Royal Gramma

[Angus1989]

Hi,
Seeking some help with diagnosing issues with my Royal Gramma.

Tank is a Waterbox Peninsula Mini 25 AIO with some zoas, leather, torch, GSP. Lighting is Noopsyche K7 mini. Been established since March 23 and had a crash in October when I was away and lost a scooter dragonette but no fish or corals. Tank has two clowns, flame hawkfish and Royal Gramma. CUC is three trochus, one gold ring cowrie, one Qld Strohmb and two WA Strohmb. Diet wise, I feed frozen mysis and brine twice a day. Reef roids gets dropped in twice a week. Clowns eat pellets before each feeding daily, nobody else touches the pellets.

Water parameters attached as picture but all stable post October crash.

Yesterday afternoon my typically recluse Royal Gramma was sitting on the sandbed at 45° angle. A little bit of scratching on sand but not pronounced. It wasn't eating and was not disturbed by people's hands near the glass which it usually would dart away from. It is now 12hrs later and it's hanging at the top of my tank doing similar.

It is usually bullied by my flame hawkfish, hence bits of tail missing. No other fish are acting weird.

I started dosing reef revolution amino blast two days ago, that's the only new stuff I've added to tank. I got rid of a spaghetti worm yesterday which was near the Gramma's normal cave but only on two goes so unsure if it got irritated by the worm.

Thanks for the help.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi,
Seeking some help with diagnosing issues with my Royal Gramma.

Tank is a Waterbox Peninsula Mini 25 AIO with some zoas, leather, torch, GSP. Lighting is Noopsyche K7 mini. Been established since March 23 and had a crash in October when I was away and lost a scooter dragonette but no fish or corals. Tank has two clowns, flame hawkfish and Royal Gramma. CUC is three trochus, one gold ring cowrie, one Qld Strohmb and two WA Strohmb. Diet wise, I feed frozen mysis and brine twice a day. Reef roids gets dropped in twice a week. Clowns eat pellets before each feeding daily, nobody else touches the pellets.

Water parameters attached as picture but all stable post October crash.

Yesterday afternoon my typically recluse Royal Gramma was sitting on the sandbed at 45° angle. A little bit of scratching on sand but not pronounced. It wasn't eating and was not disturbed by people's hands near the glass which it usually would dart away from. It is now 12hrs later and it's hanging at the top of my tank doing similar.

It is usually bullied by my flame hawkfish, hence bits of tail missing. No other fish are acting weird.

I started dosing reef revolution amino blast two days ago, that's the only new stuff I've added to tank. I got rid of a spaghetti worm yesterday which was near the Gramma's normal cave but only on two goes so unsure if it got irritated by the worm.

Thanks for the help.

The rough skin texture suggests the fish has skin irritation from scratching as they’re susceptible to flukes and other signs would be labored breathing, loss of appetite, sudden darting or hiding in corner

 

[Angus1989]

The rough skin texture suggests the fish has skin irritation from scratching as they’re susceptible to flukes and other signs would be labored breathing, loss of appetite, sudden darting or hiding in corner

Thanks mate, will treat it for flukes then and see how it goes.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thanks mate, will treat it for flukes then and see how it goes.

If you can get Prazipro or Praziquantel, you can dose it 2x, 8 days apart with good aeration. If the tank has a skimmer, run it, but don't collect the skimmate. Sometimes, a third treatment is required. If you have a lot of delicate corals in the tank, I suggest doing a 25% water change before treatment #2 and #3.

Jay

 

[jabberwock]

Jay and Vetteguy are the experts, but based on your line up in a 25 gallon, I suspect aggression as the main problem. If the hawk fish is after it, I would expect the clowns are as well when you are not looking.

 

[jabberwock]

Oh yeah, I just watched the video. That fish is banged up...

I would isolate it immediately into a breeder box with something to hide in (clean PVC).

 

[KC2020]

It looks like the bottom of his caudal fin has been nipped off. Has the Flame Hawkfish been harassing him ?

 

[Angus1989]

Oh yeah, I just watched the video. That fish is banged up...

I would isolate it immediately into a breeder box with something to hide in (clean PVC).

Yeah definitely has a lot of problems with the hawkfish. They've been in the tank together for at least six months though so not sure why it has peaked suddenly.

 

[Angus1989]

It looks like the bottom of his caudal fin has been nipped off. Has the Flame Hawkfish been harassing him ?

Definitely gets harassed. Chases him away from food and just hangs out near his cave being a pest.

 

[Idech]

Chases him away from food and just hangs out near his cave being a pest.

That explains why it is thin. Time for a trip to the sump for Mr Hawkfish ?

 

[jabberwock]

Definitely gets harassed. Chases him away from food and just hangs out near his cave being a pest.

I suspect that the clowns are becoming more aggressive as they tend to do, and this has caused mr hawkfish to up his game. The Gramma will likely die if you do not relocate it.

 

[Angus1989]

That explains why it is thin. Time for a trip to the sump for Mr Hawkfish ?

100% agree but my wife loves him albeit I am the only one who looks after the tank haha

 

[Angus1989]

I suspect that the clowns are becoming more aggressive as they tend to do, and this has caused mr hawkfish to up his game. The Gramma will likely die if you do not relocate it.

The clowns have never displayed any aggression to any fish, invert or coral. My Anenome is recovering at the moment post October crash so isn't big enough to host them yet as previously. They've just been hanging out on the back wall of the tank, running up and down that and not venturing out across the tank.

To be honest, the clowns stick to the back of the tank, the Gramma usually hung out in his cave and the hawkfish usually hangs out under a different rock. I'm bummed out none of the fish actually swim around properly.

 

[Angus1989]

If you can get Prazipro or Praziquantel, you can dose it 2x, 8 days apart with good aeration. If the tank has a skimmer, run it, but don't collect the skimmate. Sometimes, a third treatment is required. If you have a lot of delicate corals in the tank, I suggest doing a 25% water change before treatment #2 and #3.

Jay

I did a 4 minute RODI dip. No flukes fell off or anything else. It regurgitated some food it ate today and that's about it.

I think I'll go get a quarantine box and some PVC for it to settle down in.

Any idea on how long to keep it in the box to recover etc?

 

[Angus1989]

In the quarantine tank for now. Hopefully see some positive changes but we'll see.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I did a 4 minute RODI dip. No flukes fell off or anything else. It regurgitated some food it ate today and that's about it.

I think I'll go get a quarantine box and some PVC for it to settle down in.

Any idea on how long to keep it in the box to recover etc?

Just to clarify - peoples often say “look for flukes in dip water”, but only one species, Neobenedenia can be identified with the naked eye. Other species require a low powered microscope.

 

[Angus1989]

Just to clarify - peoples often say “look for flukes in dip water”, but only one species, Neobenedenia can be identified with the naked eye. Other species require a low powered microscope.

I guess I'll just play it safe and go get medication then. Are the blue planet tablets worth a try?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I guess I'll just play it safe and go get medication then. Are the blue planet tablets worth a try?

I've not used that brand, but the ingredient listed is praziquantel, and that works well against flukes. Dose it twice, 8 days apart, with good aeration.

 

[Angus1989]

Update.

Isolated in a quarantine tank from 29 Jan to 5 Feb. The condition did not worsen and it was definitely eating better. Swimming wise, hard to tell since it was in the quarantine tank which was smaller with PVC pipe for hiding.

I decided to let it out this evening. Firstly, it roamed the bottom of the tank for a couple of minutes. Secondly the Hawkfish and the Clowns both had a crack at it so I'm fairly certain that Jabbawock was on the money. I'd say this issue was aggression based rather than a sickness. If this changes I will do a further update.

Not sure how I will solve the issue except for letting that hawkfish die.