Sps and rox .8 carbon

Discussion in 'General SPS Discussion' started by bubbaque, Sep 29, 2017.

  1. bubbaque

    bubbaque Never enough SPS R2R Supporter Reef Tank 365 Build Thread Contributor

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    what are your thoughts on using this carbon with sps? I tied to use it about a year ago in a media reactor at half the recommended amount and after using it I got some some stn a couple of days later. I am wanting to use it again but am scared to use it.

    If your using have you ever ran into problems?
     
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  2. hybridazn

    hybridazn Acro killer..... Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter 3RMAS Member Photo of the Month Award R2R Excellence Award Showcase Editor Partner Member 2018 Build Thread Contributor

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    It's all I use on my systems. Run half the amount like you did but try slower flow thru the reactor.
     
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  3. bif24701

    bif24701 Valuable Member Build Thread Contributor

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    Only carbon I will use. Maybe you striped too much from the water? Maybe it was just something else.
     
  4. S-t-r-e-t-c-h

    S-t-r-e-t-c-h Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Reef Squad R2R Excellence Award

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    In my experience, unless you are really good about changing your reactor frequently, carbon can be an issue. It's actually quite remarkable how fast it will remove yellowing compounds from the water column and how drastically it impacts light transmission.

    I'm much more a fan of using carbon out of direct flow (like sitting a bag in the sump) so that any changes are slower and the corals can adjust better to what winds up being significantly clearer water.
     
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  5. jda

    jda Valuable Member

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    I use carbon every once in a while when I want to take photos or if I want to polish the water if I don't have time for a water change. I have never had any issues with anything. If your water is really yellow, then it can allow more light to penetrate - this is real, so watch out for it.

    Is .8 the really tiny stuff? If so, I hate it... it escapes from my reactor and drives me crazy. It is really effective, though. Unlike GFO, you DO NOT want carbon to tumble, so keep it tight.
     
  6. BoomCorals

    BoomCorals www.boomcorals.com R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor Toys For Kids Sponsor

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    Same experience. The .8 isn't what I'd call super tiny though i think, I never have it escape the reactor through the sponges BRS provides.
     
  7. BoomCorals

    BoomCorals www.boomcorals.com R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor Toys For Kids Sponsor

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    That said, there was an interesting article on carbon deposits on tangs when running carbon I had read recently, specifically in regards to HLLE.
     
  8. Ezeke1

    Ezeke1 Active Member R2R Supporter

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    It's interesting that you emphasized to not tumble carbon. May I ask why? I understand carbon does not need to tumble like GFO but I never heard that it can be harmful if you do.

    I've used .8 rox for over 2 years 24/7 and I've always tumbled it together with my gfo. So far I haven't seen side effects that I can tell.
     
  9. jda

    jda Valuable Member

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    I could not find that article about six month ago when I looked - it is like it disappeared, but all of the references to it still exist. If you have a link, I would REALLY love it store it. IMO, it was highly suspect. First, they used fish that NEARLY NOBODY keeps in their reefs - a kind of tang that is really fragile and susceptible to disease. Second, they would not tell anybody what they fed them, only that it was "high quality." I have no doubt that those fish got HLLE and that they ran carbon. There just did not appear to be solid causality. I also have seen hundreds, or more, of anecdotes from hobbyists that run carbon with no issues for decades - myself included. This article, to me, was even less useful than the ones that Riddle uses to talk about all corals in general based on Porites - I have had Porites thrive in my fuge under 75W incandescent light bulbs and have little idea beyond academics how this applies to other stuff in the real world that never would survive this.
     
  10. jda

    jda Valuable Member

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    I don't think that it is harmful. It is not effective. The GFO will bind as water goes by. The GAC needs water to pass through it so that it traps particles - you need to force the water through it. Carbon has some use passively, but active is many, many times better.

    The dust can be very harmful, but I don't think that it can grind to dust in water as it tumbles - I got this from a chemist in the chemistry forum... no idea if it is true, but I never cared since I don't tumble it.
     
  11. BoomCorals

    BoomCorals www.boomcorals.com R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor Toys For Kids Sponsor

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    If you let carbon tumble it does seem to grind itself down from what I've seen, granted this was observations of the carbon with the naked eye after letting it tumble through a bucket/water for a month. Not super scientific.
     
  12. BoomCorals

    BoomCorals www.boomcorals.com R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor Toys For Kids Sponsor

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    I was JUST looking for the article actually. The study was funded by the Toledo Zoo Foundation/Society. The articles below do indicate it was Acanthurus Bihianus or Ocean Surgeonfish (ocean tang).
    http://www.advancedaquarist.com/blo...ted-in-inducing-head-and-lateral-line-erosion

    http://www.advancedaquarist.com/blog/activated-carbon-affirmed-as-causative-agent-for-hlle-disease
     
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  13. BoomCorals

    BoomCorals www.boomcorals.com R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor Toys For Kids Sponsor

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  14. Scorpius

    Scorpius Valuable Member

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    Like any media run half the amount. rox.08 carbon is potent stuff. Slow and steady wins the race.
     
  15. jda

    jda Valuable Member

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    Thanks. None of those are the actual study that I was talking about. Those are side studies and references. There used to be a 10-ish page study with photos of the fish, the natural seawater facility, etc. It seems to have disappeared. They seemed to want peer review, which is commendable, but I so with that they could have just used some Yellow Tangs or other fish that are more suitable for captive life so that perhaps the largest variable could have been eliminated.
     
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  16. bif24701

    bif24701 Valuable Member Build Thread Contributor

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    The best reason for ROX .8 is the prevention of HLLE. It's harder and rinses cleaner faster. Since I have started using ROX never had any HLLE. ROX is the best.
     
  17. bif24701

    bif24701 Valuable Member Build Thread Contributor

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    I would strongly encourage you to discontinue tumbling the ROX. GFO is harder that carbon and can act like a grinder making tiny particles that may irritate things. Probably not dangerous, certainly not helpful.

    I mix my HC GFO with ROX in the reactor. 1 part GFO+ 2 part ROX. This prevents the GFO from clumping, sole reason for tumbling GFO, by keeping the GFO separated from its self.

    I have a dual reactor and use first chamber as prefilter with some poly fiber and keeps it from clogging. Then fill the second with the GFO:ROX mix. I keep it from tumbling with either a few sponges or poly fiber or just fill it to the top.

    I have a slow trickle going through the reactor for two reasons:

    First I don't want to strip the water too fast.

    Second is contact time. Slower flow allows better contact time and removes more efficiently. Also prevents premature clogging because moving less volume through the filter means it will pick up less particles. Remember carbon and GFO are removing molecules, very tiny things, let the skimmer and filter socks pick up the larger particles they just clog the carbon and prevent it from being the most efficient.

    Carbon is most effective the first few days and after a week or two I think that it's pretty much done all it will do as far as removing stuff. After that it just fills with a bacteria bio film and no longer filters out the intended stuff.
     
  18. Ezeke1

    Ezeke1 Active Member R2R Supporter

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    I mix rox and gfo by a ratio of 3:1 but not too much overall because the rox stuff is strong. Together they tumble in a Avast spyglass reactor thats medium size. If anything it appears the rox breaks down the gfo because in some nooks and crannies of my rockwork accumulates a light brown detritus thats the same color as gfo. I assume this comes from the gfo which I will typically siphon out.

    Although I haven't seen any side effects to speak off I do have about five tangs. They're all as old as my 2 yr tank and none have HLLE because I try to give them a good diet.

    I think I will try using the rox in a filter bag and see if that changes anything.
     
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  19. bif24701

    bif24701 Valuable Member Build Thread Contributor

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    Why not keep the reactor and just prevent the tumbling? IMHO that is the best implementation.
     
  20. Falcon53

    Falcon53 Member

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    I tried using it in my filter sock and it turned my water completely black - after rinsing it first. I also don't have a ton of flow going into the drain. I wouldn't replicate that!

    Now I just use it in a BRS reactor and it's great.
     
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