so im looking to do a clownfish tank...

[Dtackett]

so I just moved and am working on a few projects. but im thinking of setting up a clownfish and anemone tank. my thoughts on this was do a 75 with about 20 clownfish and either 1 or 2 large anemones.

the cycle would be a strong one (I dose pure ammonia to cycle) and the anemones would go in shortly after the diatoms went away.
then all the fish and clean up crew would go in a few days later once the anemones were settled in and I had the flow and lights adjusted. all the clowns would be young and the same size. looking at doing all true perc so theres no differences causing one fish to be singled out for the aggression.

ive been looking at different anemones trying to figure out what I want. thought about buying some large bta, but that's not the look im going for. im thinking either a lta or a Stichodactyla gigantean.

I would be trying to provide all needed flow though either closed loop or straight from the sump to give the anemones and fish as much room as possible in the tank and prevent any part of the anemones from getting caught up. we got a LFS here that can get me pretty much anything I need for a good price.

filtration will be simple, but effective. 40 breeder sump with a LED panel driven 12*12 ATS and a SCA-302 skimmer and rock rubble.

Im looking for helpful adive on which clowns and which anemones would be best. I think a 75 may be a bit small for a big Stichodactyla gigantean (theyre also really expensive lol)

so whats your thoughts? which clowns with which anemones and remember, im looking for big showy nems thatll help fill the tank and give plenty of space for the clowns.

 

[Tahoe61]

Give the tank 3 months to cycle at the very least before introduction of Anemones and then only BTA/Entacmaea quadricolor. A cycle is defined by more than the presence and then absence of detectable ammonia and nitrites. Adding a Anemones to a newly cycled tank is asking for trouble. A biological filter needs time to grow before it will adequately complete the nitrogen cycle regardless of the way the tank is cycled. Many hobbyist will tell you to wait 6 months before adding an Anemone.

 

[Dtackett]

not my first tank, nor my first anemone tank. all of my cycles tend to last about 3 months. I don't consider a tank cycles until after diatoms are done. I dose ammonia to 4 ppm daily until I feel its done. got any useful input to the topic with the information you've been given?

 

[Tahoe61]

Im looking for helpful adive on which clowns and which anemones would be best. I think a 75 may be a bit small for a big Stichodactyla gigantean (theyre also really expensive lol)

so whats your thoughts? which clowns with which anemones and remember, im looking for big showy nems thatll help fill the tank and give plenty of space for the clowns.

got any useful input to the topic with the information you've been given?

Yeah stay away from any carpet anemones for a newly cycled tank, but hey you sound like you got it all figured out already.

Good Luck.

 

[SerpentSlick]

Considering the fact that you want so many clowns, I think Tahoe61 is right. It sounds like it's not advice you want to hear but in my opinion 6 months would be really pushing it with that type of biological load. 20+ fish in such a small water column in a 75 without a substantial amount of live rock(rumble noted) is a big enough task without an anemone. You will need to add all of those fish at the exact same time and I think there something to be said for waiting on a more established tank.

Aside from that you've pretty much answered your only questions.

Clowns: True Percs (variants won't really matter)

Anemone: LTA(Carpet is too expensive and you don't like BTA)

Are there any other specific questions you have? I think that might get some clown/anemone experts to chime into to the post.

My other suggestion would be to check out Bulk Reef Supply's clownfish harem tank video series. There's a lot of cool info and it might add a different perspective for your project.

Best of luck.

 

[Dtackett]

Considering the fact that you want so many clowns, I think Tahoe61 is right. It sounds like it's not advice you want to hear but in my opinion 6 months would be really pushing it with that type of biological load. 20+ fish in such a small water column in a 75 without a substantial amount of live rock(rumble noted) is a big enough task without an anemone. You will need to add all of those fish at the exact same time and I think there something to be said for waiting on a more established tank.

Aside from that you've pretty much answered your only questions.

Clowns: True Percs (variants won't really matter)

Anemone: LTA(Carpet is too expensive and you don't like BTA)

Are there any other specific questions you have? I think that might get some clown/anemone experts to chime into to the post.

My other suggestion would be to check out Bulk Reef Supply's clownfish harem tank video series. There's a lot of cool info and it might add a different perspective for your project.

Best of luck.

I understand the bioload issue and am looking at frequent water changes and dosing a good bottled bacteria (dr tims maybe?) as well as a strong cycle. the way I cycle tanks seems to take about 3 months to get to my happy point. my issue will be I cant continue dosing pure ammonia once the nem is in so would dosing dr tims be sufficient? The true percs idea was simply to make them more uniform and prevent aggression, I wasn't set on them, they just seemed like the best choice. do you have a better type? maybe one that's known to be less aggressive? I can pay for a carpet, they sell out here for about 120 for a decent sized one, but there are 2 types of carpets to my understanding. the regular cheap carpet nems, and the gigantic carpet nems which I haven't found out here but ive found a few online that sell for 200-500 depending on size. ill have a ton of rock between the display and sump, ill have to find that perfect balance though. between enough rock in the display to deal with detritus and cuc needs, without taking up all the room for the clowns.

all in all I still have a lot of research and prep work to do before I even start this. I was hoping for responses from the clownfish and nem experts or from someone whos done a tank like this and get their experience. ive watched the episodes on the herem tank. that's actually where I got the idea. but lets face it... I don't have a warehouse full of toys to use on my tank so I gotta try to budget it out. I also don't have someone who can watch the tank for 12 hours a day to watch for issues so I have to do it right from the start or I cant do it. this is still just an idea. I haven't set my mind on it, or even set my mind on any specific part of it. im still open to suggestions but saying the myths of no nem for 3-6 months isn't doing much good. ive kept several different nems over the years with great success on newly cycled tanks as well as the tanks ive setup for other people that have been successful. I understand however, you cant guage someones experience or willingness to do extra maintenance over a forum site with one post. if I seemed disrespectful I didn't intend to.

 

[Tahoe61]

I never give advice on something I do not have 1st hand extensive experience on.

The issue I see with your idea, and it's an excellent idea, is the time frame. Carpet anemones do not do well in a newly cycled tank unless you're an expert in keeping carpet anemones, you have a decade or more experience because that is what it takes.

Push the envelop sure, I have done it. But you wanted input from others that have done it so that is all I have to offer.

 

[Reefrookie220]

An odd number of clowns will help your success. To increase it even further make a special order from a breeder to get all the fish from the same clutch. 1 or 2 nems would only cause issues with competition for territory. I'd check out Neptune cove and load up on a dozen or more btas. That means a skimmer upgrade, but if your gonna add them that quick then you need bigger skimmer period. Lol. My 2 cents.

 

[mochaclownlover]

BTAs would be your best option for a tank like this, they are hardy(to an extent),grow fairly quickly, and most clowns take to them rather quickly. Three months does sound a bit short for a cycle, personally i would wait at least 6 months, but if you wanted to get the tank up fairly quick, you could probably get away 4 months. Like Reefrookie220 said, it would be a good idea to put at least a dozen BTAs, other wise the clowns will fight over territory and you may loose some in the process. Just my opinion.
+1 on the large skimmer

 

[Dtackett]

ok I can see how several smaller nems would be better than 1 or 2 large. ill consider bta. ill see if I can find a local place that can get me some in bulk. The skimmer im thinking of using is the sca 302. ive chosen this skimmer because I have a history with sca and love the company and their products. however on a tank with this expense im not above going with a different skimmer. suggestions on one that wont break the bank but will be reliable enough for a tank like this? curve 5 maybe?

as for the bta. I can get them locally for about 20-30 bucks each. cheaper if I have him do a bulk order. but i doubt they would all come in at once. its a small shop and difficult for him to do large ordered based on his own limitations for tanks so i could probably get 3 or 4 at a time. that would force me to extend my cycle further but i may have to bite the bullet and do it anyway. the last thing i want to do is put all this money into the tank and it crash due to my own arrogance.

Seeing as how there wont be much of a source for ammonia to help build the cycle once i add the nems, is there a recommended product i can use to dose to help build the bacteria, or should i add a biopellet reactor such as the one from brs?
i come here for advice. i think i need to take it from people more experienced than me. im sorry if i sounded disrespectful in the previous posts.

 

[mochaclownlover]

I've heard bio-spira works pretty well. Can't wait to see how your tank turns out, good luck
+1 on the reactor

 

[Dtackett]

thanks. itll be a long process and be a while before I get it setup. but once I do ill be all in on this.

 

[Amoo]

My thoughts on the idea are that you're not going to have enough hiding/home places for that many clowns trying to skimp on Nems. Could work, won't know until you try, but if it were me in a 75 I'd try no fewer then 6-8 legit size Nems (too small they're just going to get loved to death) and closer to 15 or so clowns.

As was mentioned already, you're going to watch clowns from the same clutch for any chance of this working.

Ultimately I think you're going to run into huge bio load problems or huge aggression problems or both, from the ideas you've given so far, but who knows, there's always exceptions.

 

[jayjigga]

I read most of the response, which most, I agree with; some I respectfully disagree with. That being said, I've attempted basically the same thing, but with a 120G, and I'll give my shortcomings, ideas, etc.

First off, more clowns is better if you're shooting for a higher end count. Obviously, filtration has to be on point to get that done. I run a JNS SK3, and prior to that an Aquamaxx CO-2. I have a 40B that's sectioned off to run roughly an 8G K1 chamber, about 4 liters of siporax, and about 2 gallons space-wise of the Marinepure ceramic biomedia. I have a good amount of housing for bacteria, I think, and it's much more efficient than LR in a sump. I had a CPR tumbler for biopellets, but I plan to DIY a recirc BP reactor shortly.

As far as clowns, out of the 28 I started with, I only have about 5 of my ocellaris left. I started with roughly 18 occ, 6 percs, and 4 fancies (including a phantom which I miss dearly). I think the percs were the more aggressive, so I would avoid that the next time around. I love percs, so for me to "settle" for occ eats away at my soul a little. Anything of the occ variant is probably best bet, since they're a tad less feisty than their perc counterparts.


Why did I lose so many? Two major factors actually:

1) being a typical guy, I didn't set my Eheim autofeeder up correctly. I set times to drop, but didn't know I had to set the number of drops. That went on for probably a month and a half The first month they were around, I fed them mysis with metro and focus daily and might have lost one for the first month and a half.

2) I added a purple gig that never should have been introduced. It was sick and I didn't have a QT setup or Cipro to make it happen, so in the DT it went. From there, it was a downward spiral of about a month of losing nice nems through cross infection. I lost my main mag, and once that was out of the tank, the aggression level probably sky-rocketed. I had about 11 clowns when I was finally able to add another good-sized mag, but I also volunteered to watch a pair of clowns that escaped the box. Needless to say, the old and the new fought, and I lost my phantom in the process.


Type of nem recommendation:

BTA's are great...for like 2 clowns. Besides the walking factor, they can shrivel up to almost nothing whenever they want to, so all of a sudden, 20 clowns are homeless, lol. At the moment, I have 8 BTA's, and they're almost useless when it comes to nem homes. The clowns like them, but you need 20+ BTA's to house that harem.

LTA's, I run way too much flow to have one settle. Never again

Gigantea, yes they're a bit of $, but man do clowns love them. If you can get them to settle in nicely, they're great.

Haddoni, if you like a tank rescape anytime they want to flex, then do it at your own risk, but you have been warned.

Crispa/malu, I like them, but settling can be an issue.

Magnifica, for this type of harem attempt, I think it's the best bet, but definitely bring your A-game and take your time. I let my original ritt settle a whole month before I even thought of what clowns I was going to order. I think it's crucial to let any anemones that you do go with settle without clowns for as long as you can.

How would I do this differently the next time? First off, I would get the housing situation down pat and settled for at least a month of two. QT any nems that need it, and have them happy for a few straight weeks. Secondly, I would make sure my feeding regimen and filtration match the needs of the amount of fish that I'm putting in. Third, I would add all the clowns at once, and only go with similar sized ones. The bigger clowns establish dominance too easily. I had to remove my nearly naked within a week of the harem intro because it was almost double the size of the smallest clowns. Once everything is in place, observe and react to the needs of the nems and clowns. You can see if the clowns are really getting into it with each other based on fin tatter and their mouths.

Would I recommend trying it? Sure, but come prepared, financially, mentally, and emotionally. I hate losing fish, but losing a gorgeous nem, I've found to be a lot harder to cope with. Good luck OP!

 

[reefhobby]

Go on Instagram and follow aqua__tank__girl she has a 72 gallon cube with 32 clowns and nems and corals. They are very hard to care for you equipment has to be top noch and you have to feed ALOT to get rid of aggression. And get the nems and everything before you get any clownfish. Get all the clownfish as babies and as one family.