"Spike" Died

Bubbalikesit · Oct 8, 2021

After 16 years, our fish died. She was a giant freshwater Red Devil and mean as a snake. She'll be missed. We have a 125 gallon (473 liter) glass tank we'd like to convert to a saltwater reef tank. It's 42" X 20" X 36" (106 X 50 X 92 CM) and I'm going to cut the silicone and rebuild the tank. We had some black mold in the tank about 10 years ago and the fringes of the silicone are stained black. So, I decided I'll rebuild the tank and start fresh. My over encompassing question would be, "If you were starting over, what would you do?". I know that's an open ended question and I have been reading about saltwater tanks for the last few years. I gotta say, there are a lot of options. We haven't even decided that we'll have fish as of yet. I think getting past the learning curve of maintaining a saltwater aquarium and keeping a reef alive and flourishing should be our first task. We have time and don't need to rush anything. We have canister style filters (200 gal filtration each) and a big chiller (JBJ Arctica). We bought the new canisters and the chiller 3 years ago replacing our old equipment. Any ideas and or information would be appreciated. If you have any questions about something I left out, please feel free to ask. I thank you for your time.

Respectfully submitted.

blaxsun · Oct 8, 2021

You're going to want a sump and protein skimmer at a bare minimum. A UV is also highly recommended. The canister style filters work fine for freshwater but will quickly get clogged and be ineffective with saltwater. Filter socks (or filter rollers) are pretty much standard. Many also run reactors with carbon, GFO, zeo, etc.

Honestly, you may want to look into selling your existing tank setup and simply replacing it with a specific saltwater tank (either a custom or turnkey setup). Sometimes converting a freshwater tank ends up being cost prohibitive and just as much as a new system.

Lighting for corals is fairly important, and something you should be prepared for when you get sticker shock. Dosing is something else you'll need at some point once your tank is established and a controller (Apex, etc.) is also a good idea so you can actually go on holidays and not worry about several thousand dollars in corals and fish taking a nosedive.

Jekyl · Oct 8, 2021

I would also drill and add a sump.

MaxTremors · Oct 8, 2021

blaxsun said:
You're going to want a sump and protein skimmer at a bare minimum. A UV is also highly recommended. The canister style filters work fine for freshwater but will quickly get clogged and be ineffective with saltwater. Filter socks (or filter rollers) are pretty much standard. Many also run reactors with carbon, GFO, zeo, etc.

Honestly, you may want to look into selling your existing tank setup and simply replacing it with a specific saltwater tank (either a custom or turnkey setup). Sometimes converting a freshwater tank ends up being cost prohibitive and just as much as a new system.

Lighting for corals is fairly important, and something you should be prepared for when you get sticker shock. Dosing is something else you'll need at some point once your tank is established and a controller (Apex, etc.) is also a good idea so you can actually go on holidays and not worry about several thousand dollars in corals and fish taking a nosedive.

A controller is a great addition, but is 100% optional, and not need to go on vacation. People kept reefs for decades without them, and most people still do. An ATO and a dosing pump (once you have enough coral to need one) is all you really need to leave your tank for a couple weeks. That said, controllers and tridents certainly make life easier and they are a great addition, but again, they are optional. I also think there’s something to be gained by learning to maintain your aquarium and keep it stable manually. To be clear, I’m not recommending to not get an Apex/controller, just saying that you don’t need one to have a successful reef tank or to be able to go on vacation.

blaxsun · Oct 8, 2021

MaxTremors said:
A controller is a great addition, but is 100% optional, and not need to go on vacation. People kept reefs for decades without them, and most people still do. An ATO and a dosing pump (once you have enough coral to need one) is all you really need to leave your tank for a couple weeks. That said, controllers and tridents certainly make life easier and they are a great addition, but again, they are optional. I also think there’s something to be gained by learning to maintain your aquarium and keep it stable manually. To be clear, I’m not recommending to not get an Apex/controller, just saying that you don’t need one to have a successful reef tank or to be able to go on vacation.

And many of these things can also be added down the road as well.

Bubbalikesit · Oct 8, 2021

At the risk of sounding uppity please forgive the following. My wife bought a $1,300.00 chiller because the freshwater tank was running 3 degrees high in the Summer. With that being said and me now saying, reef and corals are NOT cheap. The investment can be sizeable and would need to be protected. I agree that learning how to take care of the tank with a minimalist platform at first is probably a good idea. A manual feel for the process is always good. ALTHOUGH, I am a big fan of proven technology. I mean really, I'm not Daniel Boone. As far as the process, we go slow. It'll take us 6 months to get to sand and saltwater. Looking at pumps and filters right now. Any ideas?

Reefing102 · Oct 8, 2021

Before you go too far, I do have a question, have you ever dosed copper in the tank to treat for ick or other parasites? If so, I would be sure when resealing, you get all of the old silicone out as it could potentially leach copper into the tank and could wreak havoc on the tank.

That said, pumps I can’t comment much on as I have limited experience with them (as far as return pumps) and others I have are ones that came with the tank and they function correctly.

Filters, if you do a sump, many build their own but there are many premade ones too. While I can’t give specific info, other than I’m not a fan of mine ( eshopps channel design sump - the design is terrible and very cramped) others can weigh in on other brands

JPM San Diego · Oct 8, 2021

Please don't rule out have fish right from the start. One issue you will (almost certainly) battle is algae. Nothing beats controlling algae better having than a few herbivorous fish. You'll hear or read a lot about having a clean up crew of snails, hermit crabs, urchins, etc. While I agree they eat algae, they are not big, hungry, high energy fish that chow down on algae. Look for YouTube instructional videos that describe having utilitarian fish. They virtually always start with the benefit of having herbivores.
Another piece of advice - find a mentor or reefing buddy, whose tank you want to emulate, and copy their equipment. There are many ways to skin a cat with this hobby. There is no benefit duplicating systems or equipment that accomplish the same task. And, it's expensive. Beginners often make the mistake of buying too much up front and then a year later having a storage bin of unused equipment.
You are obviously a seasoned aquarist. Why there are differences between fresh and saltwater system, there are many similarities too. Good with your experience. If something sounds too good to be true, or too fancy, it probably is.

Bubbalikesit · Oct 8, 2021

JPM San Diego said:
Please don't rule out have fish right from the start. One issue you will (almost certainly) battle is algae. Nothing beats controlling algae better having than a few herbivorous fish. You'll hear or read a lot about having a clean up crew of snails, hermit crabs, urchins, etc. While I agree they eat algae, they are not big, hungry, high energy fish that chow down on algae. Look for YouTube instructional videos that describe having utilitarian fish. They virtually always start with the benefit of having herbivores.
Another piece of advice - find a mentor or reefing buddy, whose tank you want to emulate, and copy their equipment. There are many ways to skin a cat with this hobby. There is no benefit duplicating systems or equipment that accomplish the same task. And, it's expensive. Beginners often make the mistake of buying too much up front and then a year later having a storage bin of unused equipment.
You are obviously a seasoned aquarist. Why there are differences between fresh and saltwater system, there are many similarities too. Good with your experience. If something sounds too good to be true, or too fancy, it probably is.

All solid advice. Kudos. Honestly, I was thinking of Salma Hayek as a "reefing" buddy. Seriously, the janitorial fish sound like a good idea, but are they strong enough to withstand a correction in the tank? Say I screw up the water a little, will they make it through that?

JPM San Diego · Oct 8, 2021

In my opinion the average fish is more tolerant of mistakes in water quality than corals, inverts, etc. Of course you need to cycle the tank and have everything in the ball park. I made the mistake of following advice from my LFS to add fish later and focus on corals first. Two years into my lush green hair algae farm I hired a consultant. He made several corrections to what I was doing, but number one was to obtain herbivorous fish. I did. It took a few months to correct two years of mistakes, but my tank looks great with little to no algae.

blaxsun · Oct 8, 2021

I like Sicce SDC for return pumps and Nyos for protein skimmers.

davidcalgary29 · Oct 9, 2021

I'd focus on your water quality before anything else. A top-notch refractometer is a must. Get a decent RO/DI system now, so you won't have regrets (and an emptier wallet) later. And an auto top-off system will help you regulate salinity levels.

The fanciest equipment in the world can't compensate for poor water quality with high amounts of dissolved solids, chemical impurities, or fluctuating salinity levels. And I once raised my salinity to 1.035 by using a refractometer built for alcohol, so feel free to see me as a cautionary tale.

Smite · Oct 9, 2021

Bubbalikesit said:
All solid advice. Kudos. Honestly, I was thinking of Salma Hayek as a "reefing" buddy. Seriously, the janitorial fish sound like a good idea, but are they strong enough to withstand a correction in the tank? Say I screw up the water a little, will they make it through that?

I know coming from freshwater the saltwater fish have reputation of being very finicky. They can be and parasites can be a little more challenging than freshwater but just about all the common saltwater fish are going to be much more forgiving then just about any coral when it comes to swings/mistakes. Plus corals really do better with a little fish waste/nutrients in the tank.

It sounds like you already understand patients is key so I'd say focus on a good cycle once you are up an running. That can take a few weeks to a month. So let that be your learning curve period, figuring out your equipment and developing a good schedule of testing parameters and observing fluctuations in the tank.

Once you have those all in check turn the lights on and once you see some algae growth add a clean up crew of snails ect. Once those fair well then start adding fish. In a 125g you'll be able to keep tangs but maybe hold off on adding them first as they are known to be aggressive to new fish. Start with hardy fish you like and maybe add a lawn mower blenny or starry blenny for a workhorse to assist the clean up crew.

Once stocked on a few fish and you've got a good routine down then I'd start adding coral in.

Equipment I wouldn't run a tank without.

A sump. Great on so many levels. Hides all the equipment and makes maintenance so much easier. It's also a safe harbor for things like copepods/amphipods.

Some form of ATO (Auto Top Off) to help with stability/evap. It doesn't have to be fancy. I gravity feed my top off water to a mechanical float valve in my sump. Works great and no pump failures.

Flow is always underrated by most I feel. I don't worry about turn over rates like i did in fresh water since your main filtration is in the display. I just make sure I have enough flow through the sump to maintain a constant temperature in the display. I'm talking lots of moving water in the display by way of power heads.

Skimmer, not just for water quality but for aeration and stabilizing ph.

Just a Wrasse. · Oct 9, 2021

Jekyl said:
I would also drill and add a sump.

Defiantly! For a tank that size.

Welcome to R2R!

Duncan62 · Oct 9, 2021

Bubbalikesit said:
After 16 years, our fish died. She was a giant freshwater Red Devil and mean as a snake. She'll be missed. We have a 125 gallon (473 liter) glass tank we'd like to convert to a saltwater reef tank. It's 42" X 20" X 36" (106 X 50 X 92 CM) and I'm going to cut the silicone and rebuild the tank. We had some black mold in the tank about 10 years ago and the fringes of the silicone are stained black. So, I decided I'll rebuild the tank and start fresh. My over encompassing question would be, "If you were starting over, what would you do?". I know that's an open ended question and I have been reading about saltwater tanks for the last few years. I gotta say, there are a lot of options. We haven't even decided that we'll have fish as of yet. I think getting past the learning curve of maintaining a saltwater aquarium and keeping a reef alive and flourishing should be our first task. We have time and don't need to rush anything. We have canister style filters (200 gal filtration each) and a big chiller (JBJ Arctica). We bought the new canisters and the chiller 3 years ago replacing our old equipment. Any ideas and or information would be appreciated. If you have any questions about something I left out, please feel free to ask. I thank you for your time.

Respectfully submitted.

You should also incorporate an algea scrubber into your system along with these other suggestions.

Discotu · Oct 9, 2021

blaxsun said:
Honestly, you may want to look into selling your existing tank setup and simply replacing it with a specific saltwater tank (either a custom or turnkey setup). Sometimes converting a freshwater tank ends up being cost prohibitive and just as much as a new system.

this. there a lot of good deals on "reef ready" tanks

snorklr · Oct 9, 2021

i kinda think of all the stuff you are gonna need to buy to upgrade to salt the tank itself may be the cheapest thing you'll need....so idk if i'd want to start this journey with a resealed 17 yr old tank...i think it will be a good home for somebody's boa...

Duncan62 · Apr 24, 2022

Bubbalikesit said:
After 16 years, our fish died. She was a giant freshwater Red Devil and mean as a snake. She'll be missed. We have a 125 gallon (473 liter) glass tank we'd like to convert to a saltwater reef tank. It's 42" X 20" X 36" (106 X 50 X 92 CM) and I'm going to cut the silicone and rebuild the tank. We had some black mold in the tank about 10 years ago and the fringes of the silicone are stained black. So, I decided I'll rebuild the tank and start fresh. My over encompassing question would be, "If you were starting over, what would you do?". I know that's an open ended question and I have been reading about saltwater tanks for the last few years. I gotta say, there are a lot of options. We haven't even decided that we'll have fish as of yet. I think getting past the learning curve of maintaining a saltwater aquarium and keeping a reef alive and flourishing should be our first task. We have time and don't need to rush anything. We have canister style filters (200 gal filtration each) and a big chiller (JBJ Arctica). We bought the new canisters and the chiller 3 years ago replacing our old equipment. Any ideas and or information would be appreciated. If you have any questions about something I left out, please feel free to ask. I thank you for your time.

Respectfully submitted.

YouTube if full of videos. Research the basics of saltwater chemistry. Keep equipment as simple as possible. Include a sump and algae scrubber if possible. I'll bet you'll do great. Thos canisters can be filled with live rock rubble or used for carbon or flow. Good luck!

Jon's Reef · Apr 24, 2022

Once the tank is cycled add some easy fish like a pair of clowns. Then simple corals (zoas, hammer, frogspawn, leathers). The fish feed the coral with their waste.

For hardware, this is what you will need:

Drill it and add an overflow. Something like this:

16″ Shadow Overflow V3

New Shadow V3 Overflow Kit – Just arrived!

synergyreef.com

Get a premade sump. The bigger the better. Top class would be the trigger platinum:

Platinum Sump 39

Trigger Systems has been testing its Platinum series for over a year and a half to make sure they have a solid, proven design. This series includes an automated, continuous mechanical filtration that replaces filter socks. Trigger has tested several different designs and found that having the...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

Protein skimmer there are many, but something in the $500-700 will be right. Reef octopus, Nyos are all good. Right now I would probably by an Ultra Reef.

Ultra Reef Akula UKS-180 Protein Skimmer

The Ultra Reef AKULA UKS protein skimmer is an essential addition to any aquarium. Compact and robust, the skimmer works quietly and efficiently to remove contaminants from your aquarium, leaving the water clean, clear and healthy for your marine life.To be installed in sump water level from...

www.aquariumspecialty.com

A controller is a great thing to have. Apex is easier to use, GHL is more technical with more robust hardware and Hydros is the new kid on the block. Personally I would recommend starting with an Apex starter set. The. As your needs grow add the dosing pumps (DOS) and auto tester (Trident):

Apex "WIFI" Aquarium Controller System - Neptune Systems

Free Shipping on Everything, Rewards, Free Swag, Price Matching & Free Returns.

www.saltwateraquarium.com

Get 2 titanium heaters with built in controllers. I like the Finnex ones, but there are several options. The built in controller will handle the thousands of on-off per day. Plug them into the apex control bar, but set the apex to some high temp (85 F) so it will turn it off if they get stuck on. Do not use the apex to do the routine control of the heater because the relay will eventually fail.

HMS Titanium Heater w/Digital Controller

The Finnex HMS heater is a modern digital heater with simple controls and design features that make it an excellent choice for heating your reef. The HMS heaters feature an integrated touchpad control interface and bright digital temperature display which mounts outside of the aquarium for quick...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

If you go with the Apex, they also make a nice return pump (COR 20). Other options would be the Sicce SDC 9 or Ecotech Vectra. The Sicce can also be controlled with Apex.

COR-20 Water Pump - Neptune Systems

www.aquacave.com

When you drill the tank for the overflow, also drill 2 return holes (upper left and upper right) 3/4” bulkheads are standard.

Bulkhead ABS Thread x Slip (Thread on the Flange/Head side)

Bulkheads are used to attach plumbing to aquariums and sumps to allow water to flow through them. These low profile reef safe bulkheads are made from black ABS plastic. Our supplier manufactures these slightly thicker than competitor aquarium bulkheads making them more reliable. Bulkheads come...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

Piping is typically done with schedule 40 PVC. It is available in a wide range of colors. For fittings, schedule 80 are normally used for the look. You will need. Gate valve on the primary drain. If you go with the synergy overflow, read up about bean animal drain design. You will never regret going larger on your plumbing. For the drains 1” is minimum. For the return, 1.25” off the pump the. Split down to the 3/4” bulkheads.

You will also need circulation pumps in the tank. I would suggest 2 vortech MP40.

VorTech MP40wQD QuietDrive Propeller Wave Pump - Ecotech Marine

Shop The Best Saltwater Aquarium Equipment & Supplies at Saltwater Aquarium. We Carry Everything you will Need for your Fish Tank.

www.saltwateraquarium.com

Lighting is another thing. Many options. I would go with either Radion G5 or Neptune Sky. Personally I would do 2 Sky as they integrate Well with the controller and have good coverage. If you want to add some of the sparkly look (shimmer) put a Kessil

SKY LED Aquarium Light

The Closest to The Sun You Can Get The SKY is a 200w LED aquarium light, with patented diffuser technology smoothly blending 104 LEDs to create a uniformly blended field of coral-health-optimized light. Taking a cue from nature, the specialized diffuser array mimics the filtering effect of our...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

Rock is either Marco dry rock or Caribsea. Marco rock is mined from old coral reefs in Florida, Caribsea is synthetic. You will need 100-150 lbs of rock. For sand go with Caribsea special grade. Start with 60-80 lbs of sand, going for a 1.5-2” depth.

Marco Rocks Reef Saver Premium Rock (50 lb) Box - Marco Rock

Shop The Best Saltwater Aquarium Equipment & Supplies at Saltwater Aquarium. We Carry Everything you will Need for your Fish Tank.

www.saltwateraquarium.com

https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petcostore/product/caribsea-arag-alive-special-grade-sand-20-lbs-3027321?cm_mmc=PSH%7CGGL%7CCAL%7CSBU05%7CSH14%7C0%7Ck5YkwaXJAT8j3ExfMwJMCF%7C58700007475444373%7CPRODUCT_GROUP%7C0%7C0%7Cpla-1649123237912%7C128269736559%7C15089577581&gbraid=0AAAAAD97F14-K61U11T2zkThQTlaVkOoH&gbraid=0AAAAAD97F14-K61U11T2zkThQTlaVkOoH&gclid=Cj0KCQjw6pOTBhCTARIsAHF23fJ9e5AkLTeYTkc9yc7kztzkI4qv18rvl2d-m_gA9qQCgbG8ZHksjvYaApMhEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

Testing wise the Hannah checkers are great. Get the salinity and alkalinity to start. Eventlso get a cheap kit to check the cycle (I like the API starter kit for this).

HI98319 Marine Salinity Tester

Designed for Simple Aquarium Salinity Testing Hanna Instruments HI98319 Marine Salinity Tester measures electrical conductivity (EC) to determine the salinity of natural and artificial seawater. Within seconds, the salinity and temperature are measured, and then using the temperature reading...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

HI772 Marine Alkalinity (dKH) Checker HC - Hanna Instruments

Shop The Best Saltwater Aquarium Equipment & Supplies at Saltwater Aquarium. We Carry Everything you will Need for your Fish Tank.

www.saltwateraquarium.com

Saltwater Master Test Kit (High Range pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate) - API

Shop The Best Saltwater Aquarium Equipment & Supplies at Saltwater Aquarium. We Carry Everything you will Need for your Fish Tank.

www.saltwateraquarium.com

For salt, many use Tropic Marin Pro Reef. They recently had problems with a new plant in Turkey, make sure the box is marked made in Germany.

Pro Reef Salt Mix

Pharmaceutical Grade Salt for the Modern Aquaria! Tropic Marin's Pro-Reef is the ideal foundation for any new tank from fish only to a full-blown reef tank. When used as your regular salt mix it will help bring better ionic equilibrium to the tank, stabilizing pH and allowing the proper balance...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

To cycle the tank, I like the Brightwell dry rock starter kit.