeytrw]

UPDATE:

I have ICP Test results here: Triton ICP the test sample was taken before a 40% water change.

As you can see, there's nothing untoward in the test results so I'm again super stumped and dissapointed. I'll try another big water change and get the UV installed this week in case it's the dinos being toxic.

 

[mikeytrw]

Bump!

Please can anyone help me here? My Biggest torch is now starting to show skeleton.

I really don't know what to do here, my parameters are in line, I've done a big water change, I've an ICP test which shows no metal contamination.

Other than some dinos on the sandbed - could they really be what's killing everything?

I've poured my heart and soul into this tank I cannot begin to say how hard this is.

 

[thatmanMIKEson]

I read most of this

have you ruled out stray voltage?

why aren't you using your skimmer! Just make it collect dry to not to strip your water , a skimmer is good for gas exchange.

What is your temperature fluctuation for the day/week?

How many hours of light and intensity?

What salinity are you at and does that stay steady, how?

All those basic corals need basic stability, light temp and salinity. If everything is doing bad at once that's pointing at a whole system issue. If it's not contamination of some metal or poison or overdosed chemicals. It points at a stability or maturity issue , the tanks looks old enough to keep zoas alive so it doesn't make a lot of sense, and I've had tons of sps/lps survive dinos so it's not necessarily that, but it definitely could be, I'd say really look good through your system and try to figure out how you can eliminate possible issues so you know what it's not.

How about 1000 pictures of your entire system ,even down to how you make water, pictures are 1000 words thing, maybe some one will notice something.

 

[mikeytrw]

I read most of this

have you ruled out stray voltage?

why aren't you using your skimmer! Just make it collect dry to not to strip your water , a skimmer is good for gas exchange.

What is your temperature fluctuation for the day/week?

How many hours of light and intensity?

What salinity are you at and does that stay steady, how?

All those basic corals need basic stability, light temp and salinity. If everything is doing bad at once that's pointing at a whole system issue. If it's not contamination of some metal or poison or overdosed chemicals. It points at a stability or maturity issue , the tanks looks old enough to keep zoas alive so it doesn't make a lot of sense, and I've had tons of sps/lps survive dinos so it's not necessarily that, but it definitely could be, I'd say really look good through your system and try to figure out how you can eliminate possible issues so you know what it's not.

How about 1000 pictures of your entire system ,even down to how you make water, pictures are 1000 words thing, maybe some one will notice something.

Thank you!

OK, so first - I have just checked stray voltage with a multi meter against ground - 0v potential in either AC or DC. I would have been surprised as I have the whole setup on an RCD.

However, since that last post we do have an update, although not a good one. My torch had BJD and has since died. I removed it from the tank, took a sample of the brown slime among its tissue and inspected under microscope - very much looks like other examples of BJD.

I am trying to source ciprofloxacin, but in the UK it's actually really hard to get hold of. I'm waiting for a call back on Monday from a vet that specialises in 'exotics' as all other vets only prescribe for furry things.

I will start photographing everything and will post my setup soon.

Thanks again, really appreciate the help. One thing I'm certain of is I'm sure everyone here can appreciate the stress an unwell tank can cause!

 

[Cichlid Dad]

Are you adding trace elements and amino acids? Are you doing frequent water changes or just adding cal alk and mag to keep numbers

 

[ninjamyst]

Do nothing but keep up maintenance and feed your corals more. It happens. All your parameters are spot on but something could have triggered stress in your tank but that something is now gone. Instead of making more drastic changes, do your regular maintenance and feed more if you are having dino.

 

[mikeytrw]

Are you adding trace elements and amino acids? Are you doing frequent water changes or just adding cal alk and mag to keep numbers

not adding trace elements, I do 10% weekly water changes. I use ATM alka haul to manage alk and calc and manually dose mag every week or so.

 

[Cichlid Dad]

I hope more experienced reefers will way in on this but that may be the issue.

 

[mikeytrw]

I hope more experienced reefers will way in on this but that may be the issue.

Surely the ICP test (link above to publicly available results) would show that?

 

[Cichlid Dad]

I just know One of the biggest issues are not adding back all of the things your coral is up taking it's like for us just eating only candy or McDonald's.slowly we are die for lack of proper nutrition.

 

[Cichlid Dad]

I do 20 percent water changes every two weeks and add trace elements amino acids and proper vitamins back into the reef . All for reef is a good all in one product

 

[Cichlid Dad]

All for one sorry

 

[jimk60]

@ReefdUp is an expert in Coral recovery. Maybe she can help.

 

[thatmanMIKEson]

Every system is different for 100ppl that do the weekly maintenance 100 don't and do just fine

 

[Shirak]

Thank you!

OK, so first - I have just checked stray voltage with a multi meter against ground - 0v potential in either AC or DC. I would have been surprised as I have the whole setup on an RCD.

However, since that last post we do have an update, although not a good one. My torch had BJD and has since died. I removed it from the tank, took a sample of the brown slime among its tissue and inspected under microscope - very much looks like other examples of BJD.

I am trying to source ciprofloxacin, but in the UK it's actually really hard to get hold of. I'm waiting for a call back on Monday from a vet that specialises in 'exotics' as all other vets only prescribe for furry things.

I will start photographing everything and will post my setup soon.

Thanks again, really appreciate the help. One thing I'm certain of is I'm sure everyone here can appreciate the stress an unwell tank can cause!

Photos would be helpful
but you have never answered any of the questions I posted last.

33.7ppt salinity is low
What are your par readings? Slowly receding corals says to me they are slowly starving and if nutrients and water parameters are good then probably a light level issue. Your low salinity though will stress the corals and hinder calcification so that could be part of it.

 

[Shirak]

Photos would be helpful
but you have never answered any of the questions I posted last.

33.7ppt salinity is low
What are your par readings? Slowly receding corals says to me they are slowly starving and if nutrients and water parameters are good then probably a light level issue. Your low salinity though will stress the corals and hinder calcification so that could be part of it.

You also mention in your first post NO3 fluctuates between 2-6ppm This is low. Later on you say feeding mysis and lobster eggs once a week or so? How often and how much are you feeding? The corals could simply be starving to death. LPS can get what they need from the water but I think your nutrient levels in the water alone are too low for them to sustain themselves. Mine have always done better when they can catch food 2-3 times a week. How many fish do you have? Maybe you need more fish so you can increase daily feeding? There will be more particle food for the corals to catch that way. If you don't want to go that route then you can try target feeding the LPS 2-3 times a week. The chopped mysis is very good. I take the frozen cube and slice it up fine with a pairing knife so the mysis pieces are all smaller. With the pumps off, use a pipette and squirt some at the various corals.

 

[mikeytrw]

Thanks for the replies guys - I'm a little later than I'd like in responding because I've got covid...hopefully feel better tomorrow and can take some photos and answer further questions.