Spongexcel Dose for Dinos

[bvanfish]

I am dosing spongexcel in my battle with dinos. My question is for 25 gallons how much should I be dosing? I think that it is adding to the diatoms but I want a full blown diatom bloom. Do I need to get water glass? Thank you for the help!

 

[xabo]

May help.................

Silicate Dosing Supplements?

Hello all, I'm battling a dino outbreak. Some have said that dosing silicate to out compete the dinos is a valid method. As such, I've been trying to find a reef safe silicate solution to dose. I just purchased Brightwell Aquatics SpongExcel...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[bvanfish]

Thank you I’ve read through that one. I’m wondering since i don’t have water glass but do have spongeexcel if there is any dosing ideas for that. Randy goes over water glass not spongeexcel

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I do not know what exactly is in spongexcel, but here's my recipe for dosing silicate in general, which is a suitable dose here:

Silica In Reef Aquariums

Why would I recommend dosing silica? Largely because creatures in our tanks use it, the concentrations in our tanks (at least in mine) are below natural levels, and the sponges, mollusks, and diatoms may not be getting enough to thrive.

reefs.com

Silica Dosing Recommendations
Why would I recommend dosing silica? Largely because creatures in our tanks use it, the concentrations in our tanks (at least in mine) are below natural levels, and the sponges, mollusks, and diatoms may not be getting enough to thrive.


How much and what to dose?
I’d suggest dosing sodium silicate solution, as it is a readily soluble form of silica. It is very inexpensive. I initially used a high quality laboratory grade, but I’d expect the bulk grades sold to the world at large to be good enough (and I use it now). Remember, you aren’t dosing much, and the solutions available are very concentrated. You may find “water glass’ in certain stores because it is used by consumers for things like preserving eggs. Buying chemicals can be problematic for many people, however, and this hobby chemistry store 43 sells to individuals. Ten dollars (+ shipping) gets you enough to last 150 years of dosing with a 100-gallon tank, so cost is not an issue. I just ordered some from them myself and it came broken open, unfortunately. Some of you may have gotten Christmas presents that had ¾ of a gallon of sodium silicate solution coating them as they passed my package in the mail. Nevertheless, I
still have enough for several years!).

Many “water glass” or sodium silicate solutions are sold with the concentration indicated by “° Baume”. Degrees Baume is a measure of the specific gravity, and values in the 40’s are typical of these concentrated solutions.44 A concentration of 41° Baume equates to 29% SiO2 by weight. Note that the density is high (1.38 g/mL for 41° Baume), so volume measurements should take this into account. Maybe eventually, some of the hobby supplement manufacturers will provide a supplement.

Safety note: Sodium Silicate solution is very basic (high pH). In fact, the pH can be substantially higher than limewater, so it is very corrosive to tissue and to metal devices. Be careful to not spill it on yourself, wear some eye protection, and if you spill it on something metal, wash it. In all cases, extensive washing with water is recommended in case of spills or exposure.

Based on my dosing experience, aquarists are probably safe dosing the equivalent of 17 uM (1 ppm SiO2) once every 1-2 weeks. That is based on the fact that my tank used that much in less than 4 days without having any sort of “bad” reaction. Of course, there’s nothing wrong with starting at a tenth of that and ramping up. And, of course, if you do get too much in the way of diatoms, just back off on the dosing. I presume that all that I added to my tank went into various organisms that us it (sponges, diatoms, etc), but perhaps I have more sponges than other aquarists, and diatoms consequently may be more of a concern in some tanks than in mine.

I’d also advise occasionally checking the soluble silica concentration in the water, in case the demand in your tank is substantially less than mine. If the concentration started to rise above 50 uM (3 ppm SiO2), even in the absence of diatoms, I’d probably reduce the dose rate because that is close to the maximum concentration that surface seawater ever attains.

Here’s how to determine dosing amounts. I’ll assume that you want 17 uM (1 ppm SiO2) dosing, and you can scale from there. If the concentration of the supplement is 29% silica by weight (41° Baume), then it is 290,000 ppm silica. To get to 1 ppm silica, you then need to dilute by 290,000 fold. If you add 1.3 grams of this supplement (0.96 mL) to a tank with 100 gallons (378,500 mL), then the final concentration will be about 17 uM (1 ppm SiO2). I’d disperse the concentrated silicate solution into some fresh water before adding it to the tank, and then add it to a high flow area. Because the pH is high, you likely will see some cloudiness that is mostly magnesium hydroxide. The magnesium hydroxide will dissolve without a problem, but to be safe, add the supplement in a high flow area.

 

[xabo]

Thank you I’ve read through that one. I’m wondering since i don’t have water glass but do have spongeexcel if there is any dosing ideas for that. Randy goes over water glass not spongeexcel

just read the article. May have to give it a try.

 

[bvanfish]

It looks like brightwell spongeexcel is .2 ppm per drop per 1 us gallon of soluble silica.

so @Randy Holmes-Farley if I wanted to get it to 1 ppm (as you said is a good level) every 1-2 weeks I’d have to dose 125 drops for 25 gallons?

now can I dose that over a week or should I all at once?

 

[bvanfish]

@Randy Holmes-Farley does the above math work out correctly ?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Yes, and dose it all at once.

 

[k log(omega)]

did this work out for you? i’ve been using sponge excel as well because i have some on hand, wondering if i need to switch to water glass

 

[memo831]

@Randy Holmes-Farley does the above math work out correctly ?

Did this dosage worked for you? The 125 drops for every 25 gallons?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

When adding silicate to spur dinos, exact doses are not very important. They will use up whatever you provide. :)

 

[Mach42]

When adding silicate to spur dinos, exact doses are not very important. They will use up whatever you provide. :)

@Randy Holmes-Farley

Hi Randy, I'm doing the sodium silicate treatment for my dinos with Loudwolf 41%, which their site describes as "41% Sodium Silicate and 59% distilled water."

I ran some calculations using Google ai, and I wanted to make a stock solution of which I can add 1ml of stock solution per 10 gallons to get 1ppm.

It's been a long time since I took chemistry, so can you check the math that the AI used? Loudwolf did not mention degrees Baume, but instead I understand it as percentage by volume. So, I want to be sure that my thinking and Google's are working right.

The ai results were:

---

Based on common reef chemistry calculations for 1 ppm SiO2:

• A 29% sodium silicate solution requires approximately 0.96 mL per 100 gallons (or 1.3 grams per 100 gallons) to raise the level by 1 ppm SiO2.
• Since 41% sodium silicate is more concentrated, the volume needed is lower."

And thus...


"Using calculations that account for the greater concentration of a 41% solution:

Tank Volume	Dose to achieve ∼1 ppm SiO2
10 gallons	∼0.07 mL
50 gallons	∼0.35 mL
100 gallons	∼0.70 mL

To create 100 mL of a stock solution where 1 mL will raise 10 gallons of water by 1 ppm SiO2, you will need to mix the following:

Component	Volume
41% Sodium Silicate Solution	13.40 mL
RODI Water	86.60 mL
Total Stock Solution	100.00 mL

---

Thank you so much!

 

[Miami Reef]

@Randy Holmes-Farley

Hi Randy, I'm doing the sodium silicate treatment for my dinos with Loudwolf 41%, which their site describes as "41% Sodium Silicate and 59% distilled water."

I ran some calculations using Google ai, and I wanted to make a stock solution of which I can add 1ml of stock solution per 10 gallons to get 1ppm.

It's been a long time since I took chemistry, so can you check the math that the AI used? Loudwolf did not mention degrees Baume, but instead I understand it as percentage by volume. So, I want to be sure that my thinking and Google's are working right.

The ai results were:

---

Based on common reef chemistry calculations for 1 ppm SiO2:

• A 29% sodium silicate solution requires approximately 0.96 mL per 100 gallons (or 1.3 grams per 100 gallons) to raise the level by 1 ppm SiO2.
• Since 41% sodium silicate is more concentrated, the volume needed is lower."

And thus...


"Using calculations that account for the greater concentration of a 41% solution:

Tank Volume	Dose to achieve ∼1 ppm SiO2
10 gallons	∼0.07 mL
50 gallons	∼0.35 mL
100 gallons	∼0.70 mL

To create 100 mL of a stock solution where 1 mL will raise 10 gallons of water by 1 ppm SiO2, you will need to mix the following:

Component	Volume
41% Sodium Silicate Solution	13.40 mL
RODI Water	86.60 mL
Total Stock Solution	100.00 mL

---

Thank you so much!

The AI is incorrect.

Na2SIO2 is 106 g/mol and the SiO2 is 60 g/mol, so 60/106 x 100 = 56.6%.

Since we are using a 41% solution, the Loudwolf solution is 23.2% silicate by weight.

Mix 16.3 g sodium silicate in 100 mL. Each mL will raise 10 gallons (37.8 L) by 1 ppm silicate.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

FWIW, it must be percent by weight, not volume. Solids are never measured by volume percent.

 

[Mach42]

Thanks for clearing that up, Miami and Randy. You guys rock!