Sea lab 28 experiment

[Aquacrazed]

Thats that’s not enough for you to maintain alk and ca in a nano?

This stuff supposedly adds calc but will not maintain alk.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I am not. I am hoping my weekly 30% water changes will take care of it. It's at around 7dkh right now and I'll be doing a water change tomorrow. Any suggestions?

If you don’t need alk, then you will not need calcium. :)

 

[Aquacrazed]

So I did a 30% water change last night and I noticed my previous alk reading was waaay off (I was using a reef master test for alk, I ditched it and now using the salifert test).

Magnesium: 1380
Calcium: 480
Alk:11.8

All 3 salifert tests. The nugget is fully dissolved now, so in 3 days it was all gone. The dosage is 2-3 nuggets per 10g and my tank is is 20g (water volume maybe 16g). I will add 2 this time and see how it goes.

My corals are looking better than ever! Nice polyp extension, LPS, SPS. The torches seem to be loving it.

 

[Aquacrazed]

The 2 nuggets have completely dissolved in 4 days. Here are my numbers:

Magnesium: 1380
Calcium: 520
Alk: 10.5

So magnesium is unchanged, calcium up by 40, alk dropped by 1.3. I am not going to add anymore till the next water change. Will do another test on Saturday before the water change.

Corals looking great.

 

[GARRIGA]

The 2 nuggets have completely dissolved in 4 days. Here are my numbers:

Magnesium: 1380
Calcium: 520
Alk: 10.5

So magnesium is unchanged, calcium up by 40, alk dropped by 1.3. I am not going to add anymore till the next water change. Will do another test on Saturday before the water change.

Corals looking great.

Seems more valid to continue adding and testing before that water change alters the chemistry of the water. Trying then to calculate how much calcium was thrown out with the bath water and replaced with new salt difficult and would alter these results, for example.

 

[VintageReefer]

I’m gonna buy them and try it out.

I don’t do water changes. My alk is fully automated and measured every 4 hours and auto-dosed as needed, if this product lowers my alk, my system will compensate. I have no automation for ca, and I think my system and style would be a valid means to test and track

 

[GARRIGA]

I’m gonna buy them and try it out.

I don’t do water changes. My alk is fully automated and measured every 4 hours and auto-dosed as needed, if this product lowers my alk, my system will compensate. I have no automation for ca, and I think my system and style would be a valid means to test and track

Don't see why it would lower your alkalinity. Apparently just doesn't add it.

 

[VintageReefer]

Don't see why it would lower your alkalinity. Apparently just doesn't add it.

I thought someone mentioned earlier it dropped alk.

Could have just been normal consumption

Anyone have a list of what trace is supposedly included ?

I will put this on a media tray inbetween chamber 2 and 3 of my sump. It will be untouched by critters and have a steady constant flow of water

 

[GARRIGA]

I thought someone mentioned earlier it dropped alk.

Could have just been normal consumption

Anyone have a list of what trace is supposedly included ?

I will put this on a media tray inbetween chamber 2 and 3 of my sump. It will be untouched by critters and have a steady constant flow of water

Logic suggest consumption. I’m not a chemist therefore is there potentially a chemical that might be included that would drop alkalinity without converting that to co2 such as with sodium bisulfate or that included in SeaChem Acid Buffer which I recall might be phosphate based therefore both of these components could be monitored to confirm alkalinity loss by their increase outside of norm. pH for the co2 although both likely convoluted in a tank environment but likely simple enough in a cup of distilled water where one can be tested after equilibrium with room air (I’m guessing) and PO4 because in distilled it should be absent.

Fact is this should all be tested in a tank with salt added to distilled/RODI water either no biological impact and then can be tested as to how it dissolves including by adding flow to see if that increase rate of dissolve and how it impacts items such as calcium and magnesium.

Im betting it’s like an alka seltzer as to how it releases its content.

 

[VintageReefer]

Sea-Lab Formula 28 is a mixture of naturally occurring buffer compounds that maintains natural ocean concentrations of calcium, strontium, and all 15 essential trace elements. Calcium and strontium are well recognized nutrients, but trace elements are not as well understood. They are, however, vitally necessary to marine life in the aquarium. Paradoxically, these same elements, so essential to life, are also highly toxic. The trick is to tread the fine line between trace element starvation and trace element toxicity. Formula 28 is the first formula available to hobbyist and professionals that creates and maintains this fine balance. As elements are depleted from solution, Formula 28 delivers exactly equivalent amounts to replace them.

Since Formula 28 is fully buffered, there is a constant supply of essential trace elements and no possibility of toxic overload, so dosage and application are extremely uncritical. The blocks can be placed in any location where there is a moderate current. When the blocks are mostly dissolved, add a similar number.

SeaLab Concentrations (ppm)
Aluminum 0.01
Boron 4.6
Calcium 400.0
Chromium 0.00005
Cobalt 0.0005
Copper 0.003
Fluorine 0.3
Iodine 0.06
Iron 0.01
Manganese 0.002
Molybdenum 0.01
Nickel 0.002
Selenium 0.004
Strontium 8.0
Tin 0.002
Vanadium 0.002
Zinc 0.014

Sea-Lab #28 restores and maintains the concentration of calcium, strontium and all trace elements at the same levels found in the sea, automatically. Formula #28 always works, and cannot be overdosed. This is not a slow-dissolve or time-release product. It dissolves only to replace depleted elements.

 

[GARRIGA]

Therefore nothing can bus that would drop alkalinity my point. YouTuber that promotes this eventually discovered his alkalinity was lower than expected. Seemed to confirm either this doesn’t contribute or consumes and seems chemically speaking as to their label there doesn’t appear to be anything to reduce it.

Oddly. Not sure how that YouTuber maintained any level of alkalinity being it wasn’t added and understanding being that is consumed at a steady rate relative to calcium and his calcium I recall was within acceptable range.

Why tank tests likely not best appease and more lab like price might solve this because I don’t think any questioning that it adds that advertised but the mechanism by which it’s added. Is it replacing loss or just releasing based time influenced by flow and size left. I’m betting on latter which means this would very likely be useless as a solution. Although YouTuber seemed to have success with how his system consumed that released. I’m not renting on that.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I thought someone mentioned earlier it dropped alk.

Could have just been normal consumption

Anyone have a list of what trace is supposedly included ?

I will put this on a media tray inbetween chamber 2 and 3 of my sump. It will be untouched by critters and have a steady constant flow of water

The trace claims are ridiculous and impossible to understand.

Formula 28 senses the concentration of 28 individual elements, including calcium, strontium, and all trace elements, then automatically adjusts each one to the same concentration found in the sea. The blocks or nuggets dissolve only to replace depleted elements in solution.

Bear in mind this claim that makes me not ever want to put this in a tank:
Formula 28 also controls many causes of depressed or drifting pH. The formula contains four alumino-silicate "weathered" buffers, well known to seawater chemists, but exclusive to Sea-Lab in the saltwater aquarium industry.

The person who saw alk decline was probably from normal alk consumption.

Still cannot see any reason to think this is a desirable product. I expect you could add a product that you know what it is once a week for calcium and that would work fine.

 

[VintageReefer]

The trace claims are ridiculous and impossible to understand.

Formula 28 senses the concentration of 28 individual elements, including calcium, strontium, and all trace elements, then automatically adjusts each one to the same concentration found in the sea. The blocks or nuggets dissolve only to replace depleted elements in solution.

Magic can’t be explained with science

Bear in mind this claim that makes me not ever want to put this in a tank:
Formula 28 also controls many causes of depressed or drifting pH. The formula contains four alumino-silicate "weathered" buffers, well known to seawater chemists, but exclusive to Sea-Lab in the saltwater aquarium industry.

Without knowing what particular alumino silicate bluffers were selected and how they are weathered, we can not deduce anything one way or the other

The person who saw alk decline was probably from normal alk consumption.

Agree

Still cannot see any reason to think this is a desirable product. I expect you could add a product that you know what it is once a week for calcium and that would work fine.

Gives me ca plus some other trace automatically. Ca isn’t super important to be stable, as long as this releases somewhat consistently, and keeps me above 400ish I’m happy

Ok in seriousness most my replies were instigating and joking. But there is an unusual amount of positive experiences from people over a large period of time, and that has to say something about it. I don’t believe the hooey “dissolves as needed when needed” it just dissolves

If it dissolves over a week and adds ca over that week, and it’s at a rate that keeps up with my consumption, I’ll be happy and consider it successful. If not, I’m sure it’s tweakable by adjusting the number of cubes added at a time

We shall see!

 

[Aquacrazed]

Seems more valid to continue adding and testing before that water change alters the chemistry of the water. Trying then to calculate how much calcium was thrown out with the bath water and replaced with new salt difficult and would alter these results, for example.

I'm trying not to add too much of this stuff. Calc is already slightly on the high side (520). I want to see the drop-off after it fully dissolved (which would be 3 days without).

 

[Aquacrazed]

I thought someone mentioned earlier it dropped alk.

Could have just been normal consumption

Anyone have a list of what trace is supposedly included ?

I will put this on a media tray inbetween chamber 2 and 3 of my sump. It will be untouched by critters and have a steady constant flow of water

Yes, I've seen a few threads about it dropping alk. It's already dropped mine. But as Randy pointed out it could be from normal alk consumption.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I suppose there may also be a real alk drop since we don’t know what this product actually is, or whether those aluminum silicate secret buffers are doing it.

 

[GARRIGA]

I'm trying not to add too much of this stuff. Calc is already slightly on the high side (520). I want to see the drop-off after it fully dissolved (which would be 3 days without).

Your adding a calcium additive to already high calcium values and yet precipitation might skews your results. That's how that appears to me. Perhaps wait until calcium depleted to 400.

 

[CHSUB]

If I try this product and dinos disappear, does that mean it destroys dinos like increasing nutrients from zeros?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

If I try this product and dinos disappear, does that mean it destroys dinos like increasing nutrients from zeros?

Another trick, but I don’t understand how dinos entered the discussion.

 

[CHSUB]

Another trick, but I don’t understand how dinos entered the discussion.

Dinos are always in the conversation, haha! More importantly, my thoughts are that sometimes observed reactions in the reef aquarium have nothing to do with the changes we make. An example, maybe, is your comment with regards to this product: “The person who saw alk decline was probably from normal alk consumption”