SB Reef Lights Opinions

[PDR]

What makes you say they are a downgrade? Especially the Ultra. Anything to back that up?

From the information they provide, it looks like the standard light (which is just a minorly upgraded black box imo) in a different case with passive cooling and a "tweaked" spectrum, whatever that means. You also have the customer service side which I have heard from multiple users is lacking.

Compare that to basically the best T5 fixture and it just isn't much of a comparison. Lighting gets debated like crazy, especially LED's, but you never hear of anyone trying to argue that T5's don't work well, or color up corals, or have the proper spectrum, etc.

Anecdotally, I have owned 5 different brands of LED lights and 2 different brands of T5 fixtures. In my experience, the T5's have produced better coloration and growth in everything from softies to sps.

That being said, I'm not against LED's, as I run them on my DT. I just personally would never swap out an ATI fixture for LED's. If anything I would look at adding some reef brite strips to the fixture.

What model lux meter? How accurate is it compared to a par meter? Measure only at the surface with the t5 and then dial in the SB until it matches the t5?

I know others on here are big lux meter fans, but I personally have purchased 3 units and they have all had drastically different readings. In my experience, the advice that any cheap lux meter will work is just wrong (if you are trying to measure par). If just comparing fixtures, I guess they would work. I have purchased 2 cheap ($20 and $30) lux meters and one higher end (Milwaukee) waterproof meter. The cheap lux meters read almost twice as high as the Milwaukee, but through various tests, I have determined the Milwaukee to be the most accurate of the 3.

I also don't see the value in just being able to measure lux or par at the surface of the water. It really doesn't give me enough information. At a minimum, I would recommend the waterproof Milwaukee meter. BRS is now renting par meters which would be the option I would choose.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

From the information they provide, it looks like the standard light (which is just a minorly upgraded black box imo) in a different case with passive cooling and a "tweaked" spectrum, whatever that means. You also have the customer service side which I have heard from multiple users is lacking.

Compare that to basically the best T5 fixture and it just isn't much of a comparison. Lighting gets debated like crazy, especially LED's, but you never hear of anyone trying to argue that T5's don't work well, or color up corals, or have the proper spectrum, etc.

Anecdotally, I have owned 5 different brands of LED lights and 2 different brands of T5 fixtures. In my experience, the T5's have produced better coloration and growth in everything from softies to sps.

That being said, I'm not against LED's, as I run them on my DT. I just personally would never swap out an ATI fixture for LED's. If anything I would look at adding some reef brite strips to the fixture.



I know others on here are big lux meter fans, but I personally have purchased 3 units and they have all had drastically different readings. In my experience, the advice that any cheap lux meter will work is just wrong (if you are trying to measure par). If just comparing fixtures, I guess they would work. I have purchased 2 cheap ($20 and $30) lux meters and one higher end (Milwaukee) waterproof meter. The cheap lux meters read almost twice as high as the Milwaukee, but through various tests, I have determined the Milwaukee to be the most accurate of the 3.

I also don't see the value in just being able to measure lux or par at the surface of the water. It really doesn't give me enough information. At a minimum, I would recommend the waterproof Milwaukee meter. BRS is now renting par meters which would be the option I would choose.

Some tanks are 1000 par at the top.
Some are 500.
If the corals don’t seem to be getting enough light. Make it 550. Too much? Make it 450.
Pretty simple.

As each tank is slightly different with alk / nutrients and light, finding the sweet spot with light is pretty easy as long as you know a number.
Be that par or lux.

Most folks just guess really. That’s why t5 users have so much success imo. They have “too much” light.

When I went from MH (20k radium 150w in a 20x20x20 tank to Sb reeflight , I just “blasted” the tank , MH t5 style. The acros responded by budding new branches within weeks.

Fwiw , a 16in Sb is about the same as a 250 mh.

 

[Velcro]

Having dealt with both companies I would hands down go with reefbreeders photon v2.

 

[USMA36]

I haven’t had luck with the ATI. I have it 13” over the water and I still end up bleaching birdsnest and montipora digitata 12” below the surface. Alk always between 7.8 and 8.5. Nitrates <10 phosphates .07-.1. When I first started my tank I had a single radion 3rd gen XR30 and had no issues. Things were growing and the color were great. I needed kore light and instead of buying another radion I went with the ATI and haven’t been able to grow anything since. I still have not come across many people that own an SB Reef that are not happy with the growth and the spectrum. I d love to rent the par meter but it requires a deposit in the amount of the meter. If I’m gonna put that much on a credit card even temporarily I might as well buy it.

 

[Velcro]

I haven’t had luck with the ATI. I have it 13” over the water and I still end up bleaching birdsnest and montipora digitata 12” below the surface. Alk always between 7.8 and 8.5. Nitrates <10 phosphates .07-.1. When I first started my tank I had a single radion 3rd gen XR30 and had no issues. Things were growing and the color were great. I needed kore light and instead of buying another radion I went with the ATI and haven’t been able to grow anything since. I still have not come across many people that own an SB Reef that are not happy with the growth and the spectrum. I d love to rent the par meter but it requires a deposit in the amount of the meter. If I’m gonna put that much on a credit card even temporarily I might as well buy it.

how many bulbs over what size tank. Which bulbs are you using

 

[USMA36]

Here's a sample of one of my programs. The tank was still pretty new and I was battling with algae outbreaks. But this would be a good starter perhaps for most tanks. As you can see there are 4 channels. I continue to adjust them to try to find the sweet spot. Hope this helps you a bit.

How high is your light over the water? Do you have any pictures of your tank.

 

[PDR]

I haven’t had luck with the ATI. I have it 13” over the water and I still end up bleaching birdsnest and montipora digitata 12” below the surface. Alk always between 7.8 and 8.5. Nitrates <10 phosphates .07-.1. When I first started my tank I had a single radion 3rd gen XR30 and had no issues. Things were growing and the color were great. I needed kore light and instead of buying another radion I went with the ATI and haven’t been able to grow anything since. I still have not come across many people that own an SB Reef that are not happy with the growth and the spectrum. I d love to rent the par meter but it requires a deposit in the amount of the meter. If I’m gonna put that much on a credit card even temporarily I might as well buy it.

I have read quite a few who have/had the SB lights and didn't love them. The previous owner of boom corals was one. He switched from SB to Kessil to T5 and Halide. Had the best color and growth from the T5 and Halides. You might simply just have too much light and/or the corals were not acclimated to the t5's properly. Without testing par (or lux I suppose ), you are really just guessing. My guess is you just got lucky with the Radions.

With the par meter rental, you do get the money back, and if you time it right you may not even get charged the few $$ in interest it would be on a credit card. IMO that is the single best thing you could do atm.

I know it sounds like I'm trying to prevent you from purchasing LEDs, and I promise that's not my intention. I just don't think switching lights is the solution to your problem, especially when you already have the gold standard. Raising the lights would be the first thing I would try (in addition to the par/lux meter).

 

[PDR]

Some tanks are 1000 par at the top.
Some are 500.
If the corals don’t seem to be getting enough light. Make it 550. Too much? Make it 450.
Pretty simple.

As each tank is slightly different with alk / nutrients and light, finding the sweet spot with light is pretty easy as long as you know a number.
Be that par or lux.

My point was that not all lux meters are created equally, so if one says I have 1000 par at the top and the other says I have 500, I'd almost be better off researching what others are getting with the lighting I have and start "guessing" from there.

 

[Big G]

How high is your light over the water? Do you have any pictures of your tank.

The lights are set at the maximum height that the "legs" allow. That's about 10" above the water level. Plenty of room to do tank maintenance. Here's an picture of the tank when I first setup the lights so you can see the "legs" and overall layout.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

My point was that not all lux meters are created equally, so if one says I have 1000 par at the top and the other says I have 500, I'd almost be better off researching what others are getting with the lighting I have and start "guessing" from there.

What meter are you using?
Most any cosine corrected lux meter is calibrated to a standard. Could be off a 100o lux if it’s junk but seriously.
500 and a 1000 par is 30,000 lux.
So no. That’s pretty much impossible.
My $15 meter and my $800 meter are almost perfectly matched. Only the very low end response isn’t as good. The 0-100 lux. That’s about how much folks have in thier bathrooms.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Personally, I think it’s fine to try new things. Every one finds sucess in different ways.


Every tank is different, as is every reefer.

 

[PDR]

What meter are you using?
Most any cosine corrected lux meter is calibrated to a standard. Could be off a 100o lux if it’s junk but seriously.
500 and a 1000 par is 30,000 lux.
So no. That’s pretty much impossible.
My $15 meter and my $800 meter are almost perfectly matched. Only the very low end response isn’t as good. The 0-100 lux. That’s about how much folks have in thier bathrooms.

I purchased and used these two:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004K0A7I6/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001DTQTCA/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I used 500 and 1000 par as an example as those were the numbers you used. I was aiming for a max of 200 par at a 6" depth. At the same height, the first meter showed almost 2x the lux at the surface than the Milwaukee. I borrowed a friends lux meter and it read about 25% more than the Milwaukee. I don't know what brand it was, just that it was also cheap.

I don't know the science behind how a lux meter works, but I can assure you I know how to read some numbers on a screen. Impossible or not, that's what they read. I assume I was just super unlucky and most people have better experiences with cheaper lux meters. I do still stand by my comment that to me, knowing just the surface value wasn't very useful as I was aiming for very specific ranges at specific depths. I'm sure for the vast majority of people a standard lux meter will work fine for getting an idea of how much they are lighting their tank.

 

[USMA36]

Some tanks are 1000 par at the top.
Some are 500.
If the corals don’t seem to be getting enough light. Make it 550. Too much? Make it 450.
Pretty simple.

As each tank is slightly different with alk / nutrients and light, finding the sweet spot with light is pretty easy as long as you know a number.
Be that par or lux.

Most folks just guess really. That’s why t5 users have so much success imo. They have “too much” light.

When I went from MH (20k radium 150w in a 20x20x20 tank to Sb reeflight , I just “blasted” the tank , MH t5 style. The acros responded by budding new branches within weeks.

Fwiw , a 16in Sb is about the same as a 250 mh.

Ok lux meter just came. Running my 36” 8 bulb Sunpower with 4 blue plus 1 coral plus and 3 True Actinic bulbs my highest reading was 303 average around 280 lowest 110 right on the front wall 100 on the side walls. If I’m reading the meter right that’s a peak of 303,000/50=6000 at the surface. The light is 12” over the water. That seems like way way too much light. Am I reading this correctly?

 

[USMA36]

how many bulbs over what size tank. Which bulbs are you using[/QU

how many bulbs over what size tank. Which bulbs are you using

90 Gallon 4’ Long 24” deep. Light is 8 bulb 36” running 12” above the water 4 blue plus 3 true actinic and 1 coral plus. Channel 1 comes on at 10am-9pm one blue plus one actinic. Main lights come on at 12pm-6pm.

 

[PDR]

You are reading 30,300 lux, not 303,000. I believe the 200,000 is the max the meter can read.

Check out this thread sometime. This guy has the same or similar light and has done pretty extensive testing you could use to find approximate values. https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/par-to-lux-conversion-real-world-t5-numbers.281126/#post-3416669

 

[USMA36]

You are reading 30,300 lux, not 303,000. I believe the 200,000 is the max the meter can read.

Check out this thread sometime. This guy has the same or similar light and has done pretty extensive testing you could use to find approximate values. https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/par-to-lux-conversion-real-world-t5-numbers.281126/#post-3416669

Thanks. The meter was reading x100 so I assumed it was the number on screen x 100/50.

 

[bubbaque]

I personally would not sell the ATI fixture for the SB reef lights. IMO the ATI fixture is of very high quality and is almost set it and forget. Pick a bulb combo (ATI even has a recommend set) put your light roughly 9 - 12" above your 90 gallon and just let it be. I use the fixture on two tanks and have had great successs with them. If somehow it is causing issues I would feed a little more if it's bleaching your corals but it really shouldn't be. I personally would look towards parameters or other issues more than I would the lights.

Do you have a pic of the corals you are having issues with?

 

[USMA36]

I personally would not sell the ATI fixture for the SB reef lights. IMO the ATI fixture is of very high quality and is almost set it and forget. Pick a bulb combo (ATI even has a recommend set) put your light roughly 9 - 12" above your 90 gallon and just let it be. I use the fixture on two tanks and have had great successs with them. If somehow it is causing issues I would feed a little more if it's bleaching your corals but it really shouldn't be. I personally would look towards parameters or other issues more than I would the lights.

Do you have a pic of the corals you are having issues with?

I’ve been using the light for a year. No luck whatsoever. LPS are mostly fine. SPS bleach out within a month no matter the height above. Parameters are and have been rock steady and nothing pops up out of the ordinary on ICP testing. The light is already sold. The SB reef ultra will be delivered tomorrow. Just want to get an idea of the best settings.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Ok lux meter just came. Running my 36” 8 bulb Sunpower with 4 blue plus 1 coral plus and 3 True Actinic bulbs my highest reading was 303 average around 280 lowest 110 right on the front wall 100 on the side walls. If I’m reading the meter right that’s a peak of 303,000/50=6000 at the surface. The light is 12” over the water. That seems like way way too much light. Am I reading this correctly?

Correct. It’s 30,000. By about 50.
Only about 600 par. So no. Def not too much light.

The fall off on the edges is normal.

Fwiw, the true actinics are the Lowest par and output bulb. As they produce a very narrow band of light.
About half of a blue plus I belive, so you’re par may be a bit lower.

With those numbers , use SB’s lighting schedule and use the peak lux as the new peak of the photoperiod. Reduce it for acclimation for a couple weeks.

Sb fwiw, uses a very long viewable time ,like 12hrs. Very low intensity am Pm, with a six or so hour peak.
Mine was more like 13 hrs.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

I purchased and used these two:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004K0A7I6/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001DTQTCA/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I used 500 and 1000 par as an example as those were the numbers you used. I was aiming for a max of 200 par at a 6" depth. At the same height, the first meter showed almost 2x the lux at the surface than the Milwaukee. I borrowed a friends lux meter and it read about 25% more than the Milwaukee. I don't know what brand it was, just that it was also cheap.

I don't know the science behind how a lux meter works, but I can assure you I know how to read some numbers on a screen. Impossible or not, that's what they read. I assume I was just super unlucky and most people have better experiences with cheaper lux meters. I do still stand by my comment that to me, knowing just the surface value wasn't very useful as I was aiming for very specific ranges at specific depths. I'm sure for the vast majority of people a standard lux meter will work fine for getting an idea of how much they are lighting their tank.

To get very specific numbers at very specific depths, yes , you want a Milwaukee. It’s the only submersible. I don’t often reccomend them any more cuz reefers will spend 300 on frags and not spend $15 on a light meter.


The usefulness of knowing the number at the top is this.
It’s one way to find the sweet spot.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/how-to-find-your-led-intensity-sweet-spot.308181/#post-3785697

Many that I’ve walked through metering are surprised by how little , or how much light they are actually giving the corals Esp when it’s thriving tank.
Keeping in mind , two people with the exact same coral can have par differences of 100-500+ par, and both grow well.