Resurrection/Reviving of Dying/Dead SPS?

[ErehwoN]

I freely admit and accept that I may have stepped into SPS too soon. The short of it is I may have damaged a couple of frags during handling and/or their needs are not being met.

My parameters are good except my nitrates which are running between 5-10PPM. I'm actively working on this with 25% water changes and watching my feeding habits. However, I took the skimmer offline yesterday as I epoxied some frags yesterday. Additionally, I have Chaeto with pods in my fuge although the Chaeto hasn't taken off yet.

The frags I'm worried about are almost entirely brown which leads me to believe that poor lighting is probably the primary issue.

However, there might be a few polyps that have survived.

I've already repositioned them to give them better access to lighting and adjusted my lights to a higher intensity. I've got some Reef-Roids on the way for direct feeding.

Any suggestions in the form of constructive criticism would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Jim

 

[dadnjesse]

Sps don't need direct feeding, if you have fish feed the fish and the coral can live off their waste. Reef Roids are going to increase your phosphates.

 

[92Miata]

5-10 ppm nitrate is absolutely not a problem. You're doing more harm than good trying to get it lower.

What is your alkalinity? How much alkalinity drop over a week do you have?

What are your actual parameters?

 

[ErehwoN]

Parameters yesterday morning:
Temp: 76.3
pH: 8.2
Ammonia 0.25
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 10
SG: 1.023
Alkalinity: 11.0
Calcium: 500
Magnesium: 1580 (a bit elevated from normal)

Alkalinity dropped .5 last week but remained steady the prior week. These frags are only 2 weeks in my tank.

Jim

 

[Bacon505]

Corals take time to adjust to new environment so give it time. Coral shown are very hardy so they are goos start out corals. Base on the look of your rocks, your tank is still young?

 

[92Miata]

I'm going to assume the tank has been up for more than a couple weeks - and you're using API or simar for ammonia. Their tests are junk one the low range. Your ammonia should be 0. If you've got fish that seem ok, the test is wrong.


How are you testing salinity, and what are you dosing? I ask because it's highly improbable that Ca, mag, and alk are all that high with salinity being that low.

 

[Tahoe61]

Hi Jim,

It is my opinion that you should strive for parameters/values more in line with normal salt water.
If your dosing I would stop for now.
If your saltmix is mixing at those higher values I would switch to IO or Tropic Marine.
Shoot for alk 7.5-8, ca 350-400 and mag 1350.

 

[Bacon505]

I'm going to assume the tank has been up for more than a couple weeks - and you're using API or simar for ammonia. Their tests are junk one the low range. Your ammonia should be 0. If you've got fish that seem ok, the test is wrong.


How are you testing salinity, and what are you dosing? I ask because it's highly improbable that Ca, mag, and alk are all that high with salinity being that low.

Not neccesaary true. I been using API test kits since day one of my reefing hobby. They might not be precise but still close to range to give you an idea of the numbers.
Chasing numbers wont do any good. All thay matters is the health of the inhabitant

 

[ErehwoN]

Thanks for the replies so far. More info and hopefully answering the questions asked above:

The tank has been cycled and fish added on June 3. Corals came July 14, a few weeks later.

Fish seem okay and yes, API test for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH. This kit is almost empty so I'm moving away from the API. (recommendations??) Other parameters are tested using Red Sea kit.

I'm using Instant Ocean Reef Crystals.

No dosing--I have the Red Sea ABC but haven't had to use them.

I'm hoping yesterday was the last "big invasion" day as I got in the tank to epoxy the corals where necessary. I'll be turning on the skimmer again this afternoon.

My plan going forward is to get parameters all where they should be including lighting and keep them there and monitor what happens.

I have 2 ocellaris clownfish, 2 kaudern's cardinalfish, 2 black axil chromis, 1 coral beauty angel and 1 bicolor blenny.

I have 5 various soft coral and now 6 SPS.

Jim

 

[Bacon505]

Your tank will continue to have swings and changes for the next several months. You should stop buying sps for now. They wont grow and good chance that they dont survive. Your tank is really young so give it time to mature. You want to have a good diversity of bacteria which develop as tank age. API test kit is fine if you’re on the budget side. The main focus at this stage is nutrient and algae control. Algae hasnt set in yet since the tank is young but once it does, it could be a pain.

 

[ErehwoN]

Your tank will continue to have swings and changes for the next several months. You should stop buying sps for now. They wont grow and good chance that they dont survive. Your tank is really young so give it time to mature. You want to have a good diversity of bacteria which develop as tank age. API test kit is fine if you’re on the budget side. The main focus at this stage is nutrient and algae control. Algae hasnt set in yet since the tank is young but once it does, it could be a pain.

Oh, I already had an algae problem. This pic is dated 5/29, just a few days before the fish arrived:

The blenny and the angel took care of it!

Jim

 

[Bacon505]

The diatom phase is normal, im talking about hair algae and briopsis. Those come after if you dont keep nutrient in control

 

[Bacon505]

Just take it slow and enjoy the growth process, its the best part in this hobby. Nothing good come fast in this hobby. Everyone will have different opinion in this hobby that works for them but take it as a grain of salt. Each tank is their own. As long as you understand the principles and foundation of a reef tank, you’ll be alright.

 

[ErehwoN]

The diatom phase is normal, im talking about hair algae and briopsis. Those come after if you dont keep nutrient in control

Thanks for the clarification. I feel like I'm still a major noob and I know I'm probably not following the path with the greatest chance of success. Too impulsive I am!

And no more coral purchases unless I win one of these contests. I know I'm in either over my head or close to it and I need to pause. Otherwise I'll be broke and, worse, sorely discouraged. I've come too far to quit. I may lose a few frags but in the long run it's gonna be awesome! And I'm not yet calling these dead. Call me an optimist.

Jim

 

[92Miata]

Not neccesaary true. I been using API test kits since day one of my reefing hobby. They might not be precise but still close to range to give you an idea of the numbers.
Chasing numbers wont do any good. All thay matters is the health of the inhabitant

The API ammonia test giving a false .25 ammonia reading is a known, common, and repeatable issue.

OP, Reef Crystals mixes really high - it's a fine salt, but you have to be careful with it - and unless you're really bang on with your salinity, big water changes are dangerous. You mix rc up to 1.028 accidentally and your pouring a whole lot of 15-18dkh water into your tank, and that can stress the heck out of corals.

Stop doing big water changes for a while. They're more risk than theyre worth. (I basically siphon out a gallon or so of water - concentrating on any place detritus settles - every couple of days - many small water changes. Takes about 2 minutes)

I've had Acropora in my current reef tank since week 2 - they did fine (and are encrusting and coloring up). I don't believe that new tanks can't keep SPS - it's nonsense. What I believe is that new reefers shouldn't keep SPS for a bit - but we're too late for that now - so advice of "it's a new tank, they'll probably die" is both dismissive and not helpful.

You are where you are now - and you need to learn how to take care of these things - not be told how you should have done things.

You need to calibrate whatever you're using to test salinity. You need to let that alk (and everything else) drop down to about 8 (and for a while, you want to test alk daily). You need lots of water movement. You shouldn't be dosing anything if you're not testing for it.


I'm going to read through your build thread - see if there's anything that sticks out to me.

 

[chipmunkofdoom2]

As long as there are polyps left, the coral can come back. I had an acro frag that arrived with pretty drab color and went downhill over a long period of time. At a certain point, it was literally only 5 polyps remaining. I debated throwing it into the sump and calling it a loss. I'm glad I didn't though. I moved a year ago and made some changes to the tank, and this coral is doing really well now. I wish I would have taken a picture of it at its worst.

Here's the original coral in 2017 (labeled as "Wildberry"):

Here's the coral after I transplanted it to a frag tile in 06/2020:

Here's the same coral today. It's starting to encrust the tile and it's sprouting some really beautiful new green branches with blue tips:

 

[ErehwoN]

The API ammonia test giving a false .25 ammonia reading is a known, common, and repeatable issue.

OP, Reef Crystals mixes really high - it's a fine salt, but you have to be careful with it - and unless you're really bang on with your salinity, big water changes are dangerous. You mix rc up to 1.028 accidentally and your pouring a whole lot of 15-18dkh water into your tank, and that can stress the heck out of corals.

Stop doing big water changes for a while. They're more risk than theyre worth. (I basically siphon out a gallon or so of water - concentrating on any place detritus settles - every couple of days - many small water changes. Takes about 2 minutes)

I've had Acropora in my current reef tank since week 2 - they did fine (and are encrusting and coloring up). I don't believe that new tanks can't keep SPS - it's nonsense. What I believe is that new reefers shouldn't keep SPS for a bit - but we're too late for that now - so advice of "it's a new tank, they'll probably die" is both dismissive and not helpful.

You are where you are now - and you need to learn how to take care of these things - not be told how you should have done things.

You need to calibrate whatever you're using to test salinity. You need to let that alk (and everything else) drop down to about 8 (and for a while, you want to test alk daily). You need lots of water movement. You shouldn't be dosing anything if you're not testing for it.


I'm going to read through your build thread - see if there's anything that sticks out to me.

Thank you for a very positive, constructive post. I'm using a refractometer that was new in March. I did check the calibration with RODI water and it's accurate AFAICT. And you're right--I noticed that alk would get very high with the RC salt if I wasn't careful. However, over the last couple of months I've gotten spot on with the refractometer and am able to properly mix so that the end product in the tank is at 1.023. The variance over the last couple of months has been 1.023 to 1.025, with 1.023-1.024 being consistent over the last month.

With regard to water movement, I'm interested in this topic as a corner tank presents some interesting challenges. If you've seen my build thread you'll see the return pump and overflow are in the 90 degree corner. I have the return pointed to follow the one leg of the triangle and hopefully circle around to the overflow. The softies are happy and sway back and forth, even at the bottom of the tank.

I have two wave pumps in the corner below the return and overflow. Each is pointed along the straight edges but I'm not sure what the best flow is for this style of tank.

Jim

 

[MightyMO]

Did you per chance acclimate the corals to your lighting???

 

[ErehwoN]

Did you per chance acclimate the corals to your lighting???

I'm not sure I understand this question. I followed the instructions from LiveAquaria using the Floating Method. I am not aware of lighting acclimation.

Jim

 

[Gernader]

API test kits are definitely not accurate (especially ammonia) compared to other test kits. I would rather use Red Sea, Salifert, or Hanna.

What kind of lights are you using? I’m thinking they may be underpowered. For salinity, I recommend you to slowly raise up to 1.025 to 1.026 for corals.