RTN & Zoa Help!

[Beausoleiljacob]

Hey Reef 2 Reef...
Unfortunately after coming back from vacation my beautiful acro has bit the dust due to RTN. I came home last night to the acro starting to lose tissue and overnight it was completely bare :(. I'm not sure what caused this and I am not sure what to do. Furthermore, I have had the weirdest experiences with Zoas in my tanks some colonies do great and some just ... not so much. Anyways what can be done about this problem. Here is a colony of my zoas and in the background my poor acro.

 

[LakeCityReefs]

It really could be many things. My first guess without more info is that stability has moved out of ideal parameters. Please post your tanks current readings.
Salinity
Temp.
Alk.
Ca.
N03
P04

 

[Beausoleiljacob]

It really could be many things. My first guess without more info is that stability has moved out of ideal parameters. Please post your tanks current readings.
Salinity - 1.026
Temp. - 78 (However, when I left my house on Friday tank was stabilized throughout the day at 80-80.5)
Alk. - 7.7
Ca. - 420
N03 - (Going to Go Test Now)
P04 - Hanna Checker Reads 0

 

[Beausoleiljacob]

Actually I just retested my alk and it is at 7.1! Uhh ohh. Last night I tested and it was at 7.7. Nitrate is 0 according to Red Sea kit. What should I do?

 

[Bunnee911]

There you are. Now, what caused it?

 

[LakeCityReefs]

Slowly raise Alk to 8.
Raise N03 to 5ppm
Raise P04 to slightly above 0.

You are starving your corals if these are accurate readings.

 

[Tautog]

I have the same issue, acro peeling, half my corals are growing, the other half dying. Fighting high No3's

 

[LakeCityReefs]

Talking about SPS
High N03 should make them brown.
Stripping water of N03, P04 will make them pale or cause tissue loss if reduced quickly.
Reduction in Alk below 7 will cause bleaching.
Raising Alk too quickly may also cause bleaching.

Light intensity plays a big role in where you have your tank parameters too. High light with low N03,P04 will cook corals.

These are some of my discoveries FWIW. I am not a pro by any means.

 

[Tautog]

Talking about SPS
High N03 should make them brown.
Stripping water of N03, P04 will make them pale or cause tissue loss if reduced quickly.
Reduction in Alk below 7 will cause bleaching.
Raising Alk too quickly may also cause bleaching.

Light intensity plays a big role in where you have your tank parameters too. High light with low N03,P04 will cook corals.

These are some of my discoveries FWIW. I am not a pro by any means.

Thanks for that. I'm in just over a year. I'm still trying to figure everything out. My acros turned white from the bottom up, and some were peeling. Others are growing great. Very confusing.

 

[LakeCityReefs]

Thanks for that. I'm in just over a year. I'm still trying to figure everything out. My acros turned white from the bottom up, and some were peeling. Others are growing great. Very confusing.

Could be lighting mixed with nutrient deficiency. Sometimes it's just tough to tell.

I have 3 sticks of Oregon tort in my tank all within a few inches of eachother. One of the will STN from the bottom up if anything swings, the other ones stay fine but retract their polyps.

The Oregon tort polyps are small. I like to use a cheap green birdsnest as an indicator if something isn't right. The long polyps will retract rather quickly if parameters arent proper and I keep it high in a bright lit area.

Sometimes corals in low light areas will take longer to react to unstable parameters.

 

[Beausoleiljacob]

Slowly raise Alk to 8.
Raise N03 to 5ppm
Raise P04 to slightly above 0.

You are starving your corals if these are accurate readings.

I never realized Nitrate and Phosphate were essential for corals growth. How do I bring those levels up?

 

[LakeCityReefs]

P04 will rise as you feed your fish. If you're running GFO or Phosguard then you may need to take it offline for a few days. You don't want your P04 too high so you have to find the right amount of reduction to use. I use about 1/4 cup of Phosguard and replenish monthly on a 50 Ga total system volume. My P04 runs about .08

Nitrates should be pretty easy to increase as well as it is what comes from fish poop. Worse case scenario you can dose potassium nitrate. I use a skimmer, macro algae in my fuge, & try to do 10% water changes every week. My nitrates are running high right now at 15 ppm and still things look fine.

What are your current nutrient export methods?

 

[LakeCityReefs]

Very important to make sure you are using the best test kits you can afford. I started with API rests and the nitrate and phosphate wasn't reading correctly. I could never get control and didn't know what was going on.
I am now using Salifert tests and have had them compared to some fellow hobbyists more expensive testers. Sali Salifert seems like a really economical and trustworthy route IMO.

 

[Beausoleiljacob]

Very important to make sure you are using the best test kits you can afford. I started with API rests and the nitrate and phosphate wasn't reading correctly. I could never get control and didn't know what was going on.
I am now using Salifert tests and have had them compared to some fellow hobbyists more expensive testers. Sali Salifert seems like a really economical and trustworthy route IMO.

Thanks for all your help! I never knew any of this! Currently, I am using Hanna Checkers for Phosphate & Alk. Use Salifret for Calcium & Phosphate & Also Use Red Sea for Nitrate, Alk, Calcium, Magnesium.

I have a 60 gallon cube with an Eshopps R-100 Sump (Not sure the gallons). I currently have 2 Firefish, 2 Clowns, a Goby & A shrimp.

I run a Media Reactor with probably too much GFO and Carbon.

My only means of export has been water changes. I also dose phyto if that makes a difference. I have been dosing maybe 30%+ water changes weekly. Now that my tank is more established I can definitely decrease that amount. The problem before was I had Dinos and water changes did the best job, I just felt that if I stopped with large water changes they would come back.

I also dose bacteria from time to time & Dose Reef Energy Parts A and B every 2-3 days.




So would you recommend shutting off the reactor?

 

[LakeCityReefs]

Let your tank get a little dirty!

Yes I would pull the gfo out of the reactor for a week and watch for phosphates to rise a little. Another option is to set your gfo on a timer and only run it 6 hours a day, or to let your gfo slowly get old and stop performing. I would still run carbon and refresh 1/4-1/2 cup monthly on a 60 gallon system.

Stop water changes for 2 weeks then perform 10% change every 2 weeks. This will replace trace elements that are not being replenished by dosing.
Not doing water changes will let nutrients rise. Your bioload of those small fish isn't too much. You could also add another fish to increase nitrates.

Go slow! If you don't like what you're seeing then stop and go back to your old routine. Keep a log while you're making these changes.

You will learn your tank and make future adjustments. You will probably need to run a little gfo after you see p04 get to .08. You will probably revert back to larger water changes or more frequently once n03 gets to 10.

You may want to add a skimmer and macro algae to your sump to help level off your nutrients in the future but right now it's too clean.

 

[Beausoleiljacob]

Let your tank get a little dirty!

Yes I would pull the gfo out of the reactor for a week and watch for phosphates to rise a little. Another option is to set your gfo on a timer and only run it 6 hours a day, or to let your gfo slowly get old and stop performing. I would still run carbon and refresh 1/4-1/2 cup monthly on a 60 gallon system.

Stop water changes for 2 weeks then perform 10% change every 2 weeks. This will replace trace elements that are not being replenished by dosing.
Not doing water changes will let nutrients rise. Your bioload of those small fish isn't too much. You could also add another fish to increase nitrates.

Go slow! If you don't like what you're seeing then stop and go back to your old routine. Keep a log while you're making these changes.

You will learn your tank and make future adjustments. You will probably need to run a little gfo after you see p04 get to .08. You will probably revert back to larger water changes or more frequently once n03 gets to 10.

You may want to add a skimmer and macro algae to your sump to help level off your nutrients in the future but right now it's too clean.

Ohh forgot to mention that! I am also running a skimmer and have a refugium :/. I have one of the BRS dual media reactors so if I shut the pump off there will be no carbon. Would my best bet be to leave the GFO in there and let it die out, empty some and just leave a little or just take all the GFO out completely?

 

[reeferfoxx]

Ohh forgot to mention that! I am also running a skimmer and have a refugium :/

FWIW I have a 20 gallon running naked. Meaning no carbon, gfo, refugium, skimmer or even a filter. The po4 maintains at 0.04 with weekly water changes. I feed once a day to maintain nitrates at about 2-3. I hope that helps. Tank is 1.7/yrs old.

If po4 gets higher than 0.04 I vacuum the sand.

 

[LakeCityReefs]

Its up to you. Your tank has been running to your current routine for awhile now. Slowly letting it get dirty will work fine. If you're like me and find it hard to be patient then I'd start taking things offline for a few days and reduce water changes.

Remove GFO
Dial back the skimmer so that it still produces bubbles but doesn't remove any skimmate.
Harvest half of your macro algae.
Reduce water changes.
Add another fish or feed a little heavier than normal.
Test N03, P04 every 2 days and watch for changes.
As nutrients rise start putting your export methods back online but not as aggressive as you have been.

I went through the exact same issues you are having. I started making the corrections about a month ago and I am really happy with the results I am seeing. Previously I always thought that I needed to target 0 nutrients in my system for best coral health. I know some folks can run ULNS but it just doesn't work for me.

 

[Beausoleiljacob]

Its up to you. Your tank has been running to your current routine for awhile now. Slowly letting it get dirty will work fine. If you're like me and find it hard to be patient then I'd start taking things offline for a few days and reduce water changes.

Remove GFO
Dial back the skimmer so that it still produces bubbles but doesn't remove any skimmate.
Harvest half of your macro algae.
Reduce water changes.
Add another fish or feed a little heavier than normal.
Test N03, P04 every 2 days and watch for changes.
As nutrients rise start putting your export methods back online but not as aggressive as you have been.

I went through the exact same issues you are having. I started making the corrections about a month ago and I am really happy with the results I am seeing. Previously I always thought that I needed to target 0 nutrients in my system for best coral health. I know some folks can run ULNS but it just doesn't work for me.

Sounds like a plan. The ULNS is what I was striving for my corals don't seem to be liking it too much LOL. Thanks for the help!

 

[reeferfoxx]

Sounds like a plan. The ULNS is what I was striving for my corals don't seem to be liking it too much LOL. Thanks for the help!

I'm no pro but to the best of my knowledge to accurately achieve a ULNS system, you have to maintain Alk at 7(no higher or lower) and you have to feed a little heavier. So it is kind of a balance between keeping the system clean and but not going overboard. Not really sure. My tank did fine for the first year keeping po4 and no3 at zero with alk at 7. However, corals were still small colonies. My corals didn't start thriving till I removed the skimmer(for my new tank). Kind of weird to see that transition happening. With all that new growth however, I noticed my Alk and calcium depleting and now I dose religiously :D